If NOED was removed from the game

It depends. Noed is a luck based perk. Swf destroy totems and solos sometimes left after first down and see notofication is active. Is the surprise factor, the slug snowball potential, and the fact you can find all the dull/have time to do It that gave high risk high reward factor. Necessary evil, even if I hope all second chance get nerfed after devs fix basic issues of the game (tunnel, camp, genrush).

While I'm normally on the fence with NOED, I wouldn't be opposed to this suggestion at all. Having it work the same way as Rancor does and alert people when it's active would be a very suitable change IMO.

If you're relying on NOED to get 4Ks, you're probably in pretty low MMR.

It wouldn't result in much of a difference in terms of 4K, but changing it would completely gut endgame builds, so I'm against it.

It doesn't singlehandedly save the day if the killer only got two hooks all game... not unless your entire team throws themselves at the hook during the EGC, anyway, and in that case, it's your fault.

Leave NOED alone. It's only good for endgame builds (risky in the first place) and against bad survivors who throw them game because they figure there's no way they'll lose when five gens have been done.

Alerting survivors to its existence before a single hit would make NOED unusable. Incentivizing totem cleansing is a much better idea since there's currently no practical benefit to cleansing dull totems in order to prevent NOED. In many cases, survivors will memorize all the totems they have seen and immediately go cleanse NOED as soon as they realize you have it, so telling survivors that it exists the very second it arrives mean that killers wouldn't get kills running it most games, which isn't fair considering that you already have to use an entire perk slow for it.

Which is what survivors complaining about it want. They want it nerfed so hard that it's not functionally useful at all. They want it to be a waste of a perk slot even though it's already only good against people who play badly.

Alternatively, make it so that Undying doesn't activate until there's already a Hex totem on the field. That'll make dull totem cleansing more useful in general, protect NOED even if the game told you it exists as soon as it spawns, and then also serve as a soft nerf to NOED since it means you won't want to run other Hexes in the same buuild.

"Completely gut endgame builds" are some strong words.

Look at No Way Out. Its effects are minimal, but increase dramatically with everyone hooked at least once. I think everybody would agree that No Way Out is a perk that the killer earns. And, it's almost completely replaced the use of Remember Me (unless a killer is using both at once)

NoED could definitely have something like this, maybe the number of unique survivor hooks is the amount of Exposed hits you get, etc.

I understand that point. My point of view was that if they spend time looking for totems, that gives you more time to pressure a hook or gates. But it's RNG dependent isn't it? They could find the totem right away. The problem I have with your idea is that there would probably be a difference between how solos and SWF handle the totem cleansing. Maybe it would nerf SWF, but maybe it would just hurt solos more.

you would need to remove adrenaline if you removed NOED since they are meant to be counters of each other.

Endgame perks should be game changing strong. Since the killer is playing the whole match with 1 less perks.

I assume all the people that asked the killer to jump through hoops in order to earn NOED, also want survivors to earn Adrenaline.

Not just adrenaline iron will and deadhard are activated one getting injured which is the killer doing there job.

Don't survivors technically earn adrenaline by doing all the gens? The killer on the inverse earns noed...by all the gens being done? Kinda counterproductive since the goals not to let the gens be completed (hence the arguement noed rewards failure while adrenaline rewards you completing your objective)

I can't come to dead hards defense since i hate the perk. Hate it as survivor because it teaches bad gameplay. And hate it as killer because it inflates chasetime in a bs manner. DS personally i feel is one of those necessary evils especially with the current "tunnel 1 out=easier pressure later" meta. Ds now only exists to actually give tunnel killers something to worry about. Which even then most of them just eat the ds and chase them more anyway. So that's the only reason i defend ds even with it rewarding failure (which it does i won't deny that). Can you imagine the tunnel wave if ds was removed vs the amount of kills that would be lost by noeds removal? Id feel thered be a dramatic difference.

Don't use it apart from completing challenges.

What about if Dead hard was removed, how much do you think 4ks would increase?

You don´t have to touch a single gen in order to activate Adrenaline. So earning it, would mean that you have to personally complete like 2 gens if you want Adrenaline.

Sounds just as reasonable as wanting killers to earn NOED.

The same goes for Dead Hard. I say remove them both.

Killers already earn it by playing with 3 perks instead of 4 for an entire game.

I think if noed were to be removed, you will complain about something else.

if we had to earn noed then it would have to not be a hex perk anymore.

a lot every survivor uses it or that what it feel like.

not much, but 0k would increase dramatically. NOED is used by killers who are used to failing to not fail as much, rather than used to win