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Reducing the gap between solo-queue and SWF. First proposition (probably easy to do).
One information all groups have is when a survivor is being chased.
Make it so a chased survivor's icon gives some notification to tell he is in a chase.
It's already the case for the obsession, extend it for everyone.
Comments
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Very simple. I would not be completely opposed to this.
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That seems like a fair adjustment and I like the thought process behind it. Running along the same lines, It’d be helpful to see how many meters a survivor is away from a hook, possibly letting you know if someone is running to the rescue. Utilizing this with your idea, it’d also let us know whether the person closest to the hook is being chased by the killer.
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Thanks.
Yes indeed, some way to tell "I'm going" or by extension "I'm on a gen", would be useful too.
Ideally it should be automatic to avoid trolls. But I have no idea how to make the "I'm going" reliably so I guess manual is the way.
"I'm on a gen" could be automated though.
I had another suggestion to give some vague idea of the killer whereabouts relatively to a survivor (without the need of a chase). I don't know if you have seen it.
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That isn't information all groups have. That's information that voice communication groups have. Bridging the gap between solo and SWF just means making it easier to find a stable group of people to be in your group.
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It has been suggested before that non-obsession icons have the 2 smaller entity claws around them so there is a visual shaking indication when they are being chased.
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Yes, this should absolutely be a thing. There's no reason for this designation to only exist for the obsession.
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You could do that and give people base after care bond and kindred and they'll be at the level at swf but all your games will be camping and tunneling. Why not just nerf swf to the level of solo then buff Survivors
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Because comms are a thing and will not be made illegal by BHVR, so the only way is to push solo up.
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As a solo queue player 99% with just about 7k hours, I absolutely endorse this! :D Thank you for posting, hopefully something so simple can be implemented with ease!
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BHVR also said the game isn't balanced around voice communication, and BHVR said that game never should be balanced around voice communication.
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This might be an unpopular opinion, but I hope they never bring voice communication to the game. I understand the value it would bring in terms of information, but I think at base level it would severely take away that feeling of (game-appropriate) helplessness that adds to the healthy vibe of horror and dread for the survivor role.
I recognize there is an extremely fine line between when that level of helplessness can be thrilling or incredibly frustrating as a solo player. That is why I think OP's suggestion is spot on! It adds an incredible-yet-simple amount of information without taking away that feeling of "Ok... seems safe now. I'll go for the save since so-and-so is being chased somewhere." As a solo player, I would much rather the game subtly give me that information instead of randoms screaming in their mic that I'm an idiot for not saving quick enough or for making a decision they didn't understand or couldn't see why lol.
I personally hope BHVR continues to leave voice communication in the "no" cabinet :)
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Because you can't nerf SWF. There's no way to stop people from using third-party comms. Even if they wanted to ban it, they literally can't. If you were incredibly invasive and also wanted to wreck the game's performance, you could write a script that looks for Discord or Skype, or even Steam's messaging function, but how do you detect people who are on a phone call, or in the same room together?
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Give swf an action speed nerf depending on how many players are in the swf it's way simpler a
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This thing
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Then you're screwing over casuals and friend groups that aren't using comms. Not all SWFs are god squads where that kind of treatment is merited, so unless you're also looking at individual player MMR when you implement action speed nerfs (and that is immediately vulnerable to smurfing), you're going to make the game impossible for average SWFs. Not to mention, information and action speed aren't equal contributors and they can absolutely be more or less important than the other in individual games, and stacking baked in action speed nerfs with action speed nerfing perks sounds like an absolutely miserable experience, regardless of whether it's actually balanced or not. Who wants to spend three minutes on a single gen?
The way forward has always been giving solo at least part of what comms has, and then killer buffs to match. We just got killer buffs without solo buffs and the result is fairly painful.
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If people want to bridge the gap between solo and voice comm SWFs, then they should say so. But people shouldn't say they want to bridge the gap between solo and SWF, and then recommend things that only voice comm SWFs have.
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For reference they already announced in January they want to add icons to the HUD for survivors to see what the other survivors are doing. It just got delayed because of everything else in the pipeline this year. I’m sure it’ll be back eventually though.
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I agree :) The suggested chase icon is just enough information for me to confidently say that would improve solo by a lot! Voice communications for all survivors is just not something I want to see implemented. I personally foresee way more problems if that happens.
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Let's put aside the playing field leveling and the frequency of usage of comms.
