Comprehensive Feedback on Perk Changes
After looking through the dev update, I'm going to give my opinions based on the perk reworks.
Meta perks
Barbecue and Chilli - A shame that we're losing the bloodpoint bonus, but it's still going to be a strong aura reading perk on many killers.
Hex: Ruin - I don't think it will be worth running anymore, might be nice to have, but I don't think it will be super effective. Deactivating when the first survivor dies seems unnecessary, since it is a Hex perk.
Pop Goes the Weasel - This is still going to be a strong perk for interrupting nearly-done gens.
Corrupt Intervention - No issues with this one either.
Tinkerer - Exactly the change I wanted to see, thumbs up for this one.
Hex: No One Escapes Death - This change should aim to make the perk less frustrating, while still giving the killer a chance to snowball in the endgame. I don't know how effective it will end up being, though.
Scourge Hook: Pain Resonance - A slap on the wrist. This perk still provides a huge amount of regression, especially considering that generators take 90 charges now. I think this perk will still be largely unaffected.
Dead Hard - Honestly, I have no idea how to feel about this one on paper. It's one I'm going to have to play with to form a proper opinion on.
Decisive Strike - This change is DISASTROUS. A 3 second stun will make this perk too easy to brush off and encourage tunneling even more. Extremely unhealthy change.
Borrowed Time - Still as necessary as before, seeming as the basekit endurance seems mostly worthless. The basekit endurance needs to be raised significantly.
Iron Will - It might be useless or it might be ok, another one we're going to have to play with to see how effective it will end up being. Having it deactivate while exhausted seems like an unnecessary double-nerf, in my opinion.
Self-Care - This perk will be DEAD if these changes go to live. 45 seconds for a self-heal? Completely worthless. Too harsh of a nerf.
Spine Chill - Yet another completely dead perk. This perk no longer provides information you can't get with your eyes, AND you removed the vault speed bonus. There is no reason to run this anymore. Too harsh of a nerf.
non-meta perks
Overcharge - Seems like it could be very overtuned. Having gens regress at the same speed survivors repair them seems crazy. Replacing one very strong slowdown perk with another is not a "shake up".
Eruption - Another one that could be overtuned. 25 seconds of twiddling your thumbs doing absolutely nothing isn't exactly very fun, either.
Knock Out - This perk was already quite problematic for solo play, and it's getting a flat buff. Not a good idea.
Coulrophobia - A nice gimmick with the skill check speed, I think that might be funny to play against. Probably won't be amazing, however.
Dark Devotion - Opening up a perk to be used on all killers is always nice. I think it could do with a small duration buff too, though.
Jolt - No cooldown. Cool.
Lethal Pursuer - A very nice addition to the perk, and something that's been requested in some form for a while. Having Lethal not be a dead slot after 9 seconds is cool. I like it.
Scourge Hook: Gift of Pain - Could be overtuned with the base gen nerf.
Thanatophobia - Why on earth are you buffing this perk at the same time as nerfing base gen speeds? 115 seconds on a gen solo is going to be very boring.
Scourge Hook: Monstrous Shrine - Oh boy, this one is going to be stupid on Hag, Blight and Huntress. Making hook speeds faster isn't really something that should be touched, they're already too short as-is.
Calm Spirit - Why does this have an action speed penalty? It's really unnecessary, and will discourage people from running it.
Saboteur - Solves none of the issues people actually had with the perk. It doesn't show you the auras of hooks when survivors are downed, and it still goes onto cooldown after a cancelled sabotage.
Botany Knowledge - A good buff, could end up being a little out of hand though, we'll have to see.
Off the Record - This is just going to be a replacement for Decisive Strike. A lack of actual basekit anti-tunnel measures alongside the completely unnecessary DS stun nerf will leave this perk just as meta as DS was. Swapping one perk for another is hardly a "shake up".
Lucky Break - I personally hate this perk with a passion, but having it not be a one-time use for the people that like running it is cool I guess?
Pharmacy - Removing the ability to get a medkit while healthy might end up creating the problem of teammates stealing your chests. Besides that, however, I love the change to this perk.
Sole Survivor - Still terrible, and doesn't address the main reason the perk was bad. Relying on your teammates dying is not a good prerequisite for a perk to activate. It actually might do something once in a blue moon now, though, so it's technically an improvement? It should get tokens for each hook on your teammates, which provide a third of what a current token does now.
Distortion - Finally, a way to get tokens back. I'm a fan of this change.
Lightweight - Halving the time at which scratch marks disappear will be handy in situations where you have to cross the map undetected. I think this might end up being pretty decent.
Déjà Vu - 5% is nothing. This perk is basically the same as it was before.
No One Left Behind - A very nice perk for endgame resets. Very glad that the activation condition got changed, and the 7% speed boost for survivors you unhook is sure to come in handy. Good change.
Dark Sense - I think this perk is actually worse than it is now. The effect should be stacked on top of what it does already instead of replacing it.
Tenacity - A nice buff, that lets you crawl away from the killer if they leave you alone for too long.
Hope - FINALLY, no timer. I've been waiting for this for years.
Overzealous - A 2% increase when gen speeds are being made 10% slower. Not really a good buff at all. The Hex totem mechanic is nice but the numbers are still too underwhelming.
We’re Gonna Live Forever - This secondary effect could end up being very strong in the right situations. A shame to lose the bloodpoints, but this perk will still be good, I think.
A lot of interesting survivor perk changes here, it's a shame that the complete lack of any worthwhile anti-tunneling and camping measures will stop people from running perks they want to, on top of buffing these strategies. I'd really revisit these basekit changes, otherwise all of these perk reworks will be for nothing. The solo survivor experience will become even more miserable than it is currently unless you make changes.
