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Off The Record is useful for exactly 2 things
And those are getting yourself killed, and giving the killer free STBFL stacks
If you body-block with OTR, you become effectively defenceless, meaning that the killer has literally zero reason to not chase and down you, especially when DS does basically nothing now, and if they have STBFL, you are giving them a free stack, meaning you screw your teammates over, unless the killer is a m1 killer and you are the Obsession, do not bodyblock if you think they have STBFL
Off The Record is bad, it either does nothing of note, encourages survivors to effectively go AFK and not do anything for 80 seconds, or actively screws over your teammates, so i propose a rework to it
instead of making it give a endurance effect for 80 seconds when you get unhooked, make it give endurance for 15 seconds when all generators are completed, sort of like how Adrenaline heals you and gives you a speed boost, it synergises with Adrenaline, doesn't ######### over yourself or your teammates, doesn't encourage going AFK just to get the endurance hit, and even works thematically with what Zarina does as well (You have all of the information, now you just need to get the hell out of there)
I realise asking for OTR to get reworked right after it got changed is a bit much, but it's current version is laughably dumb and a complete meme, so i think it's warranted
Edit: Apparently OTR is meant to be a anti-tunnel perk, that'd be great if it actually worked like that, too bad a killer with half a braincell will continue chasing you because they can still see you, a problem made worse if they have Bloodhound or the game's gone on for a while, old DS was better for anti-tunnel due to stunning the killer for longer and not requiring you to mend afterwards, and BT is better for providing Endurance, a anti-tunnel perk that does not discourage tunnelling 90% of the time but instead rewards the killer for tunnelling if they have STBFL is not a good anti-tunnel perk, and you cannot convince me to the contrary
Comments
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Wait, what?
You are complaining current OTR is weak and meme perk and you are reworking it to end game perk which will work for only 15 seconds?
Sorry but your version looks terrible and not worth to use it while we have better option: Adrenaline.
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I just find it funny how, unless you're extremely killer biased, anybody can call this a proper meta shakeup. It's just objectively not.
BT and Off the Record are better, but I'd say BT is the only one TRULY useful at this point. Off the Record has gotten a good buff, but it's still whatever if everyone does bring BT.
What any other perk that got reworked got substantially buffed and is worth using over old meta?
NONE lol
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it'd be better then a perk that encourages survivors to be either suicidal or give the killer free pressure by doing nothing for a minute and a 3rd that's for damn sure
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OTR is amazing when used as an anti-tunneling perk. The things you mentioned only occur when people throw the game to harass the Killer. That doesn't mean the perk isn't a great anti-tunneling perk.
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If I understand correctly, OTR is bad because it "encourages survivors to afk" for 80s?
But ... I want to say ... if they want to play in "ninja" mode ... it's only and purely their fault, eh ...
And it means that they didn't understand that the principle of this invulnerability is to be able to escape, to reach a safe place, to heal, and to go back to the game.
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...Off The Record is for anti-tunnel, not bodyblocking.
You're right, if you bodyblock with it you're defenceless. Don't do that.
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So because someone suicide, you decided to nerf only good anti-tunnel perk atm? What survivors should do if killer decide tunnel? Die and dodge to next game?
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A great anti-tunneling perk would be pre 6.1.0 DS, current OTR is laughably bad in comparison to that
even when combined with current DS, OTR does not do enough to discourage tunneling, if anything it encourages it because you'll stuck in deep wound with no other endurance perks to help you, and as i said, if you use it for anti-tunneling and they have STBFL, you are giving them free stacks if you're not the obsession
in what world does a good anti-tunnel perk not only give the killer zero incentive to not chase you, but also gives them free perk value?
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I've used both pre 6.1 DS and post 6.1 OTR. Post 6.1 OTR is miles better.
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Maybe I misunderstood how OTR behaves after this patch.
If a survivor who has OTR gets unhooked, but takes a protection hit, what happens? Does he go into deep wound, or directly into dying state?
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Shame that the so called "Anti-Tunnel" perk does basically nothing to actually discourage tunneling
best case scenario you'll get a regular chase with the killer after it goes off, worst case you give the killer free STBFL stacks
again, in what world does a "Anti-Tunnel" perk not only not discourage tunnelling, but also gives them free perk value?
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Your best case scenario is it literally working as an anti-tunnel tool. That's what they're supposed to do.
"A regular chase with the killer" is exactly what an anti-tunnel tool aims to achieve. Tunnelling isn't a problem just because you're getting chased again too quickly, it's a problem because post-unhook you're at your most vulnerable and have the least agency in preventing a down- which is what OTR fixes, because at minimum you get hit and get to reposition afterwards, and if you have some LoS breakers you can use it to its fullest effect too.
