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Survivors: Why "We'll Make It" is a better choice for SWFs
Just putting out some numbers, because I love numbers. Also, since we are having a Circle of Healing nerf, I wanted to go through and just calculate how inefficient each type of healing is, compared to gen speeds.
Every second of time used in the game is 1.25% of a gen that could be worked.
After calculating it out, I'm actually surprised at what I found. If you are an SWF, Booning a Totem is worthless, even pre-nerf. A dedicated "We'll Make It" team member twice as effective as a "pre-nerf Circle of Healing" teammate, while they are about 3 times as effective as a "post-nerf Circle of Healing" teammate.
This is not even including how detrimental blessing boons and looking for totems is to your gen speeds.
After viewing the numbers, I think the Circle of Healing nerf is actually a blessing in disguise for survivors because it will allow survivors to re-evaluate Circle of Healing and actually see that it's not the best single slot healing perk out there.
Anyway, here's the numbers and how inefficient each method of healing is. The CoH nerf will screw solo though.
Comments
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Interesting but a few things. If the one with WMI is hooked their healing benefit is gone. If I am healing the person off hook and the killer comes back and they must find someone else that is another lose of time and the effect of WMI is wasted. CoH is an AoE heal for all. If I am in CoH with someone it is even faster. If there is Shadow Step added the killer may not be able to find us at all. While the healing speed may be slightly faster CoH will always be the best option because if the killer comes back they can hopefully make it back to the boon and I am able to heal them in the Boon it is still going to be slightly faster. AoE free heal for all wins 100%.
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When I swf I run it all the time with bt and wglf. Its my farming build :p
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Shhhh you're gonna get We'll Make It nerfed.
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WMI only works after an unhook, right?
So you're trading utility for speed. Sure it's a quicker heal, but you can't use it to reset after getting wounded and away.
Also, as noted above, if the one with the perk gets hooked, you get 0 benefit.
Don't get me wrong, if I'm going for an unhook challenge, I'm all over WMI, but I don't think it has a varied enough range of use to be considered the best healing perk.
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I'm kind of a fan of We'll Make It and often run it on my builds anyway - especially if I'm running a particularly altruistic build and will be healing a lot. It's so useful that I can unhook, heal someone super quickly, even if the killer is returning to the hook. I'll often put Empathy on with it, so that if I still have We'll Make It active I can often get off another sneaky heal to a team mate.
However, I do not think it's comparable to CoH as it's a lot more conditional and on a timer, and requires you to be the person unhooking in order to use the perk, whereas CoH just allows you to boon a totem and you can go anywhere else on the map.
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I feel like gauging it's usefulness is more then just comparing flat numbers.
COH is in that sweet spot of being faster than SelfCare, and being totem based but with none of the downsides that come with Inner Strength where you only get 5 heals that might be split between 4 people. It's available and highlighted to every survivor in the lobby. And if it gets destroyed, you can just put it up again.
It's the best of both worlds.
Sure, on paper not healing is the most efficient way to complete gens, but we're living in a era where the strongest killers are anti-loop.
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We’ll Make It is a nice thought, if killers ever left the hook. Also, Self-Care is 100% efficiency (same speed to heal yourself as time taken away from another survivor to heal you).
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It's definitely got pros. You'd need at least 2 people running it to ensure it being always useful.
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I'm basing the efficiency off of time lost doing gens. So Self-Caring means you lost 40% progress that could have been spent on a gen.
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We'll Make It+Second Wind on your rescuer
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I use it when I'm going for altruism points (solo player). I usually get at least one heal out of it and commonly can get multiple heals off the same WMI as 90 seconds is a pretty generous time limit (I also run Bond and Kindred so that helps as I can find the hurt peeps pretty easily)
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He's cracked the code. We'll Make It is the best healing perk. 90 seconds is a exceedingly long time to have this kind of buff to healing. I have games where I only have to get 1-2 unhooks, and I had a healing buff all game. No need for any other kind of healing perks.
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I love We'll Make It but if the killer camps, proxy camps or returns to the hook it's useless. Especially once the new Haemorrhage effect goes into effect.
Is it fast and efficient? Yes but only under ideal circumstances. Like someone else mentioned above it's best to have two people run it or have the other person run CoH in case the WMI user gets hooked. Kinda like BT, you'll always want a contingency plan in the event that killers camp which they will inevitably do.
I think healing in general is about to be really shaken up with new haemorrhage though. It's going to be all about playing injured again and utilizing instant heals or endurance most likely. Survivors will adapt and Killers will complain once (When/if) people move away from hyper healing.
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What is the hemorrhage change?
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I don't really compare We'll make it to COH, yeah they're both healing but activation requirements and effects are pretty different.
I'd actually compare wmi to BT, to which I feel wmi is actually better. Most people take bt but it really only beats out wmi when facing killers that are just face camping.
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It will now cause 7% healing loss every second you aren’t fully healed.
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well a lot of killers in current mmr camp hooks a lot and tunnel survivor off hook 24/7. I used to run both borrow time and we'll make it as a result of that. Now I run BT & COH.
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I would say that the strength behind COH is that it does not require me to perform healing action. its like you have 5th player that heals you for free at 50% rate. previously, it gave you a free teammate that heals you at 75% and before that, it was free full 5th player at 100% just for totem existing.
