Has David King always been gay?
Comments
-
Ok? i dont care that it was done to "balance" out straight characters because it was dumb to even add that in anyways.
It wasnt done to add to the game or gameplay, it was done to pander and to score brownie points.
and ace, trans, pansexual ect arent represented by david other than them happening to be under the same umbrella term of LGBT. those orientations are not actually represented by David.
And your welcome to hold a different point of view, i am not attacking you for it, i am simply expressing my point of view and how I fell the proper way about representation should be.
I am an individual with feelings and insecurities with who i am and how the evironment around me views the parts of myself that i keep hidden, and i like that other environments represent things similar tomyself in positive ways/validating them.
however, i do not like it when it seems the intent wasnt about representation because representation was was relevant to the experience or to ensure that all people had an equal gameplay experience, but was done to score points in an environment where what is being represented has nothing to do with the product.
You can "not care" about my point of view as much or as little as you want, but I am going to still express my opinion because this topic is indeed, opinion based.
2 -
I respect your opinion even though I disagree with it
0 -
in no part of my posts did i state that other lgbt people did not or could not feel differently. please dont misrepresent people when you disagree in an attempt to discredit someone else. its rather gross.
"i want to simply be represented equally" yet is writing comments on the forums arguing against that said equal representation???
this statement makes it clear that you(seemingly)
- didnt bother to read in full and attempt to understand a position due to predisposition torwards disagreeing with an opposing view
- intentionally pretend you didnt udnerstand what was being said so you can try and present my viewpoint as ridiculous.
if that is the case, shame on you.
It should be rather clear unless somehow i am unable to communicate this properly, that i am all for representation, but HOW the representation is done matters.
I feel this was very explicitly stated by me and as i have no reason to assume you arent capable of understanding the whole idea that i was stating, i am going to assume that you were intentionally being disengenuous.
2 -
Yes you did, just not directly. Your comments are full of anti-representation dog whistles that often coincide with anti-LGBTQ+ sentiment AND you immediately jumped to the hypersexualisation of gay men with the "likes to have sex with other men" comment.
yes, because the change here made was in regards to a sexual orientation, I.E. what a made up character prefers to have sex/romantic encounters with.
This game is not about sex, so why is it you immediately associate MLM representation in DbD with what goes on in the bedroom?
Its not about sex and yet you wanted a change about specifically that, the sexual preferences of a charcter in a game that is not about sex or romance.
i think its goofy that sexual orientation in any manner is relevant in DBD, not just that they added in a gay character/made an existing one gay, its just however that is what is relevant to the topic at hand, not the seperate orientations that were not being discussed.
just as in, you dont have to read my opinions or respond to them, but you are welcome to comment and express your viewpoints on it just like i am. goes both ways.
bd if they wanted to include this in should have just added it in, not done a whole show about doing it. In my personal opinion.
2 -
@ImmersedNurse Just wanted to comment on what you said above about David being a gay character being treated equally in the lore. (I didn't quote it because you were responding to another forum member and I just wanted to comment on one thing you said in it).
David is the first and only character in DBD who's sexuality has been publicly announced and celebrated by the company who made him. That is not equality. That is giving special attention to a character based solely on the fact that he is now gay. This is counter productive to the idea of normalization and diversity in my opinion.
3 -
David was not written to be gay originally (probably wasn't at least).
It was a recent addition in a previous tome.
I read the entries and I will say the way David was taken by the entity was actually pretty nice though.
Otherwise, I have heard Bhvr had actually made one of the original survivors with the thought of them being gay, but scrapped it. But who knows.
0 -
I wonder, was there any actual meaningful lore even?
0 -
Yeah... I'm not exactly sure if "hey look, he is now gay, this is great right?" is proper way to have diversity to be honest...
2 -
I know. I just felt like it was a relevant point to David's character in general since this detail wasn't just presented in his lore but also announced publicly.
2 -
To quote our queen and savior Quinta B. People be gay.
6 -
considering the definition of gay is in regards to sexual orientation not romantic attraction and that there are other terms to relate to romantic attraction separate from sexual attraction, i think it speaks for itself.
however if it makes you feel better you can replace it with david wants to marry another man or engage in romantic interactions with another amn if that somehow makes the point being made any different.
I get the impression your just trying to be snarky for the sake of being so and thus feel no reason to engage further with you, as an actual dialogue even if with differing opinions doesnt seem to be what your interested in and thus is a waste of my time.
2 -
Yes absolutely. I've played a few story driven games where these elements were simply there within the story and never emphasized or treated differently than anyone else in the game. It just happened naturally.
0 -
He became gay when it became lucrative for him to be gay.
Post edited by Gary_Coleman on1 -
No that was their words but they also said he had a girlfriend. Just stating a possible explanation in addition to the other ones.
