CAMPING TUNNELING CHEAP TACTICS

@Drearystate said:
its still in early access, and once more killers and maps are added it will be a great contender. But you claim a early access game to be dead. Its in early access, I just bought it, jumped in, it was fun and took like 2 minutes to get a full game

You're still asking people to take a massive risk by jumping into a game with barely any players, on top of being early access game from a Chinese developer. If after 6 months the playerbase has declined that badly, I doubt anything is going to shoot it back into popularity.

@Raccoon said:
Probably a little early for this, but...

Here
How I feel about there complaint

Again your idea is prone to exploitation. If survivours do gens close to a hooked person and the killer is searching that area but does not trigger chase they will be stunned and blinded. If the survivours are 1 gen left the killer knows that its 99% and choses to secure his kill. Then he will be stunned and blinded. Then the survivours make the save do the last gen proc adrenaline and the person at the door opens it in time for their friend to arrive. The same applies with exit gates if the gates are wide open your stunned and blinded waiting to secure your kill as the other survivours are waiting for your change to kick in granting them a free escape.

Your idea is ill thoughtout and has so many clauses and exploitive problems. Please for the love of god think what ways it can be exploited and figure out a solution that isnt gonna hurt killers whos only option is to camp when gates are open or an adrenaline play is likely to be made. 

Treated fairly? What does that even mean? It's an asymmetrical 4v1... As soon as a match starts, you are not on equal footing with a player from the other role. The game's designed around that premise.

You must mean between survivors, then. To which I say play better. All survivors have just as much chance to be camped and tunneled to death. The killer shouldn't be punished simply because they outplayed you, and you certainly shouldn't be rewarded for playing worse than your teammates...

@Drearystate said:

At issue is that DBD isn't balanced, and I'm not simply pointing out the asymmetry, but that it is balanced greatly in the survivors' favor.

There's no need to take my word for it, you can see it yourself in the red ranks. Where as killers have a hard skill cap, where no matter how perfectly they play, they have to rely on survivors making mistakes in order to win a match. If survivors don't make mistakes, the killer can't win.

For instance, 4 survivors are perfectly capable of completing 4 gens in under 5 minutes, even against the Nurse, even when she's chasing and hooking them. Tru3ta1ent ran into this problem most recently when trying to get to rank 1 with no perks or add-on's:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lP8t3FpriOg

Okay, sure, he was playing without perks or add-on's, but he was still playing Nurse, and he still brought all his considerable skill to bear on the matches. Still, just single pip'ing was extremely difficult, even when he managed a 3k, he would frequently only safety pip.

So, what is a killer to do, if they aren't playing Nurse, against a team of good survivors?

Should survivors not return to a nearly completed gen, if the killer has kicked it? Isn't that the same as "tunneling?" Aren't you depriving the killer of points because you're optimizing your advantage to make the match end faster?

Why is it okay for survivors to do it, when they're the team with the advantage to begin with, but not okay if the killer does it?

Why do survivors camp infinite loops? Isn't returning to the same long loop, in order to deprive the killer of downing a survivor, every time the killer finds you, the same as the killer staying near a hooked survivor?

Why is it okay for survivors to use map locations to their advantage, but the same isn't true for killers?

I'll never understand why, not just in DBD but in the world generally, people decide that 1 group is disadvantaged, and are therefore free to use any tactics they want, while the other team is not. Particularly true when the team free to play by any rules they want are the ones who, in fact, have every advantage to begin with.

Look over these forums, and you'll see a whole lot of complaining about camping and "tunneling," while killer complaints such as "stop teabagging," and "stop the toxic post-game chat," are told they need to grow up and get a thicker skin.

The fact is, survivors will do whatever they can to survive the match. The killer will do whatever they can to get as many kills as possible. You may not like their methods, but then you should use whatever tools and tactics you can to counter them.

