When you create a game that's miserable for survivors you lose players
When you constantly buff killers and nerf survivors,
keep making new killers that are anti loop,
making perks that block all generators,
create maps that are just straight hallways,
keep incentivizing tunneling and camping,
rarely change any survivor perks in a stale meta,
Somehow make holding W meta,
don't fix window and pallet vaults,
making basic functions not work (spamming space bar 5 times and nothing happening),
slowing down generator speeds,
you lose players.
Comments
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Lmao, get your windows broken and gen speeds slowed.
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Keep losing players. This community is going to kill this game
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We can spare losing a few survivors.
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Have Survivors gotten any meaningful nerfs recently? The last one I remember was the Hatch nerf which was a fair nerf.
If you want to talk about nerfs, look at what CoH did to every Hit N Run Killer, 3 genning and playing "fairly", no tunneling and camping. It deleted all of those
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I would love to live in the world you live in where killers are actually getting buffed.
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Well the gen speed nerf was a huge one. It's also that pretty much every time a survivor perk comes out that people freak out about it gets immediately demolished like Boil Over. Pretty much nobody uses CoH anymore because it was never that good to begin with. Everybody just spent 16 seconds blessing totems only for them to be destroyed instantly. Just bring a med-kit, those have existed since the game came out.
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Yeah ok. If you think they're lies then just move along then. There's no convincing you.
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"CoH was never good to begin with". You lost all your non-existant credibility with that one sentence. If you were any good at the game (Survivor or Killer) you'd actually know how busted that Perk was and remains to be after it's 2 second nerf.
The Boil Over nerf was so it can't be abuseable anymore, why was something abuseable a good thing?
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I play as both and don't use it as survivor and barely notice it as killer. Literally just do bones. Boil Over was abuseable in a few spots and they could have just put hooks in those places... They didn't have to nuke the entire perk over a lack of a few hooks that could have been placed, problem solved.
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Then no worries, game will be cakewalk for any good survivors and it will stays like that for eternity.
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"pretty well known" by forum members who you just claimed is filled with killer mains. Just talk to Otz or Ohtofu about how the game is in no way survivor sided and even teeters towards killer. In no way is what most forum members say reflected in-game and I think most people are just biased.
Post edited by Rizzo on4 -
Both knows pub matches aren't as survivor sided, but both of those guys gets destroyed easily by some decent survivors.
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They didn't nuke it, the Perk wasn't good even after the buff, it was just abuseable. Now it's not abuseable anymore and about ont he same level strength wise.
Killers can't do bones. They can snuff, which is a waste of time if Survivors are smart and place the Boon properly, usually on the opposite side of the map from the Killer.
Your complaints are due you not being that good or getting really bad opponents. Everything you complained about is a skill issue
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And I mean, what's the deal with losing survivors?
We have more than enough survivors already, I don't get why we have to care about losing survivors.
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In that case any problems you have with killer is a skill issue. Sorry but I just know it's a skill issue and you can't actually complain about them. So I better not see you ever complain about any issues with killer.
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You need a healthy population which is 4 survivors for every 1 killer. Queue times are already bad enough as survivor and if more stop playing well then it will just be a snowball of a loss of population. If you're claiming that you don't care about the game losing players that's fine lmao, I see where your priorities are at.
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No good killer players can actually have a chance with most killers in plenty of maps against good survivors team, hardly to call "skill issue".
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It is actually the truth. Killer players hate to admit it, but we are a minority. If 4 people out of 5 are having a good time, that is better that 1 out of 5 from a profit standpoint.
Obviously it does not need to be that way, and all 5 should be having fun, I just feel they try to keep things a bit more survivor sided to not accidentally rock the boat whereas killer mains are easily replaceable from chapter to chapter when they add lit certified Gs such as Sadako.
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Survivor having long queue times means there aren't enough killers not survivors.
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Which is why none of this has happened.
