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My humble opinion on the SOLOQ IS DESTROYED trend
I am a main killer so i will not lie, i might be kinda based. I play since the hag launch and the game got a lot of ups and downs to me till today, with killers being the most damaged role until this new patch.
After playing for such a long time I (i will not say as the whole killer community) felt that the killers had to create an tolerance skill, to the nerfs, the bullying and the game in general, the ones that didnt created that just stopped playing or switched roles (and thats fine tbh).
The last patch was an good patch overall to M1 killers, and some of us started to vent the older angers against survivors (it will get better with time), but since the patch dropped a lot of Influencers started to say that "Solo is dead because killer is too strong" no thats not true at all, some survivors were in a confortable position BEFORE the patch and were hard carried by perks, when they lost these advantages (to some extent) they couldnt deal with their lack of ability because they dont have the "tolerance skill" i said before, so they just DC, and just then the other survivors in SOLO Q cant win a trial. SWF just dc less overall because playing with friends gives you an certain amount of tolerance on its own.
TL DR: Solo q is being damaged not by the killers buffs, but by the survivors DCing
Comments
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Most of us already knew this, but forums are a little angst right now so careful who you share this secret with.
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Agreed.
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Of if we had a nickel for how often someone said, "I'm telling you." And the opinion that followed was awfully inaccurate, exaggerated, and often a downright lie.
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Like I posted on Otz's video today:
"you can blame on the survivors or the killer, you can blame on the maps or the perks, but one thing is for sure: the last update made it WAY WORSE for the game in general.
And I'm not hopeful about it like most of you are.
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well when i play a game there are survivors playing with me, this makes me part of it and capable to give an opinion. Soloq is getting damaged because other survivors DC not because of killers
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Ok but is he wrong? Nearly every game I’ve played, killer or survivor, some crybaby survivor main DC’s because he can’t last 20 seconds in chase without precious deadhard. Then the game is over. The games where the survivors DIDNT DC, it was a good match.
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@ImmersedNurse I couldn't agre more with you.
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And if solo queue is being destroyed because of solo teammates being awful would you not say that this is a problem with solo queue? Only exacernated by the most recent patch, yes, but it has still brought an underlying issue to light that the devs seem to have wanted to ignore for 5 years straight and only mentioned they were thinking about ways to address it in January 2022 with no further updates on this. And as the buffs have exacerbated the issues present within solo queue without a reliable fix (DCing isn't the only issue, btw, a complete void of information that's gotten by good SWF teams who can communicate well is also a major flaw with the design, which then means that strategies like camping and tunneling are substantially stronger vs solo than SWF so technically it is because of killers), would you not therefore argue that the buffs have played a major role in creating the issues people are now complaining about?
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Precisely.
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i stopped using dead hard before the nerf, you can just use lithe or sprint burst, if you dont want to use any exhaustion perk that is too situation based. This made learn the true value of pallets, how to use windows better and how to loop without creating dead zones (some people play dropping pallets and dont think other survs will need to get chased there later). Also you need to learn when to get downed on purpose and when to change hooks.
Being efficient as a surv requires skill, the killer needs to down you at some point of the game, that how it should be, as a survivor you just needs to give the down in a situation that doesnt benefit the killer, people think that one person should be able to loop the entire map or something lol
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take the things you see in the forum with a pinch of salt and just evaluate with your own gaming experience
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Using a broad brush isnt helpful, many 'killers' have been patient and sympathetic, my self included. But we lose patience when people start acting like the sky is falling.
It's not. Every soloQ fresh take isn't that fresh. This is cyclical and more updates will come. The game has not killed itself, legion is not a 4k machine.
We get that soloQ sucks, but when we can literally count threads where self-proclaimed Solo mains say they're going to just suicide and dc, we start to care less and less.
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I do, that's exactly why I wrote that.
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i can assure you that i also play survivors and i have them more upgraded than killer (if bloodpoint spent mean something). Main playing killer is not Monoplaying killer.
