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The classic trio recommended changes
Decisive strike is already countered by enduring, dribbling, and unerving presence. Most of the time it only buys survivors 10 seconds. My proposed change isnt much different. Allow the obsession to strike off, but anyone else running the perk to stun. However, i think the stun needs to be slightly longer, 5 seconds. The time it takes to trigger the skill check is wasted wiggling time.
Self care is countered by doctor t3, nurses, survivors noise, tunneling, and blood trails. Again i think the proposed is the right direction, but too far. It promotes tunneling more and makes it impossible for a good player to pip even if his teammates are covering the gens while he kites all game. Instead of resetting to 0, have it regress like a kicked gen.
Sprint burst, or moreso exhaustion. The proposed change lends to the same concern of self care, more tunneling. This one, i dont see as super bad, especially if bloodlust is going away(is it?). Otherwise clever kiters just eventually get caught. Im not entirely sure how to tweak this one.
It seems like the changes to the most used perks were swung at with a heavy hammer, and i think thats the wrong way to go about it. Balancing is about subtle changes to even the playing field.
Let me know what you think of these.
Comments
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Woah 5 seconds of stun time. 5 seconds in a video game = an eternity2
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Its already 4 seconds and the skill check can take 1 and half seconds to hit. Plus your only getting 5 seconds if your not the obsession, which means your also not getting off w/o help.0
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DS has no true counters. You still get stunned with Enduring (the perk is even bugged and only gives you 55% stun reduction at tier 3 against DS). Dribbling only works when you’re close to a hook and no one bodyblocks. Decent Survivors can hit the skillcheck even with Unnerving and/or Doctor’s Madness 3 active. Five seconds is too long for the duration. 2-4 seconds is fine.2
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Yes and I 4 is pretty long. Obsession or not I personally don’t think you should be able to get off once the killer has you unless you wiggle free. If you get caught you should be punished for it so it should be hard to get free. Also other survivors usually body block so 5 seconds is a long time in general but when you combine it with that unless the killer is right next to a hook your getting freek. I just think it should be difficult to break their graspTacticalDonut said:Its already 4 seconds and the skill check can take 1 and half seconds to hit. Plus your only getting 5 seconds if your not the obsession, which means your also not getting off w/o help.0 -
Bugs shouldnt be counted in balancing, theyre a seperate matter.
In my games from rank 20-8 i rarely get body blocks when playing solo. 5sec may be too long but ds is countered by several things already. I didnt mention slugging and knockout, or clown gassing. Its really not that OP. The way hooks have spawned lately i rarely get to use DS without a dribbled.
Maybe my change ismt the right thing, but i dont think theirs is either.0 -
Well at rank 1 body blocks are pretty common ime at least even when playing solo. Besides that you gotta remember swf is a thing which makes slugging,knockout and whatever else pretty much useless. There’s no true counter to ds especially a swf ds. I’ll see how the ptb goes before I judge their changesTacticalDonut said:Bugs shouldnt be counted in balancing, theyre a seperate matter.
In my games from rank 20-8 i rarely get body blocks when playing solo. 5sec may be too long but ds is countered by several things already. I didnt mention slugging and knockout, or clown gassing. Its really not that OP. The way hooks have spawned lately i rarely get to use DS without a dribbled.
Maybe my change ismt the right thing, but i dont think theirs is either.0 -
DS is imo perk what shouldn't exist. It's just so cheap that after chasing someone you must start it again instead getting rewarded by hooking him. It can really drag out chases + there can be multiple DS in game.
SC change is imo good but don't really like about exhaustion nerf. Maybe it should take more time to recover while running, or not recovering during chases but recovering only while walking / crouching feels clunky tbh.