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OK, let's go 1 by 1
When you constantly buff killers and nerf survivors,
Killers haven't gotten a buff in a while, the last overall Killer buff was the Hatch nerf
making perks that block all generators,
Dead Man's Switch is easily counterable, even with Scourge Hook: Pain Resonance. Let go off the gen before someone gets hooked, then get back on it
create maps that are just straight hallways,
RPD is one of the worst Killer maps in the game, aside from stealth Killers, who are already bad
keep incentivizing tunneling and camping,
I wonder why, maybe because playing "fair" isn't viable and loses games
rarely change any survivor perks in a stale meta,
True, meta Perks rarely get changed, they usually get a 2 second nerf or they get buffed
Somehow make holding W meta,
Yes, ShiftW is meta
don't fix window and pallet vaults,
Window and Pallet vaults are fine, if you're having problems, it's probably a ping issue
making basic functions not work (spamming space bar 5 times and nothing happening),
Why would you ever need to spam space bar 5 times?
slowing down generator speeds,
Gens have taken 80 second to finish for a while now don't know what you're talking about
As you can see, most of these are other you playing subpar, or you not having that much game knowledge
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Pretty well known by people who play the bloody game dude, look, you're not gonna 4k with Nemesis against a coordinated SWF unless they throw. The problem with your assertions is that you say "killers" as though all killers have the game teetered to them which is factually false, so please properly define what you're saying.
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That's a valid point and I somewhat agree with it. What really annoys me is that the game truly was very survivor sided back in the day but people didn't seem to care as much. Yeah a lot of people complained as they should but killers have gotten a TON of stuff to help them out since then and it seems like the complaining has gotten even worse. I just wish more people realized how bad they really had it and how much progress has been made. I believe it's been over-corrected but if you don't think it's gone that far yet it very well might one day.
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I wonder where people get an idea of "survivor que times bad so we need more survivors"...?
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If complaint made game better, we should have more complaint, thoughts?
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When did they slowdown gens?
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There is a really simple solution to this complaint... play killer!
If you feel killers are over buffed and its no fun/boring to play survivor then... play killer.
I don't get why people don't play both sides, you paid for the game why commit to only 50% of it?
Look at all the its killer sided/ its survivor sided, tit-for-tat bias posts in just this thread alone, let alone the forums as a whole.
My advice is play both sides you dumbasses.
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So, do you want old survivor perks how they used to be? Being able to heal with self care before killer could hit you again?
Anti loop and killers with movement speed are going to be top tier because SBMM makes it miserable to play against survivors who are able to do everything at once. If you can't get weak survivor to get a quick kill, Then yeah, buff killers. It's not like killers can insta down survivors without working towards that ability.
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Ok let's debunk all of this.
When you constantly buff killers and nerf survivors,
Look at every single killer add-on that gets buffed every update. Recently Nemesis got a really strong one.
making perks that block all generators,
It is hardly counterable if you're going against a killer who it's specifically great for like Doctor or Artist. Artist is completely busted right now and it's ridiculous.
create maps that are just straight hallways,
There's like one good loop on RPD granted it's a god loop. It also just got buffed for killers by adding 2 hooks that can be completely blocked by a killer and are unsaveable.
keep incentivizing tunneling and camping,
Tunneling and camping is just extremely unfun to go against. It's not that it's too OP or anything it's just not fun in the slightest dying on first hook or basically being disabled from playing the game by a killer.
rarely change any survivor perks in a stale meta,
We agree on this.
Somehow make holding W meta,
Agree.
don't fix window and pallet vaults,
I get 30 ping every game. Pallet drops and stuns are fine because they got fixed but they have not fixed vaults yet and that's been confirmed by devs. It's still objectively killer sided because whatever happens on the killer's screen is law. Vaults are not server sided like pallet stuns.
making basic functions not work (spamming space bar 5 times and nothing happening),
Sometimes actions just don't work even though you press the button as many times as you want. You can also be halfway through a vault and something can block you and cancel your action. Button presses are literally suggestions lol, they aren't actual actions you can perform.
slowing down generator speeds,
A while ago (maybe a year, I don't remember) they slowed down gen speeds when you're working on them with multiple people. It used to be a 1:1 ratio where 1 person = 80 seconds and 2 people = 40 seconds but they changed it so that there's diminishing returns. Now 2 people = 45 - 50 seconds and 3 people = 40 seconds, etc.
I'm not surprised you missed almost all of this. There's a lot of changes to the game that you just aren't familiar with and I get that, just don't come after me when you don't know what you're talking about.
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There is a time and place for everything. One survivor game a day is not too bad. But I didn't pay for this game so that I could torture myself. In fact, I didn't pay for it at all. And the only money I ever spent for a survivor was Nancy and her pimp Rose Cardigan, ya dig?
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I play killer sometimes I just enjoy survivor gameplay more. All I want is a balanced game and we're allowed to have discussions about the balance.
