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The only thing I dislike about this update is the strength of slowdown perks
While I like the update, unfortunately for killer, the meta before was slowdown stacking, and the meta now is still slowdown stacking. In my opinion, slowdown should can grouped in to two categories, "general" slowdown that works on everyone and doesn't have very specific activation requirements, and "specific" slowdown, that works better on certain killers than others.
I feel we need to tone these slowdowns down, so that stacking them is not considered the best strategy. "Specific" slowdown that is overbuffed ends up with things like forever Legion and forever Plague. DMS on artist, etc. "General" slowdown that is overbuffed ends up with complimenting these specific slowdown in almost all builds, and being more attractive to stack rather than to simply use information builds.
Here are the changes I'd make right now:
- Thanatophobia reduced to 4% per stack, max 16%. This speeds up max stack gens from 115 seconds down to 107 seconds, which should be noticeable. Also note this perks slows down cleaning speeds for some reason, making it even stronger together with Pentimento. I think this can be removed but that's just me.
- Pain Resonance reduced to 10%. This is the strongest "general" slowdown perk in the game. You could make the loud noise notification come back if you wanted to, but I feel that it giving both info as well as slowdown in one only further promotes not running info but instead stacking slowdown.
- Eruption incapacitated reduced to 15 seconds. As many have pointed out, this is mainly nasty in solo queue, without punishing SWFs as much. 10% is fine, but the incapacitated is crippling, and very difficult to counter as a solo player.
- Overcharge increased to 100%-200%. It's a minor buff, this perk is a niche perk that's fine imo, just feels weird that it starts off with worse regression than a normal kick.
There are a few perks I'm not sure of since I haven't played against or with them much. Pentimento, Gift of Pain, Jolt, so I can't comment on them, but it's Thana+Pain Res that seems to be the new meta. DMS and Floods of Rage are both specific slowdown, but I think they're mostly fine.
Other than that I'd remove hook grabs from healthy state, but this wouldn't solve facecamping using power and addons. Still a step in the right direction. I get that hook grabs are there to punish late rescues, but I just don't find them rewarding for the survivor nor the killer. It feels awful to get grabbed, and the whole game goes down the drain because of it when the survivor on hook goes to death hook as well as yourself being hooked. And it feels awful to tryhard for a grab but get validated, or miss, or whatever, and then you're forced to trade, even though they were late for the hook. Removing hook grabs would remove these unsatisfying situations and mean killers have to rely on injuring survivors to prevent trades rather than getting a grab.
In the endgame, this would also mean that if many survivors are coming for a rescue, you're in trouble. But if you haven't killed anyone by endgame now, that's your own fault. Plus you should try to place survivors far from gates.
What do you all think?
Comments
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Slowdown meta isn´t as oppresive as most people think. Even stacked, the perks are okayish. I´ve played solo against full slowdown build, killer got 5 hooks during the whole match. 3 man escape.
So it pretty much looks like what we had before the patch. Only difference are the people that are refusing to play normal.
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My main issue is that they said they wanted to make regression perks weaker but Ruin is the only one to get a sizeable nerf. PR is definitely weaker now but still an amazing option. Jolt and eruption are both very strong regression options on top of the old ones as well
Don’t really get all the thana complaining though. It’s annoying but the perk is hardly much stronger
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Hate to say it but that doesn't sound like a good player.
4 slowdown perks and he still only gets 5 hooks? That's definitely the Killer equivalent of a Survivor using DH to hit a wall.
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The thana complain is simply people jumping on a bandwagon. 0,5% increase is barely noticeble. But those threads look like its a 50% buff.
Old slowdown meta perks were all nuked.
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To be fair, he had a private profile. So i´m inclined to think that you´re right. That it just was a survivor main, who wanted to switch roles and try the OP killer role.
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0.5% sounds like so little when you put it that way. So let's put it another way. Thataphobia with 4 stacks last patch would be 100 seconds on gens. That's a while, 20 seconds longer. Thanatophobia after the update is 115 seconds on gen. That's a lot.
