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Circle of healing likely needs a complete overhaul
Now that we know what type of boon perks BHVR wants due to boon: dark theory, and what the counterplay to boons should be, we can see how circle of healing throws a wrench in the whole thing.
The counterplay to boons is (obviously) hearing when the boon gets placed, seeing where the boon may be based on survivor locations, hearing the chimes when near it, and then snuffing out the totem.
This is where Circle screws everything up. Every other boon in the game requires the killer to be nearby to get value from, circle of healing is the ONE boon perk that works even if the killer is on the opposite end of the map. Most likely, the killer will never hear the boon because good survivors will know to lead the killer away from it.
In order for CoH to be even remotely fair and balanced it either:
- Needs a condition to only work when the killer is nearby (how that would make sense I do not know)
- Or the effect itself is insignificant enough that the killer doesn't care that it's up (which currently, giving the entire team free medkits is borderline gamebreaking)
- Or finally, the perk needs a complete overhaul to be either completely different, or have vastly different mechanics.
The easy/least effort needed way to fix it is by making the effect much weaker than it is now. Probably by removing the ability to self care entirely or make the self care time the normal time of 32 seconds.
As for the other methods of reworking it, I have no clue what that would look like.
I know circle of healing was likely released due to Mikaela being a solo survivor DLC and there needed to be a reason to buy it (much similar to what happened with Ash and Mettle of man), but it's seriously one of the things ruining matches right now for most people and needs major changes fast. Especially because low tier killers feel absolutely AWFUL to play with 1 active in the match.
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Well if you make it 32 seconds then why run COH when you can just run SH? It just needs a rework tbh. I like the concept its just too broken. Maybe it should be changed to something like after putting it down the next time you're injured and not in a chase it heals you over 32 seconds then snuffs itself.
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Nah it's too late, and I would not waste your breath. Nurse/Blight/Plague and 1 shot meta is here to stay, until the next round of broken perks changes it.
Any lower tier killers can get by via hard tunneling at 5 gens for the 2k.
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Yeah, you're right. It does need a full overhaul.
Best way I can think is to put charges on the perk just like a Med kit. Re-blessing a different totem still draws from the same charges pool, since it's on the perk, not on the totem. Any time a survivor is healed within the perk, it drains charges. When they self-cares, it removes charges at twice the speed. When all charges are gone, the totem turns off and your perk is disabled.
I'd say a reasonable number of charges would be 8. That gives your team 4 Self-Cares.
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Nerfing the self heal time to 32 seconds though would wreck the perk. People already complain about others healing with self care constantly, imagine multiple people running off to a boon totem to heal for 32 seconds in some corner.
They will definitely need to nerf the perk to 50% bonus healing speed, and then we can see. Maybe it will still be too much, or maybe the boon mechanic needs to be looked at as well. I don't really know. I do personally believe it can be nerfed sufficiently by just decreasing the healing speed bonus though. At the very least if it was 33%, which would just be Botany Knowledge but for everyone, the perk wouldn't be problematic anymore. Though it would likely be too weak at that point.
I am positive that the often suggested idea to not be able to relight boon totems would also destroy those perks as well.
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Honestly I’d just rework it entirely. One thing many overlook is how it invalidates most other healing perks. Why use botany, Autodidact, we’ll make it or desperate measures when I could use COH instead?
It’s just terribly designed
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Those all have their unique places, don't require 14 second setup, can't be snuffed, nor are limited to a specific radius.
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Honestly them nerfing the whole concept of boons would be the easiest solution. It would be more fair if they keep boons strong, but for those that own the perk. So that way the only user can get the benefit, not the whole squad.
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I feel like a decent change to this Perk would allow 2 or 3 heals from any survivor using the boon before the boon turns itself off and has to be placed again.
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Nerf it to the ground, at least to the point where it's effects can be offset with perks/add-ons.
Especially if they are going to introduce killers like Sakado who are clearly designed for hit and run, which CoH pretty much made non-viable.
Or make boons permanently breakable, introduce a perk or mechanic that allows killers to see boons, or something. The recent nerf was not nearly enough to make it fair.
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See this issue with this as a COH user is Killers complain a ton now about just one boon in the game now imagine right if 4 survivors ran COH with your change do you understand how the mald people already have for it now would be 10x worse also the Killer having to hunt 4 totems is a little insane ngl I think it's fine the way it is should be toned down or like someone suggested on another post make it so Killers can bring a hex back if they find a boon totem make it an interesting minigame vs survivor and killer with boon and hexes.
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It's either that or boons are probably going to get nerfed into the ground since everyone is complaining about them...
I rather boons stay strong, even if I'm only getting the benefits. Plus every perk in this game only applies to one's self. So it's the fair thing to do. One could still build a healing build around circle of healing since the owner would be able to heal others quick. And since there is 5 totems everyone can out their own.