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From what I know about DS, it is as follows:
* Survivor hits the Skill Check
* A drop-off animation will play (1 sec)
* The DS animation will play (4 sec)
And Enduring affects only the 4 seconds, not the drop-off animation.0 -
@TacticalDonut said:
I dont like the proposed changes lets make it clear though. Its the right direction, but maybe too far.Decisive strike is already countered by enduring, dribbling, and unerving presence. Most of the time it only buys survivors 10 seconds. My proposed change isnt much different. Allow the obsession to strike off, but anyone else running the perk to stun. However, i think the stun needs to be slightly longer, 5 seconds. The time it takes to trigger the skill check is wasted wiggling time.
dribbling does not counter Dstrike, if you are being chased and you get downed beside a hook while you have Dstrike then you failed the chase
enduring does not counter Dstrike , the stun in Dstrike only exists so you dont get down the instant you use it, what Dstrike actually does is waste the killer's time and practically guarantee escape if the gates are powered.the time the killer invested to chase you down and hit you twice is a very large investment, which proably allowed 2 gens to get finished and now he has to catch you a third time and god forbid the non-obsession gets to that 30% because then the killer actually wasted even more time walking you closer to a hook
Self care is countered by doctor t3, nurses, survivors noise, tunneling, and blood trails. Again i think the proposed is the right direction, but too far. It promotes tunneling more and makes it impossible for a good player to pip even if his teammates are covering the gens while he kites all game. Instead of resetting to 0, have it regress like a kicked gen.
nurse's calling and doctor t3 would only counter self care if you are in the killer's terror radius (same for survivors noise when the killer is extremely close to you) and blood trails are meant to make it harder to start hiding mid chase which is not when you should be doing self care
and i dont understand what you mean by tunneling counters self care , do you expect the killer to stop chasing the player he just injured when ever he sees a healthy survivor?
finally 1 survivor should not be able to kite the whole game , survivors should feel the need to actually trick the killer and break the chaseIt seems like the changes to the most used perks were swung at with a heavy hammer, and i think thats the wrong way to go about it. Balancing is about subtle changes to even the playing field.
when the meta of a game gets this stale a hammer is a pretty good idea.
if both sides are evenly matched then 2 players should die and 2 escape , if the killer plays well 3 should die and 1 escape and vice versa, if a 4 kill or 4 escape happens then there was a massive failure in match making.bottom line when i play killer i want to feel scary and on survivor i want to feel scared
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What i list directly takes power away from d-strike, so your wrong on that. And on SC you completely skipped over the part where i said "on a small map".
I disagree with your statement on metas in this context. Sure if its stale change it up, but their goal is to balance not just provide something fresh. So a hammer is the wrong approach.
Your probably right and/or close on the 2 kills, but its hard to tell in an a symmetrical where emblems can make everyone "win" with several outcomes.0 -
Honestly, I am very pleased with the changes. The only one that may have been too much was probably the changes to Exhaustion (but as long as it dealt with SB, was fine).
It still counters certain killer abilities, but at least it will only happen once per chase. :P0 -
Counter means, that the countered thing cannot be used at all. So for me, some of your counters aren't exactly counters:
* Nurse's Calling: isn't slowing down the healing process at all, just notifies the Killer. Still, the Killer has to come to survivors and they know about the Killer's location thanks to the terror radius.
* Madness T3: This state negates all actions except vaulting and pallets. Survivors can remove it by standing still for ~10 secs while hitting Skill Checks.
* Survivor sounds: They are injured, of course they will make sounds! Also, Killers can hear it only when they are 8-6 metres near them.
* Tunneling: survivors are being chased, of course they can't heal themselves!
* Blood Trails: almost nobody uses Bloodhound and the trails are not really visible on some maps.1 -
@TacticalDonut said:
What i list directly takes power away from d-strike, so your wrong on that. And on SC you completely skipped over the part where i said "on a small map".i am sorry that you want survivors to never be punished for playing bad which is what dribbling is (punishment for letting the chase end close to a hook) , and that after my explanation of what Dstrike actually does you think enduring affects its power at all
and on the small map SC thing i guess i did miss that because i cant find it in what i quoted you for, but even still on haddenfield which i assume is the smallest map you still have plenty of room to move away from the terror radius ( quite a bit of the way out of the terror radius really) and heal your self
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