Proposition: Make Pop Goes the Weasel Baseline
I know most people will balk at just a pure killer buff, but consider this.
Currently the most player aggravating elements of the game are, for the killer and survivor side respectively,
Gen Rushing
Camping
Currently chasing does not feel rewarding because, in the time it takes to complete a chase, even a very fast and efficient race, survivors will push gens and you feel helpless to stop it. Chasing actively feels bad, not because you're getting looped and looped and looped, but because there is no feeling of achievement even when you do get that down and hook, you just had your time wasted while gens got rushed.
PgtW baseline would actively reward killers for successful chases, not only negating some of the "time lost" for a chase, but giving that benefit in a very visceral and rewarding experience. Kicking a gen and watching its progress meaningfully degrade feels impactful, and feels are important to feeling good with a gaming experience.
Conversely, generally the only time survivors feel helpless is when they are being facecamped by a killer. Outside of a coordinated team save, there is little a survivor can do except hang there and die to a killer staring at them. While built in PgtW wouldn't do anything to stop camping in itself, the timer to cash in the reward would be a big incentive for a killer to leave the hooked survivor and utilize the "reward" for winning their chase, instead of doing the other most optimal thing they can do when getting a hook, ensuring the survivor dies and the team loses 25% of their progress capacity. This would give the survivor team a chance to save a hooked survivor that would otherwise just be camped, even if the killer would come right back to the hooked survivor after kicking a gen, there was at least the feeling of a chance.
Considering most killers are considered weak or under powered, I really don't think this bump in power is damning. And, more than making something like Ruin baseline, that greatly punishes new survivors and doesn't really require any input from the killer, while increasing the potential for killer's to have a negative game experience when that free ruin totem gets popped in the first ten seconds of the match, PgtW will always be a very positive experience rewarding a killer for good play and offering survivors counterplay by being more effective being chased or utilizing the window opened when the killer goes to pop a gen.
TL;DR Pop Goes The Weasel would let killers slow gen rushing, feel good for completing a chase, and disincentivize bad killers from facecamping because they have something else to do that feels cathartic, giving a team a chance to help a survivor on a hook.
Comments
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Killers who camp aren't going to stop face camping and tunneling just because they can now break gens faster. What kind of logic is that.
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Kind of logic that I would apply to myself. I know I'de generally never have the impulse to facecamp even in a tryghard game because I can go back out into the map and do something with that instead of just losing the hook I worked hard for and not even getting an easy chase on the hurt survivor.
I can't imagine I'm alone in that kind of analysis.
Currently moving away from the hook just hurts you, as the killer. You don't gain anything for it and you lose a potentially dead survivor.
Atleast with PgtW I'de be able to rationalize gaining sizeable gen degredation and that every step forward I take to a gen away from a hooked survivor isn't just me hurting myself by alienating the possibility of an easy chase/rehook.
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Whatever you say you can't argue that knowing that you can knockback gen progression you may decide to camp less due to the fact that those lost gens can be recovered.0
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I generally don't mind making a killer perk baseline but Survivors need to get something out of the deal.
Killers are not "underpowered" and adding this tips the scales a little too much in one direction.
And I certainly don;t' think this will dissuade camping, it may apply to you but I bet most killers don't think like you.
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I disagree with your point that killers are overpowered. Only nurse and billy are arguable overpowered. The rest fall flat on their faces.0
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@Mochan said:
I generally don't mind making a killer perk baseline but Survivors need to get something out of the deal.Killers are not "underpowered" and adding this tips the scales a little too much in one direction.
And I certainly don;t' think this will dissuade camping, it may apply to you but I bet most killers don't think like you.
Well most killers can still be gen rushed very easily, against really organized survivors teams there is little they can do, so you could argue that among the very best players, most killers are still a little underpowered, not Nurse, Hillbilly and Spirit though in my opinion.
But I agree that if gen rush was ever nerfed, the game would get a lot of new problems, especially since at lower ranks, survivors aren't nearly as fast with gens as they are at higher ranks. I don't think Pop Goes the Weasel as base kit would change much though so that survivors would need some compensation.1 -
Honestly, I just wish the gen regression speed after kicking a gen would be faster the more gens still need to be repaired. Like for every gen that still needs to be repaired, minus the last one, the gen regression speed is increased by 25%. That would mean if all 5 gens still need to be repaired, gens regress at double the speed. I think right now it's 4 seconds regression for one second progression. So at double the speed, the gen would regress the same amount in 2 seconds as one survivor would progress the gen in one second.
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You actually bring up some really good points;
You mention that you want to buff killers through something that has to be utilised by the killer and will not damage the already unequal learning curve between killer and survivors at a lower rank.
You mention something that incentivises leaving the hook, thus creating more exciting gameplay for both sides.So I highly agree with both your design philosophy and intentions.
Now here is why I think making PgtW straight up baseline is not a good idea;
in order for PgtW to trigger, you must have hooked someone. This means that this mechanic is significantly stronger on killers that are already stronger as they'll be better at hooking survivors.
Because PgtW does flat out damage with no other variables, it's also utilised better on killers with great map presence. (Typically already strong killers as well).But as our design philosophy and intentions are so similar, it's not surprising that both of us came up with a very similar solution;
The only part that is missing in the PgtW solution is what I believe to make it time-based and not hooked based, meaning that it's utilised by every type of killer equally, and in order for survivors to have a fair chance to deal with such increased regression, that regression should be lowered based on the amount of people alive.
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I have wanted this since the perk came out. I think that kicking gens should do more than it does right now. And I dont think it would be OP and survivors need to be compensated for it, because really, kicking a gen should do more and it is stupid that it is so useless.
I dont think that campers will camp less, because some people just have that playstyle no matter what. I mean, I face countless of killers that have bbq, but camp first hook, 5 gens up and ruin still going, so I mean, if you play like that, nothing really matters. But it could make the game more enjoyable for those of us who dont have camping as our strategy.0 -
I don't think Pop Goes the Weasel should be baseline, but I do think that when a killer breaks a gen that it should do some immediate damage to the gen. Something like 3-5% damage. I think that should stack with PGtW.
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