As for STBFL, it's not special, any M1 perk will proc off any Endurance effect, including the one you get as basekit. That's a weird argument I don't fully understand.
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Look, Off The Record is gonna be strong simply because of how long it lasts. Unlike BT and Guardian which are strictly anti-tunnel because they last no more than 15-20 seconds, Off The Record is a win-more perk. You can get unhooked, have a teammate heal you, 60 seconds later you body block for a teammate about to go down, and then you take another hit. That's a health state that you basically got for free, and in SWF that can be used to devastating effect. If it didn't deactivate in endgame, every survivor would be running it.
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I enjoy Off the Record. Best perk to counter tunneling in a long time, even better than old Borrow Time and Decisive Strike combine. Now I have two health stats coming off the hook and get Iron Will on top.
Sure the Killer can still tunnel me. But now I get to play a chase with a second health stat. This is as you already said, a regular chase. Except that I have Iron Will without having Iron Will and can still bring 3 more perks to annoy the hell out of the Killer. And as a cherry on top: Unlike DS you can not just slug it out. Either you let me go or we play that game.
"It feeds STBFL". Well, this is an argument. But first and foremost: Not every Killer brings that one perk. Sure some do, but not all. Then you can be the obsession and actually cost the Killer more stacks with this perk, you may even use "For the People" (or another Obsession focus perk) to force this.
If somebody uses it for bodyblocking then they are just dumb. This is the same as people using Borrow Time to bodyblock...you deserve to go down to the Killer for that.
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Personally I don’t even think an Endurance effect is fitting for OTR thematically. They just need to revert the DS stun nerf. Keep it disabled in endgame, and maybe even make pallet/flashlight saves (not just blinding the killer in chase) count as conspicuous actions too if it needs to be weakened in some other way.
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It gives you 80s of endurance twice per game
It gives you pre-nerf iron will for 80 seconds
It gives you 80s of no aura reading
The perk isn't bad, people are just using it wrong. It seems BHVR doesn't want perks that actively 'punish' for tunnelling, instead they make perks that heavily discourage you from doing it - OTR makes you hard to chase, hard to find with aura perks and gives you a second chance if the killer is close to the hook
If not for the changes to how endurance stacking works, I'd say it was overtuned but since they fixed that issue the perk is fine.
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Honestly... relying on teammates to bring BT wasn't a good thing so OTR is just a self BT that gets use every time you get unhooked
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What are you talking about? Maybe don't run up to the killer and take a hit if your only defense is OtR? Just heal up, get away from the killer and get on a gen. It works great as long as you dont get hit right off hook, and even then if you manage to lose the killer you now have aura reading protection and 100% IW till you perform a conspicuous action.
The perk is fine.
Except against Nurse Blight, Slinger with STBFL, Demo with STBFL, Spirit, Wraith can catch up without a problem, if you get hit off hook you're dead.
But other than that, it's great. Besides, that's only a problem if you get unhooked in the killers face.
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The main reason why i think OTR sucks as a anti-tunnel perk even when it works is down to 2 things, the buffs to killer-basekit, and the nerf to Iron Will and survivor-basekit
when the killer hits you and OTR goes off they'll still be able to see you, compare this to DS where the killer was animation locked, and could be blinded with a flashlight, then add old IW onto that and you would practically disappear if the killer wasn't running Bloodhound, the killer can very easily track you down after OTR goes off, and since they know where you're going they can either ignore you, meaning the perk actually worked, or chase you, making the perk completely wasted, this is compounded by the faster swing recovery and break speed, as well as the decreased distance you make after getting hit, as well as the fact that IW is basically useless now, and even if OTR does work and the killer does decide to leave you alone, you still have to mend afterwards, wasting time, old and even current DS didn't have that problem, as soon as it was used, you could escape and get back to doing the objective, with OTR you have to waste more time getting rid of deep wounds before you can actually be useful to the team again
It wouldn't be nearly as bad if it didn't give you deep wound and if DS was actually useful, but unfortunately this patch basically buffed tunnelling and made the only 2 perks that are meant to discourage it either worthless or awful at it's job
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The point of Off the Record is supposed to be to give you a chance to get to a safe distance with better stealth and heal to full before getting back on gens. If a survivor is wasting a lot of time going for bodyblocks they’re wasting it.
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Wait, why is the nerf to Iron Will relevant? OTR gives you the old Iron Will effect, you don't need to pair it with IW. You already have it.
