http://dbd.game/killswitch
Do You Think Nurse is Reason Other Killers are Weak?
Question on title but let me add info why i am asking this question:
BHVR changed their map style. They started make small maps (Saloon, Midwich) and then they back to big maps again (RPD, Eyrie and Coldwind Rework). Because Nurse is super strong on small maps (The Game, Midwich, Saloon)
BHVR is doing good perks but most killers have not good values from this perks. Starstruck was good designed perk but it has limits and so most killers are not using it except Nurse. Lethal would have longer aura reading but it can not? Because of Nurse. I can list more but i think i told point enough.
We need less safe and smaller maps, stronger perks for rest of killers but this changes will be buff for Nurse too. And i guess BHVR is not doing because of Nurse, they don't wanna make her broken.
So what do you think? Is Nurse reason of obstacle to the empowerment of the killers?
Comments
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Yes.
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In the way you're laying out, yes. Whether it's intentional or not, there are changes to perks and maps that would benefit every killer, and then benefit Nurse to an unfair and unbalanced degree.
It's why I personally support reworking Nurse- she isn't OP when you're facing her in a trial, but she has kind of a chokehold on balance for everything else.
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Yes absolutely.
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Nah. Look at a lot of perks that were released lately: call of brine, deadlock, pain resonance, dead man's switch rework They're all very strong already, I really doubt they would've been stronger if nurse didn't exist. Same for LP. The duration would be fine regardless of nurse, because it's supposed to give an idea of where survivors spawned and 9 seconds are way enough to bee line towards one of them.
RPD is just not suitable for a game like DBD. It's garbage under all points of view. Also, it's a 1:1 copy, so it wasn't "designed" by bhvr.
Eyrie of Crows might feel big, but it's not bigger than a lot of other maps. The problem is the same as per maps like Ormond: gens are scattered around a lot (and I guess there are many pallets).
Also you called The Game small. I don't think it's that small, because of the two.floors, and anyway it's a perfect example of how size doesn't matter ;))
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I thought about this for while. What killer needs?
- Small and less safe maps - Great buff for Nurse.
- Stronger perks - Great buff for Nurse.
- Dead Hard rework - Great buff for Nurse.
- CoH nerf - This would not affect Nurse, she does not care if you heal or not. She will get you down maybe 10 seconds longer.
- Generator nerfs - Great buff for Nurse.
- Totems spawns should change, survivors are finding them so easyly - Great buff for Nurse.
See? Except CoH, all of changes will make Nurse stronger. And she is already strongest killer in game without counterplay. Breaking LoS and Dead Hard is your only options and if they buff killers with this changes, game will be unplayable against Nurse. I think she was fine for 2016 - 2017 DbD while we had infinities. But not anymore. She should go with other bad designs (CoH, Dead Hard, big maps, God pallets etc.)
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Yes. Nurse and Blight are why other killers are weak. You can't really buff killers while you have those 2 powerhouses in the game.
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Btw remember how Dead Hard being finally bug fixed thanks to hit validation was called a buff?
Technically nurse's bugfixes from last mid chapter patch are actually a buff too then. Probably because of her lower kill rates
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Her Irri add-on buffed but yeah, bug fixes are not buff. But this does not mean she is healthy for game.
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Not so much that other killers are weak because of her, but it absolutely has an effect on perks.
RPD never should've been in the game to begin with. It wasn't designed for DBD and doesn't work well in DBD. Eyrie is just too big (and I know it's the same size as a lot of other maps, but I'd argue literally all of those maps are too big).
Nurse prevents some perks from being stronger imo because what might be fine on most killers would be busted on her. This is part of why I think a reasonable change to her is not counting her blink attacks as basic attacks, because quite frankly perks like MYC and starstruck are just busted on her and her alone, and are reasonably balanced for other killers. I don't really want to see Nurse reworked from the ground up and I think some smaller tweaks would be enough to mostly mitigate the issue; I don't mind that we have her as the one killer that gets to be different, but she absolutely has at least somewhat of a chokehold on balance in her current state.
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The other killers are not weak. Nurse just seems easy by someone with experience playing her. They are ALL overpowered. If anything, the others are too easy and way too overpowered. Look how easy Trickster is to play and down survivors. A new Nurse would never be able to do that.
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It was sarcasm
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Not just perks, i am sure she affect maps too. They can not make maps smaller and less safe because of her. Just look how she is broken on Midwich and Saloon.
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Sorry, i did not get it :(
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Nurse is broken when you get good with her. And plus, at low mmr all killers are baby and survivors too. They don't know what they are doing. We are talking for mid and high mmr and this Nurses are broken. And i disagree, killers are not op. So much killers are camping and tunnelling for pressure and kill.
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Nurse isnt the issue. Shes just the pinneacle of broken killer mechanics. Basically every mobility killer profits too much from small maps and perks like starstruck. Thats why each killer has to be looked at separate.
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Kinda, yeah.
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Not really.
Blight can not do this because Starstruck does not affect m2 hits. Billy does not need it because his m2 is already insta-hit. Who else?
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So strength comes from perks? We say some perks are broken on some killers, but don't we still have them? Have they been taken away? How would Starstruck be any more powerfull if Nurse wasn't in the killer roster?
People think Nurse ignores everything but at the same time think reworking maps would somehow benefit Nurse more than other killers. If she ignores everything on a map then any changes to maps are inconsequential to her. You could cut the pallet count by half and make loops smaller. How would that buff Nurse?
You know why killers are weak? Because everytime a strong killer comes along survivors scream to high heaven for nerfs. If it wasn't for Nurse, Blight would be the pariah holding back the other killers. Don't believe me? Look at the forum post during the three weeks Nurse was disabled.