This feature exists already for the obsession. What would be the downside of extending it to everyone?
If there is one, how significant is it?
As killer, letting know that I'm chasing a specific survivor has only a minor downside. (And, thinking about it, may probably be used in mind-games)
As solo survivor, it allows to better coordinate with strangers. In fact, it helps every kind of groups but the ones in comm who already have that feature (and more). I don't mind helping a casual SWF4. The only SWF who don't need help are the SWATs.
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There has been several discussions on that theme. I don't recall the announce specifically nor if there were details in it.
There was a suggestion about telling a survivor to go help others in some situations. It was proposed independently by several players. One even made some very nice icons/messages suggestions.
(Among others ...)
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I still think that any icons or information added to the game should be available for all 5 players. If additional icons "really aren't a big deal", then let the killer see them too. If it would be "too unbalanced" for the killer to see an icon, then maybe it really is a big deal and solo q shouldn't get it.
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Can you give an example?
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If the game should have "mini icons" for non obsessions, so that survivors know if anyone is in chase, then let the killer see these icons too, to make it easier to deal with bully survivors that purposely pick the same characters and outfits.
If the game should have icons to let survivors know who is repairing a generator, or cleansing a totem, or other stuff like that, then let the killer see the icons too. If it's "no big deal" to let survivors see these icons, then let the killer see them too.
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I know you weren't directly responding to me, but if I misunderstood the OPs original concept and your response to me, I apologize.
I would ONLY want the chase icon. Not necessarily all those hypothetical icons that were discussed earlier in the year. The chase icon alone would get he job done without being too much or too little, and there's no reason why all 5 players in the match shouldn't also see it. :)
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because you literally cant nerf swf unless you ban them for using discord or other communication services
that is the whole reason swf is so much better than soloQ
you can tell teammates that you are being chased and where
you can tell teammates what pallets you dropped
you can tell teammates that you are unhooking so the rest stays on gens
you can tell teammates what perks/add-ons the killer has
you can tell teammates literally everything
this disparity in knowledge and coordination is the reason swf is so much better than soloQ
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Well, give soloq players the effects, and anyone that's in a group doesn't get the effects
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No, that is not why SWF is better than solo q. That is why SWF WITH VOICE COMMS are better than solo q. Basekit SWF has the same in game communication is solo q.
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i have never seen anyone say swf and not mean the kind with voice comms...
ofc base kit swf has the same base communication, that doesnt mean that they arent using voice comms?
what? this is confusing me. why state the obvious?
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I'd rather we punish those people and have a healthier game and get swf down to where solos are and buff survivor as a whole rather than boosting solo which will boost swf
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It would probably just easier to code by making it apply to all survivors
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That ends up being a buff for swf though
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Because they are completely different goals. Bridging the gap between solo and SWF would be things like adding guilds, or some official game communities to find players to group up with. Or to allow people to flag themselves as wanting to find stable group members. Or some official way to message people (even if they are cross platform) so people can ask other people if they want to play more than one game. Or maybe some sort of honor system, so people that DC or give up often, get grouped up with other people that DC or give up often. Or it could mean having a button for survivors to group up with the same people during the next game, and all the survivors that hit this button will be auto grouped together for the next game.
But when people just want more game information, they basically want the benefits of voice communication, without actually being in a SWF.
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Non-comms SWF still has some advantages, like knowing each others' builds in advance, having a vague game plan set up going in (they're still better at teamwork than pure solo), and picking teammates so that you don't get stuck with noobs and throwers.
But when people complain about SWF, they're complaining about comms.
...because any other buff that you could give to solo would also be a buff to SWF? The only thing you can give solos that SWF wouldn't become even stronger from is what SWF already has.
Comms are here to stay. Nobody has to like that, but ignoring it or pretending it isn't important and that solos and comms can perform on the same level is how we got to the current mess of things.
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BHVR said the game will never be balanced around voice comms. People are using voice comms as an excuse to get solo q buffed. People aren't supposed to have the extra information that voice comms give.
Yes, non comms SWF has some advantages. And those are the things BHVR should be adding to solo q. Let solo q easily see the other survivors' perks and addons in the lobby screen. Allow all the survivors to chat to each other in the lobby, even if they are cross platform. Make it easier for players to find other people to group up with repeatedly. These are fair things to add to the game.
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Perks like situational awareness I swear are the reason they don't want to do it, which at this point rework information perks to either do more like how deja vu does or rework entirely.
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