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I presume you saw the CoconutRTS video today where he detailed the drop in the player base over the last several months. Or if you claim you're unaware of that video, then you must be simply coincidentally looking at the Steam charts which -- gasp! -- do not distinguish between survivor players and killer players in who plays the game (or those who play both), making your claim sketchy, at least in any ability to back up your opening statement with any real facts to support it.
I can definitely presume you're missed the part where, whether you looked at the Steam charts or watched the above said video, the one thing that DOES tie in to any drop in the player base is the introduction of SBMM, not any of the things you claim. Inconvenient for your claims, but that's a conclusion that makes far more sense than whatever you're claiming here.
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No what I believe is the reason for the player drops is the last year of just anti loop killers. I don't believe that MMR is the cause for players leaving because it's proven to be better than the last garbage ranking system. Also what makes a lot of sense is that the playerbase drops after every single October until around April and that's because it's a horror game where a ton of casual players just want to play a spooky game with their friends around Halloween time and then drop it, it happens every year. There are objectively more survivor players than killer players so it makes sense that there would be a sharper decrease in players because survivors are leaving, they're sick of not being able to play the game because of only new anti loop killers.
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And we still have too many survivors that skews matchmaking, seems like survivors leaving is more or less healthier for the game.
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Yeah but you can count the number of constructive discussions on one hand, most times its just sore losers ranting and accusing each other of bias, toxicity, entitlement etc etc. Heck its an online forum let the masses loose, it just always amuses me when people publicly display their ignorance or stupidity and then get all uppity when someone says hey that's kinda stupid. But that's the vitriolic mix of anonymity and ego that make up the online world. Previously you had to look stupid in public and confrontation was direct but those days are over thanks to online forums.
You are never going to have balance in this set up, what you are going to get is oscillating swings between survivor and killer as perks/mechanics get introduced or changed. If folks are running around saying "killer isn't fun" then play some survivor and vice versa.
I play way more killer than survivor, very few games let you be the bad guy so its fun to play antagonist. I'm not a fan a number of new changes and mechanics but I'll give my feedback, attenuate my expectations and finally realize its only a game and in the grand scheme of things it doesn't matter.
Thicc I dig, I've usually only got a few survivor games in me before I get bored of it and go back to killer too. I've definitely sunk less cost into survivor. Kudos getting the game for free but time investment is another sunk cost might as well play both sides if you are gonna sink the time. Switching it up can keep the game fresh especially when you start having that, "man it sucks to play X" feeling.
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You are wrong about gens, they have always done that since the start as stated by the devs, all they did was make it a red bar so people knew about it, it was never a 1:1 ratio
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I don't really get why people keep playing solo survivors if it's miserable as ######### and takes extremely long to que up, just play killer, it's not that hard right?
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Lmao ######### truth.
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No... in April 2020 they changed it.
They also made every map smaller.
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So wait -- now it's the anti-loop killers? And not all of the other tripe in your initial post? But wait, it's also because it's a seasonal game, and EVERY year there's drops in these months due to DBD being a "horror" game, which would make your entire reasoning off to begin with? (As if horror fans only want to play a horror game around October -- I'm a horror movie fan and watch them year-round, lol. My enjoyment of them doesn't magically curtail itself during months that don't start in "O". Seasonal difference due to weather, school and work schedules, and even the COVID-19 impact on people do impact who's doing what at any given time, but the "spooky game around Halloween" hypothesis is just plain silly.)
You're using supposition to make your argument. So am I, in a way, but what makes more sense: Hypothetically, all of these "survivor" players, that you can't factually quantify, are quitting over game mechanics, which also can't quantify, and other reasons that you can't quantify -- or that players in general are quitting over a SBMM system that was introduced at the time that a clear drop in players can be seen since that introduction, and a system which at this point, has incredibly few proponents who aren't collecting a paycheck from BHVR?
If we're throwing darts at a board without actual real evidence and trying to hit on a correct assessment, one of those hypothesis statements above at least has SOMEWHAT of a data trend (and the timing of something that was added to the game) to have it make real sense, and the other doesn't, so if I had to put money on either being true, I know which one I'd be betting on.
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They changed it from a 10% to a 15% reduction, not from a 1:1, and also gave survivors a perk to counter the reduction.
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No I'm saying there are way better reasons than MMR. I was listing all of the other reasons that make way more sense and it could be a mix of all of them, really.
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They didn't give survivors a perk to counter it, one already existed.