0 -
Obviously. Just a potential explanation they can have in addition to the other ones, even after the fact of what they said. Just like him going from having a girlfriend to gay, they can tie them together with the "oh he's Bi" excuse to try and cover their tracks.
0 -
There was never really an implication that he was gay though, or questioning his identity - that's what I think they meant by ret-con.
It just kinda came out of nowhere, and was hardly if ever alluded in his lore. Feels kinda lame
2 -
There were always implications that David had a problematic relationship with his parents without the reason being explicitly stated and other stuff in the lore that can be explained with him being gay.
it would have been a ret-con if it was stated he was straight before. But that wasn’t the case.
if people want to complain about ret-cons, then they should complain about Legions tome or i think Nurse tome, which actually ret-conned lore. But these people actually only have a problem with ret-conns when it’s about LGBTQ+ topics. I am not wondering why..
4 -
They also made a public announcement of Wraith and Nurse being a thing. I think it was even with a valentines e-card or something.
so.. they actually announced and advertised a heterosexual relationship between playable characters. Which also was mentioned in their cosmetic descriptions iirc.
4 -
Otherwise, I have heard Bhvr had actually made one of the original survivors with the thought of them being gay, but scrapped it. But who knows.
as far as i know, it wasn’t scrapped but it was just not officially revealed who it was as they still said at that time that they wanted to leave anything related to sexual orientations open. (Though as we all know they still had multiple heterosexual relationships at that point…. But those people that now say the way they are handling it isn’t ‚equality‘ didn’t say anything back then…)
so… actually it could have been David all along. We will probably never know. In the end, only what’s stated directly in game/lore is what is official. David is gay, it was never stated otherwise and it doesn’t contradict anything in lore at all. People should accept it and move on instead of finding excuses to be against it.
4 -
Posting this here for context regarding this topic:
I think introducing the Archives is what put most things in motion, as they are a more in depth look at the characters' lore.
Also this doesn't deny the possibility that some characters were originally written with a specific sexual orientation by their creators, it was just never specified before (besides some cases like Wraith and Nurse for example).
7 -
Yeah I always thought with the archives and tome story’s it would really feel weird if they still tried to leave out anything about romantical relationships, sexual orientation or sexual identity etc. At some point - even if not confronted about it two years ago- BHVR would have reviewed this standpoint naturally anyways.
I am still very happy about this statement though 🌈
3 -
Obligatory Birb post by your resident Rainbow Birb fan.
(I need to make more versions)
9 -
A still image of wraith and nurse in a dance pose on valentines day (which showed purchasable cosmetics for them) is not the same as giving special attention to a character solely on the basis of their sexuality. There was no celebration or official announcement of their sexuality. To compare those 2 things as if they were the same is a bit of a stretch. Valentines day in the secular sense is a day to celebrate love. The wraith and nurse picture can be interpreted as symbolic of love and doesn't limit it to be exclusively symbolic of only heterosexual relationships. Announcing David's sexuality the way they did set him apart from everyone else and made it an exclusive thing about him to celebrate. Unless every character going forward is going to have their sexuality announced in the same way, there is no equality there. Diversity, equality and inclusion does not celebrate or emphasize one thing over another. If you feel they did this in the past with other characters in the context of heterosexuality, then other sexualities should be treated in like manner. Announcing and celebrating David's sexuality was not done in like manner like in the wraith and nurse picture that you think was an announcement of a heterosexual relationship.
1 -
Birb! 💜💙💚💛🧡❤️
(yes, more versions are needed)
4 -
There's never any way of doing this that doesn't 'feel lame' for some people.
You can't say an existing character is gay because then it's a retcon, you can't introduce a brand new character and say they're gay because now it's tokenism and that's all that character exists for. There will always be something to find fault in.
Yet heterosexual characters never have any problems like this. You can introduce an opposite-sex partner for any character and nobody bats an eye. Which just goes to show that this representation is far from being unnecessary.
Until we can all go "hey that's neat, moving on" whenever a character is revealed to be anything other than heteronormative, then it doesn't matter how it's implemented, it needs to be implemented.
The very fact that months after the update this is still being debated, is just all kinds of disappointing.
6 -
Literally like the fact people still won't shut up about how he wasn't really gay not my David can't stand these LGHDTVs etc is just more proof as to why we absolutely need representation lmfao
4 -
Have to say, LGHDTV is one of the funnier plays on the acronym. I know that was in bad faith, but it did crack me up.
4 -
LGHDTVBBQ sauce on my titties is probably the funniest thing I will ever say actually
4 -
Depends on what you mean, lore-wise or IRL-wise.
He was not originally stated to be gay and that was changed recently.
Lore-wise, he's always been gay.
1 -
People think David's sexuality was a retcon because they assumed he was straight all these years. It wasn't a retcon. It was an addition to his lore. Because this happened 5 years after his release and his lore implied he was straight by mentioning girl friends, its going to take some time before people realize it wasn't a retcon. Even still, I think there will always be people who think it was. Leaving things like this in the air for so long only makes it harder for it to be accepted when it happens.