Comments
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I don't think the Iron Will nerf is nearly as bad as people are saying, it'll still be useful, just not make you dead silent in chase, but I guess we'll see when the changes get put on the PTB.
I think the anti-tunneling stuff introduced is pretty good, especially Off The Record, but any anti-camp measures are non-existent. They should have increased hook state timers by 10 seconds for first and second state to offset longer gen times and campers. There's literally nothing you can do against a camping Bubba or Billy or any kind of other one shot, heck you could even just get grabbed by a m1 killer. It's really concerning because the reward is now even higher for camping, and if you manage to get a hook in the middle of a 3 gen? Lol game's over, you just camp it out and win.
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The issue is that there's no significant basekit anti-tunnel measures. Having it being tied to a perk will stifle variety, while not solving a core issue of the game, which is what this update intended to do. As I said, swapping DS for OTR isn't a "shake up", it doesn't solve the issue of tunneling at a basekit, it just switches which perk we have to use to avoid it.
Not to mention that there's also absolutely no anti-camping measure at all, on top of nerfing gens by 10 seconds, making camping more effective.
I think this could end up increasing both of these unhealthy playstyles dramatically.
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They should just buff the basekit endurance effect to be 7-9 seconds to help against tunneling. 5 seconds is a bit too short imo. My biggest concern is camping, that's going to be happening a lot more if they don't make some kind of basekit change.
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Fantastic analysis. It would be nice if BHVR would read this before pushing this disastrous update on the game.
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Mad props to anyone who read the entire thread.
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I think the Endurance should be 10 seconds, or around that mark. Borrowed Time would add 5 on top of that.
Thank you! This took me quite a bit of time to type up so I'm glad you appreciate it.
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Really good analysis btw. Props for going through the time and effort, we need more people like you.
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For Ruin, the text says killed but not sacrificed. Will it only deactivate through mori or also 3rd hook?
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Well Mori are only available through Pyramid head, Devour, Rancor (Ruin would already be worthless at the point), onryo. since moris are being taken out. so I don't think it would be that
probably sacrifice
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that would make it less bad but still super useless
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Re Spine Chill, someone made a good point on social media that deaf players will be at a disadvantage. I remember way back when, there was a deaf player on the FB community page who made it to red rank thanks to SC being their ears.
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I use SC as an awareness perk because I'm not good with sounds, not deaf though, but I can't perceive where sounds are really coming from in my left ear. I usually move the camera around to capture the sound with my right ear so I can pinpoint the origin
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Well written analysis it was a pleasure to read the whole thread I agree with most of your takes.
BHVR should definitely take some feedback from you.
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Hex: ruin has been ruined. Again.
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Pretty good read of the situation that deserves a bump I think. As I read the changes, I quickly realized that the increase to gen times while not introducing any serious anti-camping measures was going to be very problematic.
What are survs supposed to do against a Bubba who gets someone in basement less than 45 seconds into a match? Especially if said bubba runs deadlock, thana, DMS, etc.? Survivors are down 50 extra seconds on generators when this patch goes live in this scenario.
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I agree with you 100% some of these changes were definitely needed as some seems still to lack the core issues people are having with dbd. Soloq is getting more and more pushed aside for swfs and killers. 95% of the time i am solo. I do have groups of newer players i play with but i am definitely not new. So i feel bad when 3 of them are new and i run the killer for 5 gens. The killer gets blindsided so thats why i dont play with them alot. Soloq needs to be fixed. We need a system to talk to other soloq members. Being left on hook the 1st time while the rest are on separate gens and hook stages are still fast or now faster (with monsterous) and gens going slower will make people sit on gens longer. :( something needs to give for soloq.
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@MandyTalk could you move this to feedback? I wouldn't want the devs to miss it.
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Agreed on most counts for sure.
Off the Record - I also don't like how this change feels so incongruous with the intent of the perk. Instead of being stealthier after unhook, this will incentivize survivors to get in the killer's face to body block. The buff should have been to add reduced scratch marks or no loud noise for rushed actions while active or something like that.
Calm Spirit - I completely agree, this reads as more of a nerf than a buff. It's rare that being quiet while cleansing or opening matters, but the extra seconds will negatively impact most games. And imagine needing to cleanse a Devour or NOED totem while running this. Such a minor buff didn't need a drawback.
The changes to Thanatophobia, Self-Care, and Botany Knowledge all feel misguided. Agreed that the shortened stun on DS is super problematic and will likely mainly benefit already strong killers. New Eruption feels like it will lead to really boring gameplay and punishes solo players more than SWFs. And the Spine Chill change feels awful. I get cutting the vault speed boost but the line of sight change will make it basically useless.
Beyond that I think most of the changes are fine or even great, which to be fair is most of them. And the base kit changes seem almost universally good. I just hope they reconsider a few of these perks.
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I agree with pretty much everything on here, with maybe just a few exceptions.
The basekit anti-tunneling and camping measures are insanely underwhelming. The duration needs to be 12 seconds instead of 5, or at the very least 10 seconds. That will at least nerf tunneling decently. But then we also need actual camping nerfs, right now it's even getting buffed because of higher gen speeds. The hook phase of survivors needs to be increased from 60 to 90 seconds, at the very least. And hook grabs need to be removed.
With those changes, cmaping and tunneling are actually properly nerfed, and survivors won't be forced to run anti-camping and tunneling perks.
Beyond that, I also particularly agree that some meta perks are overnerfed. The DS nerf in particular is beyond terrible, 3 seconds is way too little, and I don't see any reason it should deactivate during endgame, however that I don't think is as bad, if the baseline endurance and haste status effect is increased to 12 seconds.
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