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I don't see how their point of view is unwarranted. From the killers perspective, they can clearly see the shift in the survivor side of things. One DC will have a domino effect that both sides feel in the same match. It seems like your own bias is getting in the way here.
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you are right soloQ demands are old, and the devs promised help in this regards but didnt turn it true yet. I dont want to void survivors from getting the soloQ buffs using my post, i just want to remind everyone that on this patch killers arent aiming to destroy solo players fun, they are just playing the game, solo Q is on a bad state now because of the DC and we are getting the blame
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First few days were bad indeed but i slowly getting better soloq games now it feels. Most of the time im loosing because my team (yes including me) is making dumb plays like unhooking in the killers face (seriously people stop doing this lol). I play both sides myself, more killer i would say and i think overall we got some healthy changes. However i do think the DS nerf was extremely unnecessary and the Thana buff a little bit overkill. On the other hand Nurse is just bs right now, seriously just disable her until you figured out how you can rework her.
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Survivors DCing is a symptom, I don't understand how people don't realize this. In fact, one of the biggest things you should look at for game health is how many survivors are DCing. If there's suddenly a lot of survivors DCing and Suiciding, then there's a reason these increased.
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I do play solo and I agree with him. Don't get me wrong; people who are having their MMR adjusted through loss after loss since the perks they used to help them don't work the same way anymore are having a terrible time and further things could be brought in such as a 10 second extension to hook timers at each stage but I really like the patch. DCing survivors and survivors suiciding on hook has a far more negative impact on the survivor experience than anything the patch did.
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i agree, the games RN are being bad for Solos because a player removes himself from the trial at the beginning making the rest of the trial too one sided.
The DC's are happenning by the lack of adaptation with the changes, and tolerance in general. Killers cant take the blame for being buffed because the buffs are needed against SWF (yet this small buffs aggravate the SoloQ experience it isnt the killers fault, you can still win a game if you dont DC and play the trial normally).
Survivors should get an patch that helps with information and coordination to soloQ but devs are still creating this. Please have patience and continue demanding those buffs in the forum, just dont go asking to nerf killers, because an majority of the roaster needs these changes to be playable
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I once said that some killers should get perks adjusted particularly, but nobody wanted to hear me, an Thana trapper isnt opressive as an Thana Nurse, so it would be healthier to adapt the perks to the killer.
Personally DS nerf was overkill. Thana buff isnt that bad (on some killers...)
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yeah i said the reason in the first post, they dont have an tolerance to play different but it will change over time.
More hook time for Solos is a good idea, and new gestures and icons for activities in game would help a lot. The game should adapt gen times and other things accordingly to the survivors and the killer on that specific trial, but BH likes to keep the game the same for SWF and Solo, so it makes too hard to balance.
Just think about it 10 seconds extra hook for a solo is OK, but for swf is NOT. Perks too Infectious Fright on Nurse? Strong, On GhostFace ? Ok
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I play 50/50, and from my trials as Solo Q the biggest obstacle put in front of me is the amount of disconnects. Moreso than any skill level. In fact, I'm relieved even if there's a not so good player who is at least trying. At least that's extra for the killer to deal with. And as killer, one disconnect and the whole trial becomes a massacre and dead boring.
An argument for the disconnects is: how are Solo Q supposed to deal with this balance? For me, they won't if they cannot be bothered to try. There are balancing issues, but for me not on the scale it's being made out to be. There will be tweaks in time, but until then disconnecting is just an absolute bane!
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Imagine being a killer main, and giving ideas on why Solo Q is fine lmao.. All killer mains complained about survivors, so this patch happened. Now that suvivors are voicing their opinion, killer mains are immediately here to tell US why we shouldn't complain. If you got any issues with your killer gameplay, then go ahead and post about it. But you can't come here and tell solo survivors why they're in the wrong, when you have little experience about it.