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likely needs an overhaul or definitely needs an overhaul?
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No since even if the 4 survivors bring a totem they would have set it up and go to their boon. So it's not like how it is now since one survivor can bring circle of healing, and boom upgraded self-heal for everyone. The whole squad has unlimited heals. And not only that survivors would have let go of another perk in their builds. So it's a net positive in my book. Since it's more than likely certain boons are going to get nerfed into useless territory. That way boons can stay strong.
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Yeah, that’s the thing. If COH didn’t exist, boons wouldn’t be a problem really.
If the killer isn’t near dark theory, the killer doesn’t care about it.
If the killer doesn’t slug in or near exponential, the killer doesn’t care about it, unless he slugs for so long that the survivor could crawl to it. If they do slug near it they just put the totem out.
If the killer isn’t near shadow step they might miss out on an aura from across the map or not see scratch marks from further away. Good effect, but not broken.
If the killer isn’t near COH, survivors heal across the map very quickly and maintaining pressure is that much more difficult, and the healing speed is increased by so much that it + the ability to selfcare becomes broken.
I’ve been saying this, but you can’t fix COH with numbers-only tweaks unless you completely nerf it into the ground to the point that it sucks.
You could change the general boon mechanics to balance COH but then you’d have to adjust all the other boon perks too to prevent them from being too weak. I’d rather just nerf/rework COH.
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I think they could try a couple of different things.
1. Make it weaker over time. It starts out at the healing speed it is now and every time a survivor heals in its radius after that it takes longer and longer.
2. Whichever totem the survivor chooses the first time is the only totem that survivor can boon. They can boon that totem infinitely but If the killer snuffs it out and someone else breaks it, its now unusable. They could give it like a yellow aura or something to show it belongs to a survivor.
This way it would stack well with the 1st point and a survivor couldnt keep swapping totem placement to make the healing effects short again.
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Or make CoH exhausitble, with a set amount of healing for each trial, to be split between survs, and when that well is empty, the CoH perks are deactivated.
Or just let the killer permanently break bones like survs can.
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It should be a complete rework, even with a name change probably. Fundamentally a poor concept.
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With the amount of complaining, this perk is about to be in the same category as mettle of man
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Well it's busted, and I think this new killer is going to highlight just how fundamentally busted it is.
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I just think it needs a 60 maybe 70 second cool down after snuff. But making it the same speed as self care? Self care is already a killer perk so. And people hate when you bring it
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I've said this time and time again, Circle of Healing doesn't need an overhaul
Healing in general does
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Could you please explain further what you mean by that? I genuinely hope you don't mean further nerfing.
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Further nerfing? You're acting as if healing has gotten tones of nerfs down the line, its only gotten 1 nerf and that was increasing it from 12 to 16 seconds.
What I would do is increase the amount of charges for each consecutive heal, first heal is your standard 16 charges, second is 18 charges, third is 20 and it caps at that. You still heal at 1c/s.
This way you not only nerf healing but med kits as well which have been one of the most dominant items for a long time.
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Exponential doesn't require the killer to be near to work actually so..... boons have nothing to do with killer proximity
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CoH needs a rework, if it's made any weaker then there'll be almost no point in using it in solo games. May as well just use inner strength or selfish care.
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Boon is okay, but Coh should be removed.
More future Boon perk will be related to helping in chase, which ShadowStep & DarkTheory. As I always said one day Boon Vigil will be a thing. But at least it requires 2 Boon perks to helping in chase, and its easily snuffed because you have to be in contact with Killer near the Boon.
Coh stand alone remove the whole hit-run play style, which is a healthy play style.
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It still has very much to do with killer proximity most of the time. If a survivor picks themselves up with expo, it's usually because they either got slugged in the totem's radius or near it, which (generally) means the killer was at least somewhat near the totem at some point and didn't snuff it (or didn't know it was nearby).
Now obviously if you slug a survivor that's further away from it for a super long time they could crawl to it and recover but that doesn't happen very often since crawling speed is so slow + at that point someone else might be helping them anyways.
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The perk doesn't need such a high % when it's providing a benefit for the entire team.
I'd still use it over selfcare at 25% because of the team utility. Teamwork would still be faster and it's accessible for solo use.
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You see med kits because the other items are junk. Keys are useless without addons, and even with them they're still meh. Toolboxes got gutted. Rainbow maps are okay. Flashlights are fine, but can easily be a benefit to the killer. The only actually good item left are medkits.
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I appreciate this good idea.
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Neither, cause the perk is fine.
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I play plague. Until nurse is back that is. Counters the CoH meta pretty damn good. Occasionally I play spirit, but that feels almost unfair.
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Why does bonus heal speed matter when the problem is the self healing aspect of it?