COH is still strong. its just less strong than it past predecessors.
We'll make it makes 1 survivor for 90 seconds able to heal at speed of 2 survivors. so for example, when you heal on hook, activating we'll make it is like two survivor went for the save and healed under hook.
We'll make it is more situational. you need get unhooked, the killer has not camp hooks and it likely only results in healing 1 or 2 health states at best within 90 seconds. We'll make requires the survivor to heal. you need two players for effect to be relevant. COH has self-care bonus so it does not require input from survivor who has it to heal you. Its place and forget perk.
I would say killers that complaining about COH are complaining because solo-players are now as efficient at healing as SWF are. SWF can already find teammates very quickly and can heal very efficiently through communication programs(discord).
Solo I would say on average take more time to heal each other without COH than with it because its harder to find teammates. In many ways COH bridges gap between SWF efficiency and solo-healing efficiency.
Its just that SWF can also use this perk and it is far more powerful because extra health states that COH gives can be used to bodyblock the killer where as solo-players do not use COH to bodyblock for teammates in most cases. you can watch tru3 vs oracle swf to showcase this without COH. Its even more nasty with this perk.
One day, I hope they invent a perk for killer that weakens sprint burst from survivor so that body-blocking is more punishable for m1 killers. right only only instant down killers and high-tier killers like nurse, blight etc. can punish bodyblocking, for rest its just free second-chances in a chase via teammates. very annoying for killer player to deal with.
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TL:DR SWF do not need COH but greatly benefit from it, Solo need COH because it bridges informational gap of finding teammate to heal you.
Post edited by Devil_hit11 on0 -
You should multiply CoH speed by 4, now it's truth.
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Thing is, you're often already better off just healing on the spot unless CoH is close to you. Running to CoH costs time, running away from CoH costs time. Remember why self-care was often called a killer perk? Because people ran to the safest corner of the map, self-cared and ran back, only to be hit and run back. And that is a perk you can realistically use all over the map. And even with that, it's only really good as solo survivor.
Boons were basically buffing solo survivors to swf, without buffing swf. Literally any other healing perk was better than CoH for swf. You'd think that the more buff you have, the more it's worth to run to CoH, but the opposite is true. Without any buffs, CoH would take 9 seconds per heal+(time to run there+time to run back)*2(because 2 survs), meaning you better both be injured or one of you is dead on hook, otherwise you wasted time if the circle was more than 6 meters away. With Botany Knowledge, that would be 7,6 seconds, so you'd save 1,4 extra seconds you might think, but healing in the spot is already 12 seconds with just botany knowledge.
As a 1v1 comparison, you would need to be closer than 5.6 meters with 2 people from CoH to be worth healing up 1 health state together. And that's pre-nerf. And that's not even considering the fact that you need to find the totem, you need to bless it and the killer can snuff it before you get the opportunity to.
The big issue with CoH comes with 2 people healing and the range to self-care on small maps. Because it was in speed better than self-care. And self-care can be amazing if applied correctly. On a map like Midwich, you could use it as effectively as self-care and BK, which made it a bit powerful.
The speed being nerfed isn't going to solve the issue with the boon. It will still be extremely fast to heal 3 injured people up and still be super helpful for people who self-care on maps like Midwich.
75% is fine. Cap the 75% per healing action, not per healing person, and reduce the range of boons to 16 meters on small and indoor maps.
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We'll Make It pairs very nicely with Renewal, which then makes it even more efficient.
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This is what I told them COH is DEAD, Equip bond or aftercare its faster and easier. go ask a teammate to heal you, its far safer than to go alone.
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Yes, but you missed a point, and thus, i dont think your numbers are right. Lets take WMI, where you say only 10% genprogress is lost. That translates to a healing speed of 8 seconds. What you dont take into account is that 2 survivors are blocked for that time, not just one. That means its actually 20% genprogress lost, not just 10%.
Normal healspeed with no perk at all would be 20% per Survivor, which is 40% for both, and on par with self care, where the 40% is lost by just one person.
For completion, autodidact and botany knowledge might also be considered (or maybe not ^^)
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Numerically "well make it" is stronger but significantly less flexible. The best way to beat a large swath of the killer rooster is split up and pressure an individual gen. Coh allows teams to continue to split up without relying on each other for healing. Well make it creates scenarios where two survivors can be downed in quick succession or at least pressured. Any setup cost is easily countered by the te required by killers to snuff them as killer downtime in the early stages of the games is worth 4x more then a single survivors second.
This is a team wide effect so it takes up only one maybe two of the survivor perks on the team. You can tunnel the healer against well make it. You cant tunnel the booner if they have already blessed the totem.
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Interesting points and you are correct that running to the boon and healing is not time efficient but how many killers return to the hook after and unhook? Why do the return? There is a guarantee two survivors in the area with one being hurt. My point still stands if the person wants to heal that 90% the person pulling them of does not have WMI and if they do the healing may be interrupted. If the injured person is not in chase they will have the chance to go to the boon and heal rather then having to look for someone else. Again continues healing for all or situation healing. If the boon is in a good location it can be beneficial to the whole team and if the whole team has just CoH and all four are up then you are not far from a boon guarantee. Run what ever healing or no healing you want but with the new loss of healing while not healing, healing under hook is no longer viable and the option for all to heal in a location is a good one.
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