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To be fair, even in games without dc, most games are lost to solo survivors. I consider myself a pretty decent survivor. When i kept stats of my games, i had a survival rate of about 75% in solo queue, and i belive thats a lot better than average.
The patch itself didnt concern me at all, the only perk i run that was changed was self care, which i just swaped for circle of healing.
Since the patch, i escape maybe 20% of the time (i didnt keep stats of that). A lot of that has to do with camping and tunneling killers, and a lot has to do with teammates not knowing what to do (i run bound, so sadly, i know what my teammates are doing, and where they hidding instead of doing gens). If i had decent teammates more regular, i would have a better survival rate for sure, were i swf, nothing would be different.
But as it is, a lot of the time i would have spent playing dbd i played other games in the past few day. I still start dbd in the beginning, but after 3 games i dont care about waiting for maybe finding a decent game. No matter if its because of the killer buff or solo teammates not being able to cope with it, its neither fun nor thrilling the way it is. (and face it, those survivors were bad before, too, even with dh or other perks. They never were a problem, because they never touched a gen)
the problem is, that there was always a balance from solo <<<< Killer <<<< SWF. the balance patches just shifted that balance, so now its more like solo <<<<<<killer << swf, but it didnt adress the underlying issues.
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What a dumb "Us vs Them" take
Just cause killers are on the opposing side doesn't mean they are playing a different game.
If anything the killer interacts more with your soloq teammate then you do. When your teammate goes down you can only speculate what happened. The killer is the one who sees how a survivor DC's after getting mindgamed once. The killer is the one who sees your teammate sprint bursting into a rock for the entire duration and then kill themself on hook. The killer is the one who hears your teammate missing 5 skillchecks in a row.
I didn't hear any complaints from you when survivors gave their opinion about CoH when it released.
The irony of you calling killer mains biased while simultaneously saying they are not allowed to have a opionion about the game they are seeing with their own eyes is just sad.
Yes soloq needs buffs, yes the latest patch swung the balance a bit too hard in the other direction but op makes a good point. A lot of survivor would get much further if they actually tried instead of throwing in the towel the second something goes wrong. It's painfully obvious a lot of players are not where they are suppose to be
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I also posted on Otz's video. Did it make the game worse? For now, yeah. Why? All because Survivors are baby raging and killing themselves on first hook or DC'ing. It's called artificially inflating he Kill ratio in order to purposely skew the games data stats. Survivors are RAGING because they are bad or because they can't bully squad Killers like they used to.
If the devs and player have to deal with rage babies for a while, so be it. It's better in the long run than letting entitled children with MASSIVE ego's run the game. If they need their hero complex, they should play a single player game on easy mode.
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But what can you do? You can't change people.
You can't force them to play the game the way you want them to play.
You a lot more easier for a player to close the game and go play something else than it is to bring new players in.
So if you can't change the babies rage quit, you better close the game and call it done cause the numbers are coming and they will be ruthless.
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100% agree
you didnt get the purpose of the post, sadly. You need to get that the trial is made by both roles at the same time, and that i might or might not have more hours than you in you role besides being a main killer.
I agree with you a lot, solo Qeue has a lower escape amount in normal trials than SWF, the new wave of dcs made the escape rate from them to get too low. You cant know what your partners are doing without perks, or have to lose one perk slot to use Bond/Kindred. I hope the devs focuse on solo communication more, or just actually add voice chat in the match already.
Besides that i noticed that solo players were less altruist playing, sometimes nobody goes to a save and someone gets to 2 stage on first hook or die, i tried to use yoichi perk (the one that makes injured survivors to see you) to heal solo Q teammates for a couple trials, and i mostly got the killer sent straight to me when they get in a chase.
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otz is right i guess, its kinda what i said the survivors will create tolerance to the changes, adapt or drop it, thats what happenned to the killers over the years.