It needs to be self care speeds for the advantage it provides. Being able to heal yourself obliterates killer pressure and does not slow generators down.
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Good. This perk shouldn't even exist. it is a disastrous mistake that the devs need to own and apologise for.
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I think the amount of pressure that CoH can bring with almost no downsides whatsoever is so stupid. Every other boon is really balanced because the effect is a good buff that can indirectly affect something (like Shadowstep). If snuffing boons had a bigger effect (like a 80 or 120 second cooldown), it would only feel fair for CoH, but all the other boons would feel terrible to use because the effect is significantly smaller than CoH. I personally think the healing buff should only be 50% and when a totem is snuffed, have a significant cooldown, but on CoH make the cooldown 2x longer, or 3x longer because the amount of time that CoH can give the survivor team if the killer is trying to use hit and run is probably even more time than Hex: Ruin can.
But a better solution is to make a competitive mode or remove SBMM! At this point, I don't care if it splits the player base, I'd rather play a more unbalanced game and have fun than an extremely balanced game that feels like a chore to do.
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The only way I see boons being fair is if the killer can break a booned totem, and allow hexes and boons the ability to be on the same totem.
Think about it, if the killer can break a totem that has a boon on it, that will mean that BOTH sides will have a max of 5 totems. Also giving hexes and boons the ability to co exist will bring up an interesting gameplay dilemma. If a killer has a hex, the survivors has the choice of "I can boon this hex, but that means the killer can keep their hex, or I can break the hex and boon another totem." Same applies to killer "I can break this totem, but that'd break my hex as well. I could leave it, but that means the survivors keep their boon"
The fact that this isn't a thing is astonishing because it makes a lot more sense and opens up more interesting gameplay choices.
Side not: A killer breaking a boon totem will not let them get pentimento stacks for obvious reasons, but haunted grounds could still activate since the killer can only break totems with boons on them, and if they happen to boon haunted ground, then rip for the survivors.
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I'd just rework the whole consept of boons where you can just relight the totems infinite times to eather token based or that 1 totem can be booned once.
I'm not sure who in their right mind came up with the idea that hey...boons can just be spammed while hexes cannot.
How many of us as a killer havent snuffed the same goddamn boon 3-4 times in a match? i surely have. Maps like the game and RPD boons are completely broken.
Simple answer is to make them not be spammable. I'd say if they make it so 1 totem can be blessed once and 5 boons per match isnt enough for survivors then i dont know what to tell you. Also this would make survivors actually look for the totems and not just spam the boon on one over and over and over again.
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Honestly, in my eyes, the main problem is that survivors can boon an infinite times. Take away this aspect and while the effects may still be strong, now there is at least some high risk/reward. You know... The same mentality applied to killers and hexes. Survivors still get to choose where they boon and as a result can always boon in places that are inconvenient for the killer.
In other words, even with this change, I feel like boons have a lot going for them. But now there's some actual counterplay and strategic decisionmaking involved from both sides.
- where do I boon? Do I want to boon now? Should get rid of the boon now, or is it not worth?
Isn't this the game dynamic the devs are going for anyways? Strategic and interactive?
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The easy/least effort needed way to fix it is by making the effect much weaker than it is now. Probably by removing the ability to self care entirely or make the self care time the normal time of 32 seconds.
hell no man, why tf would anyone run CoH then? that'll be a perk that will throw the game if u got teammates constantly self caring for 32 seconds.
just give it a damn cooldown and it'll be fine, no need to nerf this perk to obscurity. hit and run playstyle by the killers is annoying as ######### if the gen is in a deadzone and CoH is needed to counter 3 gen strats, or at least shorten the match duration if the killer decides to camp the last three gens.
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Boons should only be useful when the killer is nearby and can potentially snuff out the boon totem. I'd rework the perk entirely, maybe to something that doubles the length of pallet stuns.
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This isn't even a bad idea. I mean it could work like "Second Wind" that you get healed over time but only if you're in the area of that boon.
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Because it would still give the +75% speed to healing others and teammates can self care even if they don't have it.
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I hate it even more than old mettle tbh.
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CoH needs to be removed, lmao. It's bad from conception, no numbers change will ever matter.
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I think CoH is perfectly fine (from a killers perspective)
Sometimes when I find it I let it be instead of snuffing it, this way I know where the survivors (often) will run off to if they need to heal, which is helpful for finding the survivor again if they win a chase.
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What I would do is the following:
Circle of Healing provides a 50% speed boost to all healing done without medkits. (So altruistic healing is 12 seconds, self-caring is 24 seconds).
Self-Care must be run in order to get the faster self-heals, the opportunity costs would be higher.
This still gives it the benefit of a "medkit for the group" but it doesn't let you dual-wield medkits and doesn't invalidate Self-Care.
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