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As far as the window and pallet vaults go, just keep these two thing in mind: Even though you cleared a window with a gap behind you while you’re in the air, your feet need to be touching the ground to avoid a hit. For pallets, you need to be on the opposite end of the pallet to avoid a hit- you can’t be sliding in the middle (although the killer’s weapon can’t reach the middle). They both look stupid IMO, but without the hits working that way- it would be much harder for killers to get survivors. So I get it. Vaults are like Huntresses hatchets- they can be fine tuned to be precise but then she would barely hit any one.
And to the tech nerds yea I know hitboxes, blah blah, servers, hit validation, yada, yada, yada- I get that too. Just helping OP accept it from a visual standpoint.
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I'm sorry, but after you claimed that Nemesis's recent addon-changes were a big buff you lost all credibility. One of his only actually good addons got nerfed and the ones they buffed are in the "garbage" category.
Let me know when you rejoin reality and we can talk.
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What gen speed nerf? You mean the one from over a year ago where they made it take you slightly longer to repair a gen if you were working on it with more than one survivor?
Also, I'm not sure what you're on about... CoH is literally meta... And why shouldn't it be? It's a free 5th perk slot for all other survivors and allows you to be healed at all times (which deminishes most of the pressure a killer can create by injuring survivors alone). Like... Disagreeing with people is one thing, but making stuff up to try and prove your point is just going to backfire on you...
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They already lost 99% of the Killers due to catering to Survivors.
Yet the second something Killer-beneficial comes along 'OMG! Survivors will quit! Stop catering to Killerz!'
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I mean how it is "alive" when a game takes 15minutes to que up.
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Name me one killer buff that was out of nowhere and made killer OP. You can't. But I can name like a hundred times that's happened for survivors. These past few years have felt like an endless series of killer nerfs with a few mediocre qol changes to balance it out. Nurse nerf, Hillbilly nerf, Pyramid Head nerf, Freddy nerf, Blight nerf, Demogorgon nerf, Trickster nerf, Spirit nerf, Twins nerf, Pig nerf, Ghost Face nerf, Wraith nerf, Deathslinger nerf, Pinhead nerf, Nemesis nerf, Clown nerf. But I keep hearing people say how killer-pandering it was when infinites were removed and entity blockers were added.
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Look at every single killer add-on that gets buffed every update. Recently Nemesis got a really strong one.
Nemesis got overall nerfed, his Ultra Rare Add-ons are still bad, and his best one, Marvin's Blood, got nerfed hard
It is hardly counterable if you're going against a killer who it's specifically great for like Doctor or Artist. Artist is completely busted right now and it's ridiculous.
Let go off the gen before someone gets hooked and stay off of it until the Doctor uses his Static Blast or the Artist fired her Dire Crows, once they've don't that, you can easily get back on the gen
There's like one good loop on RPD granted it's a god loop. It also just got buffed for killers by adding 2 hooks that can be completely blocked by a killer and are unsaveable.
It's not that is just has a god loop, the map is huge, 2 Red Forests stacked on top of each other. Protecting gens on that map is impossible. The 2 new Hooks spawns I will agree with, I have no idea how the devs managed to create those 2
Tunneling and camping is just extremely unfun to go against. It's not that it's too OP or anything it's just not fun in the slightest dying on first hook or basically being disabled from playing the game by a killer.
Exactly, it's not op, just unfun so it doesn't need changing
I get 30 ping every game. Pallet drops and stuns are fine because they got fixed but they have not fixed vaults yet and that's been confirmed by devs. It's still objectively killer sided because whatever happens on the killer's screen is law. Vaults are not server sided like pallet stuns.
They're not server-sided, true, but I never get hit through a Window where I'm like, "What the hell was that"
Sometimes actions just don't work even though you press the button as many times as you want. You can also be halfway through a vault and something can block you and cancel your action. Button presses are literally suggestions lol, they aren't actual actions you can perform.
Never had that happen
A while ago (maybe a year, I don't remember) they slowed down gen speeds when you're working on them with multiple people. It used to be a 1:1 ratio where 1 person = 80 seconds and 2 people = 40 seconds but they changed it so that there's diminishing returns. Now 2 people = 45 - 50 seconds and 3 people = 40 seconds, etc.
So, a change mad a year ago, in the patch 3.7.0, which made gens not go by in less than a minute when only 2 Survivors were on it, counts as a recent, unfair Survivor nerf?
So, most of these are still you being bad or not knowing how a Killer/Perk functions
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