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I just started playing nurse and i got RPD for the first time lol. I got wrecked, kept blinking downstairs when i didn't want to or upstairs. Either way they kicked the ######### out of me lol
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(Survivor+perks)x4 vs (killer+perks)
Yes, perks may be tweaked because certain killers benefit too much. But how does nurse's powelevel justify other killers weakness when theyre mutially exlusively encountered by survivors?
All killers should be at an even powerlevel. Sadly only survivors have their bottom planned to bebuffed to the 3rd party cheaters while killers get their top performers gutted (billy nurse spirit).
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I agree with @Tiufal, high mobility killers are a big reason all maps can't be reduced in size. High mobility killers are exponentially stronger on small maps compared to normal speed killers. Nurse, Blight, Spirit, Billy, Oni, etc all do much much better on small maps when compared to killers who move as normal speeds.
My own perception is that large maps balance how these high mobility killers, kill rates. I agree it's unfair for the slower killers but without nerfs to the high mobility killers, you can't reduce map sizes.
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Yep. Nurse is holding back a lot of perks/maps from actually being balanced
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It is not only because of Nurse, however, she is the most extreme example. If you want to make it clear: On one end you have Nurse, a Killer which would not be released like this anymore, a relict of the poor design decisions from the early days of DBD which is allowed to exist and on the other hand you have Trapper, a Killer who needs to pick up his power from the ground.
How do you want to make general Killer Buffs with Killers like this? But as I said, it is not only Nurse, in general, something which might be ok for a Killer like Clown or Legion might be gamebreaking for a Killer like Blight or Artist.
This is why Killer Buffs only can happen to individual Killers.
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no, BHVR is fully aware that Nurse, has a unorthodox playstyle and learning curve. BHVR is just afraid of creating a game where survivors auto lose when the killer gets their first hook.
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We don't know MMR. But survivors with hundreds of hours are going down fast.
If you think Nurse is broken, try her on Lerys with no perks.
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Problem is basically nobody plays killer or survivor perkless, it's not really a good representation of how balanced a thing is in practice
Perkless addonless Blight might be okay but nobody plays him that way and the devs don't expect people to either bc they put all these addons and perks in the game they obviously want ppl to use them
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Look how easy trickster is to play and down survivors
I love you
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So Nurse is bad at Lerry, we should buff her. Now she can see survivors behind walls. Happy?
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So the killer meta is too strong. Because any high mobility killer is very oppressive with it.
If Nurse is weak perkless, it shows how powerful perks are.
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The same thing can be said for survivors though.
If as a killer you know going into a match everyone has no perks then you can just tunnel the first dude you catch out of the game instantly. No BT or DS to contend with. Chases would be much shorter with no DH or any exhaustion perk for that matter.
I don't think anyone would disagree that perks have a lot of impact on matches because they allow both roles to do things they can't do otherwise, such as regressing generators rapidly or prolonging chases
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Please no. I'm only saying she's very hard to play on indoor maps. Actually, the police station is even harder.
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Yeah, she is bad at RPD and Lerry. She is strong at outdoor maps. She is god at Midwich, Saloon and The Game.
And plus nobody playing her without strong perks and add-ons. All Nurses i saw had min 2 slowdown perks. Starstruck usually. She is destroying solo teams. I am sure she is destroying SWFs as well. How this killer is fair because she is bad at 2 maps?
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Many other killers are stronger on those maps. Have you played against Blight on the Saloon?
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No. I think the devs just want killers to be weak.
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At least you can win against Blight on this map. Good luck against Starstruck Nurse.
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How can have the opinions you have yet also defend nurse?
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They need to bring the top tier killers down and the bring the average/bottom ones UP. The discrepancy between the top killers and bottom tier killers is getting higher and higher and its not good for the health of the game. The thing that keeps this game fun is variety, not very fun to go against sweaty ass blights, nurses and spirits all day.
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In the best of the best (or even people with brains) versing each other is enough to prove if one killer is weak or not. Not just because nurse is this really good killer, maps play a big role into it as well. A lot of people would agree that killers like trapper and clown are weak because they're just anti loop with no decent mobility that only become decent on small maps.
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Nurse is one of the least played killer and has the lowest kill rate. If anything, she needs a buff.
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She had 5.27% pick rate. She's one of the most chosen lol. And even with baby Nurses, she had 50% kill rate. Probably she is around 60% at high mmr.
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Killers are weak because the survivor ask for them to be weak. If survivor asked for them to be strong, than killers would be strong.
Counter-points
Small and less safe maps - Nurse has mobility therefore rendering big maps irrelevant, Nurse ignores all loop design in the game, You can make every map have 100 pallets and nurse will not care.
Stronger perks - All killers benefit equally from strong perks, Nurse included.
Dead hard - Dead hard for distance hurts all killers equally by extending chases.
Circle of healing - Nurse has mobility to hit survivor after they sprint burst, Health states are not a concern for nurse. Gap-closing are 2nd strongest way to render healing ineffective(Instant down is #1)
Generator nerfs - Fast generators are just as difficult for nurse to play against as they are for other killers.
Totem spawns - Longer Ruin, Devour hope, NOED etc. makes all hexes stronger for all killers.
Better way to fix totem spawn is to just revert hex:undying. Totems are suppose to be easy to find, but its suppose to be time consuming to remove totems. 2 totems is not enough of time investment, way too easy to break all totems and remove perks slots from killer.
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You don't get the point. Nurse is already strong without this changes. If they change game like this, buffs will make Nurse stronger too and she does not need that. And ofcourse she will be broken with small maps and strong perks. BHVR would never do this because of her.
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yes, nurse was a mistake
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