As for your example, if they chase you the perk is not wasted because it's already done its job. It's already prevented you from going down immediately, and it's given you the opportunity to play out a regular chase with the killer, albeit with Deep Wound. That's if they hit you straight away, too, which isn't a guarantee; most killers are gonna wait out the five second basekit Endurance, which means there's a decent chance you've reached a loop and can eke out a little more time before that hit even connects.
Yes, the post-hit sprint is shorter, but that doesn't stop this from being a far better anti-tunnel perk than DS ever was. It actually lets you play out the chase normally, instead of just losing the chase and getting to stun the killer briefly.
This patch did not buff tunnelling. That take is very very silly.
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You're complaining about having to mend after successfully escaping the Killer with OTR?
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Interesting. I've been using OTR all morning and it was very useful. Saved me more than once and allowed me to save a teammate or two.
I must be using it wrong.
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the nerf to IW is relevant because old IW was infinite and active the entire game, OTR giving you that same effect doesn't matter because it's not only on a timer, a very generous one sure, but a timer nonetheless, and the killer can still see you, your blood, and your scratch marks, if they run Bloodhound, that problem only becomes more obvious, especially on maps like Eyrie of Crows where most survivors are really easy to spot, or during endgame when most of the pallets have been used up, OTR giving old IW and no aura reading does so little to actually discourage the killer from tunnelling you it's laughable, if anything they encourage survivors to play immersed for 80 seconds, which is it's own problem
Old DS was far superior to current OTR due to 2 things, it stopping you from getting hooked, and the fact that killers HAD to play around the fact that you might have it, old DS stunned the killer for a lot longer then the current swipe animation as well, meaning that you would make more distance from Old DS then you would current OTR, especially when factoring in STBFL, being downed or in a locker with DS active was a significantly better scenario to be in over being injured with OTR because of that, you can recover health states, you can't recover hook states, DS was more useful because it stopped you from being hooked once, which was very, very good, OTR doesn't do that, once you go down, you're going to get hooked unless a teammate is quick on the draw with a flashlight or toolbox
and yes, this patch was a buff to tunnelling, the basekit changes combined with a nerf to the only good Anti-Tunnelling perk are indirect buffs to tunnelling
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I have seen multiple people using OTR and it plays out like this, every single time. They bodyblock the killer, the killer tunnels them, they don't have DS, they die.
Honestly, Endurance is the perfect example of something meant to be used for you to use that time to get far away, since the killer will assume you have it and chase the savior. But people choose to abuse it, and use it as a means to block a hit for someone else, which isn't inherently a bad idea, but that probably wasn't its intent. Having a perk that lets you take a hit doesn't mean you should go out of your way to attempt to take one.
Now, different story if it's a 4 sec basekit BT or you're not actively running toward a killer otherwise ignoring you.
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I use off the record with deliverance works very well.
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What you countered with your argument is also what I don't understand from some people's takes. OTR is not supposed to make you invulnerable from tunneling; it's supposed to give you a chance for a second chase when someone tries to tunnel and camp you.
On that, it succeeds admirably. Before, it was get hit nearly immediately off hook. Now, it's if I get hit I still have a chance to get away with a built in IW and I get to do something. The odds of escaping a tunneler off hook just increased significantly.
I really don't understand either why some people are claiming tunneling was buffed this patch.
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OTR helping with getting camped makes a lot more sense then it being "anti-tunnel", since it actually does help a lot in those scenarios, the problem being, why run OTR when BT already does what it does but better? the 10seconds of extra movement speed and endurance is a lot more practical and useful then 80 seconds of endurance, and being silent and invisible to aura reading, those last 2 parts just encourage survivors to play like immersed blendettes for 80 seconds, any quite frankly, anything that encourages playing like a immersed blendette for any length of time should just not exist
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Hey, at least they managed to shake up the meta!
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I agree with that. I'd start with info. Kindred basekit. I'm also for increasing time on hook to 80 as well to compensate for the slower gen times. That would mean camping = throwing the game. Should be fair now that gens take longer and chases take shorter.
Open Handed + Kindred is kinda gross though.
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It's basically 46% reduction, closer to 9 stacks than anything. And of course, the further you reduce the number, the stronger the effect gets. But couple that with a nerf to speedboost and many killers become inescapable monsters. I still think it's too early to revert anything yet. I'm extremely curious about what changes they'll make before and during the coming chapter.
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I get chased for longer than BT lasts if the Killer doesn't smack me straight off the hook and I don't have to chance the unhooker having BT or not having BT. If they have it great; it'll help me get away faster. If not, I van still get away.
Those people you're describing aren't using it effectively; OTR is to help you get away or buy enough time to do gens. If a survivor is not being chased they need to do gens (after bring healed if that's the right call). The survivors you describe are throwing the game in favour of the Killer and should eventually lose enough their MMR drops.
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