Outside of that, you're free to complain all you want, but you'll learn, like I have, that it does nothing but earn you insults. Until the mechanics of the game are changed, the sorts of tactics you're describing won't. You don't have to like it, but you should at least understand that against the vast majority of killers, the survivor team only loses the match because they gave the killer chances to capitalize on their mistakes, and the killer did.

@Poweas said:
Tru3 messed up a lot. I even pointed it out to him in his comments. He could have slugged and won. Anyone who understands what Nurse is like in high ranks without Ruin where the survivors constantly rush gens would agree.

I would disagree with you for several reasons.

First of all, you're assuming Tru3's matches are like yours or mine, and they aren't. During his challenge, and particularly at the end, he was going against a lot of stream snipers, and a lot of SWF groups that had at least 1 stream sniper. Even if it might be argued that this match or that match didn't have a sniper, Tru3 has to go in assuming they are. Therefore, if he made slugging a more prominent part of his strategy, they would have brought in perks and items specifically to counter that.

Secondly, he wasn't necessarily going for kills; he was going for pips. They aren't the same thing: hooking the same survivors several times is worth more to him than killing them on the first hook. So, slugging might have gotten more kills, but it probably would have been worse towards his goal of pipping up to rank 1. What he needed was to hook survivors, have them saved, and hook them again, and again. Slugging generally runs counter to that goal because of the third point...

Third, slugging can be effective, but in fewer circumstances than a lot of killers seem to believe. It's effective only if the slugging generates more hooks later, and the times that's true are not frequent. It's a gamble, but a one that can be calculated. If I'm a survivor and I see someone slugged while I'm working on a generator, I'm under very little pressure to abandon the generator to go for the pick-up. Slugs get a lot of time on the floor, and can use it to recover themselves and move to an optimal position to be picked up without putting other survivors in danger. So, slugging in this example generates less pressure, and deprives the killer of the hook credit.

When it can be effective is when other survivors are nearby, and can be hit or downed quickly before putting the slug on the hook. In that case, abandoning a chase in order to get a hook, and letting the survivors go to hide is the worse tactical decision. But, again, it's a gamble. Tru3 went against a team in Ormond who all brought insta heals, which means if he'd have slugged them he would have been deprived of 4 hooks without generating any pressure or stopping any significant momentum. And again, he has to go into every match assuming they know who they're facing, what he's bringing, and his tactics generally.

At Rank 1, I can play a Nurse without Ruin and generate a great deal of map pressure without slugging, unless it fits the criteria I mentioned above. Granted, a nurse moves slowly and therefore spends more time getting survivors to the hook, but that's completely overshadowed by the use of BBQ and Chili, which (even at rank 1) usually generates a new target for me to blink to and apply additional pressure, pushing the new target off a gen, and forcing a different survivor to abandon their generator in order to make the hook save. If, on the other hand, I were to slug without knowing where my next target was, I would generate far less pressure and waste more of my time looking rather than chasing and downing.

In the case of Tru3's challenge, this was even more the case because he wasn't bringing Nurse's Calling, and they knew he wasn't bringing NC, and could therefore pick up slugs inside his terror radius without fear of being seen.

So "anyone who understands what Nurse is like in high ranks without Ruin..." seems very much like an exaggeration. Tru3 certainly understands what Nurse is like at high ranks, with and without Ruin, as do I.

@Drearystate said:
I love all the the logic you guys bring to the argument, the bottom line is, it could be fixed, and all you want to do is defend a broken game with broken mechanics. I stay rank 1 on both killer and survivor, its not hard to escape, prestige, creep, sneak, etc. But you still dont seea problem with a developer that is 100% ok with people playing their game and not given the opportunity to enjoy it. You have these issues among so many more. Loading screen loop, ######### ping from killers making it almost unbearable to playor their pc's cant handle the load, hackers still out there (videos of speed hackers still being posted), the killer pickup animation for flashlight blinding, etc. I play this game alot it doesnt mean that I cant want a game that I pay for and continue to spend money on to get better. It's been 3 years now and none of these issues have been addressed.

Camping/tunneling aren't broken mechanics, they're stratetgies that you don't like. There is a huge difference.