The gens being 10 seconds longer plus the 2% total buff adds another 5 seconds onto the existing 20 seconds Thana used to give, making gens take 25 seconds longer. On TOP of 90 seconds. It's actually very significant. And remember, coupled with Pain Res, that time may be just enough to get a hook and slow a crucial gen down even more.
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Corrupt wasn’t nuked on the killers who actually needed it like Myers trapper or hag. Ruin was actually gutted so that’s fair, Pop is worse but still amazing and even slightly better if the gen is nearly done, PR is still meta without question
So besides ruin I don’t see it
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It's because of the math behind it. 'It's only a 2% buff, no one notices it' isn't the whole picture.
Before, with 80 second gens and 4 stacks of Thana, a single gen took 96 seconds.
Now, after patch, a 90 second gen with 4 stacks of Thana takes 115 seconds. That's 19 seconds longer per gen using the exact same scenario. It gets exponentially longer with other recently popular perks like gift of pain and penti.
Plus, Thana is everywhere right now. It used to be niche for a few killers, but now everyone and their mom runs it.
So instead, it feels like base gen speed went from 80 seconds to 115 overnight.
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If Thana currently had the old values for a maximum of 20% slowdown, gens would take 113s. 2 more seconds.
So the 0.5% buff is indeed negligible, but similarly also unnecessary.
A nerf to 4% would be fine though.
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No one complain Thana alone, no one.
- They question about why Thana gets a buff then Gen time gets buff
- Unless Thana gets buffed to be absolute broken, only Legion & Plague will use Thana.
Remember that is not about 115sec Gen (yes, from 400sec Gen to 575sec Gen over a night, with only Thana). Its about the average of 20sec mending time (2-3 survivors get hit from Frenzy) once every minutes. Its about permanently 22% when vs Plague.
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Killers have realised the gens are still just as fast as before and survivors are realising it as well so there's no reason not to run slowdown.
I know I haven't stopped using them else 3 gens pop super fast still and I tried to not use slowdowns on patch day and got gen rushed when I didn't.
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That sounds nice on paper. But unless you are playing against Legion, how often are all 4 survivors injured at the same time? Regardless, Prove Thyself + Overzealus is a great counter for the slower gens.
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Please see above. Unless you play against Legion, its unlikely that all 4 survivors are constantly injured while doing gens.
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You can delete thana from the game if you want to. This perk is so strange to me, prior to this patch it was considered trash on every killer who couldn't discourage survivors from healing. Green medkits, CoH, BK, Desperate Measures, WGLF. All are perks that can help you get people up and healed asap(scale of 10 seconds or under per heal). Thana was bad because the logic is survivors will just heal and drop thana down to 1-2 stacks max(let's be honest 1-2 stack is nothing). Not a single soul complained about it on the forums nor about this dreaded pentimento + thana combo that anyone could have done in the past. Now I see "forever x" describing any killer who runs thana alone. Just heal.
That said I don't play legion or plague and I still think the old logic is true, if you cannot hurt/down/hook survivors faster then they can heal then you're gonna be in trouble. I seriously doubt .2 seconds off injured speed boost and .3 seconds off blade wipe time suddenly turned every killer into an injuring God who you can't heal against.
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115 seconds is only on 4 stacks. why would survivor have 4 survivors injured constantly at all times against a perk that specifically is designed to get countered by healing.
If you want to rework perk and think its oppressive for generators, rework the perk to give 5.5% action debuff to healing only. Now legion and plague won't get much value out of the perk and the perk will be more specialized for anti-heal builds.
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They wouldn't have nerfed some slowdown and buffed others if the developers themselves weren't fully aware slowdown is necessary. If you're going to stack slowdown perks you're still sacrificing other perks/builds that would be far more beneficial to you. If by some random miracle slowdown wasn't necessary, then it would create a lot more unique build variety, which would bring its own new strength to a lot of killers as well. Might even be more unfun.
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