4 -
You will always find something about inclusion and representation of LGBTQ+ that’s different than heterosexual relationships. Just being LGBTQ+ is being different, and it’s being differently viewed and commented on by society in any case. You don’t come out as straight, it would not make sense to ‚reveal‘ a character as straight and it’s not expected by anyone reasonably. I think the movie ‚Love, Simon‘ expressed this in a great way (about heterosexual teens coming out as heterosexual to their parents) - it doesn’t make sense to demand this kind of equality.
it’s rather about equal treatment in the sense of finally not being explicitly excluded. This is the greatest and most important aspect of inclusion. And this is also the reason why they emphasized David’s reveal. (That and the fact they are collaborating with GaymerX)
Diversity, equality and inclusion does not celebrate or emphasize one thing over another.
And they didn’t do this with David being gay. It wasn’t about gay over straight. At all.
and I can tell you that people would be raging if they ever revealed a still image of two male characters dancing as a still image on Valentine’s Day without any other lore context.
5 -
I've seen lgbt characters before in other games that are story driven that were simply there and a part of the story like every other character in it. For David's case it felt like he was set apart due to his sexuality in my opinion. I have never seen the sexuality of a character announced and celebrated the same way David's was. That is why, to me, it felt as such.
1 -
He was set apart. Because they have been explicitly excluding anything LGBTQ+ related. His inclusion ended this (before they have only talked about it to the point it almost felt like queerbaiting and added charms which were nice but definitely not enough as far as actual inclusion goes)
have you also talked about how heterosexual relationships were treated differently all those years before? You seem very active now and seem to care about equal treatment. I really hope that’s not only the case for one direction?
4 -
They made him gay for woke points
3 -
Do you also have to say anything with meaning or did you just want to throw around buzzwords?
7 -
What
7 -
I actually do hope future lgbt characters in dbd are introduced the same way a non lgbt character would be. When they release the first new original survivor that is lgbt I don't think many people are going to make a big deal about it if their sexuality isn't announced separately. Also as I said in other games I have played, lgbt characters were introduced the same way other characters were so they weren't treated differently. I'd mention them but they involve story spoilers incase someone may not have played them yet.
0 -
Ah, yes, that’s the reason. Not the fact that people that fall under the acronym finally got to see a proper and decent representation in a way that actually makes sense and doesn’t insult the character or the community at large.
Post edited by Rizzo on3 -
I bet the creators of those games haven’t said they won’t add LGBTQ+ content before though, have they?
context is important.
1 -
If you think everyone that is gay, lesbian, bi, trans, ace, etc. is and wants that just to make horny drawings of fictional characters, you are rather shortsighted, I must say.
Post edited by Rizzo on7 -
I still think if BHVR had one stance before and a different one now concerning this they still could do it in more subtle ways and it still be meaningful. I think its less controversial when characters are introduced with this known about them rather than having it be something revealed about them years later. I do get that since the roster didn't have a character previously introduced as such it makes having the first one be behind a paywall open for criticism as well so perhaps now that won't be thrown at the first original lgbt survivor.
0 -
I also don't draw porn of a fictional character what's your point #ProudToNotBeScaredOfGayPeople
If you're reducing lgbt+ identities to nothing but porn then that's actually um what we call ✨homophobia✨ and is a very popular anti-lgbt ✨dogwhistle✨. What's next you bring out the ✨groomer✨ line?
Post edited by Rizzo on6 -
No, they made him gay for easy brownie points.
It was easier than making a new, original character.
2 -
It’s not easier. Actually I would argue it’s harder as they have to make sure to not make contradicting lore and it still needing to feel connected etc.
also, it’s already been confirmed there will be new, original LGBTQ+ characters introduced in the future.
2 -
If the next character that is lgbt is introduced the same way all the previous characters were introduced, I won't take issue with it. Make the character cool with an awesome cinematic to introduce them with. Make their perks interesting and give them awesome cosmetics. That is what sells the characters the most in my opinion.
0 -
Lock the topic now mods.
Obviously this fanbase is too homophobic to be able to discuss this with civility.
And I'm fed up of being a 'topic of debate'.
2 -
0
-
We actually have seen this with Legions tome. While in the backstory it was at least implied Julie had a crush on Frank, the tome changed this into Frank and Julie being a hot thing! Literally no one had a problem with this retconn that revealed part of the sexual orientation of a character that wasn’t implied in the initial lore. Especially not KateMain86.
2 -
English isn’t my first language. That doesn’t change the fact the the majority of people can still tell that my response made sense. I guess this is more a you-problem than a me-problem.
4 -
He wasn't always gay lol. It was a title slapped on him recently.
0