My post was made in hope to create awareness that the kill rate will get astronomically high for sometime until the adaptation is completed. Funny enough SWF players are kinda fast to adapt and explore the game technical balance in depth, because they can combo their build between themselves.
thanks for noticing
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people need to stop bring up just deadhard it dead get over it or let it go whatever...
I never used the perk before the update I still don't but remember not only did deadhard get nerfed but also alot of other survivor perks got nerfed.
also lets point out killers got alot of buffs with some of they nerfs and big buff to they basekit but survivor only got OtR which I also don't use maybe some other perks not sure oh and basekit BT which killer can easy wait out.
what hurting survivors right now is the basekit buff killers got with they speed and weapon cool down buff and buff to a lot of they gen defending parks don't forget 10 sec nerf to gens which just makes it really easy to camp and tunnel someone out before 1 or 2 gens get done.
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I play both roles, and I didn't see any issues prior to the patch when I played as Killer.
So, if we agree that one person dodging the issue means the issue doesn't exist, do we use MY "It's fine." to revert the recent patch? Or do we use YOUR "It's fine." to keep it like it is?
See the conundrum? It's part of the reason that "I'M not seeing any issue." is a really dumb argument
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You can look at those streamers that are decent players and play soloQ. they now hardly escape, and if they do its mostly a hatch escape or the killer was really bad. they mostly even lose against average players, which is completely ridiculous. I myself mostly play against average and below skilled players and with the same level of mates as the killers there is no way to win anymore as they just stack their 4 slowdowns, op addons and just camp, tunnel and slug as hard as possible. Thats the average match you get now. the patch was completely nuts. and its was foreseen as soon as ptb dropped.
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you are not wrong in pointing the tunneling and gen times. The new gen time is good against SWF but against Solos its a bit too much, camping isnt a problem when 5 gens are powered, but should be dealt during the trial, DS could still be 5 seconds since it does not activate in endgame.
I hope the devs adress the solo experience in the next patches, and create better ways to mitigate the hard camping
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This is a good point. If you never play Survivor, do you know what the frustration is like? Not necessarily.
But are you perhaps better educated on WHY the frustration exists in the first place...?
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4 slowdowns iri addons are a problem and i acknowledge that, before the patch it was way common to see 4 DH,DS,Unbreakable and such that also made average players defeat really good killers just being carried by perks.
The devs finally adressed some of these broken perks, and now we have to require adressing in SOME killers with SOME perks. Like Nurse + infectious fright + lethal Pursuer+ Starstuck + Agitation + Blink addons. I hope the devs start to balance perks individually for some killers if they are too strong using it.
Today iv seen other forum thread called "Its too easy to win as a killer now" where the OP said he was stacking 4 slowdowns in a legion and getting 4ks and not having fun. That happenned because he was being hard carried by his perks, even if could stack those perks, they shouldnt feel the need to do that because it will make the trial unfun for both sides. Sometimes we get too competitive and forget that the fun comes from the trial experience and not the result, using weaker perks are not making survivors games "easier" for them its making your game more "challenging".
This will change overtime survivors will learn to play safer since the killers are deadlier, and killers will start to try new builds to make their games more interesting, since they dont fell that large pressure anymore.
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Although it's true that killer mains shouldn't be telling survivors about survivor experiences and what's actually ruining the game for them, I also think that people need to knock off the labeling the moment someone disagrees with you just to invalidate their opinion. Now I'm not saying this person did that because they did open up with admitting they're a killer main, however I've seen others, and even myself just the other day, get labeled as killer mains despite playing both sides fairly evenly (sometimes straight up survivor mains) JUST because we've had a different opinion on this patch.
I am personally Team "This Patch Isn't as Bad as People Say" and I've even been playing a TON of solo queue this patch. Yet, my opinion has been invalidated by others simply because my username and profile suggests killer main. (Which is ironic because the username actually comes from a survivor game I had but that's besides the point).
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Ironic, how you give a prime example of survivors exaggerating.
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Yes! It's getting tiring fast. How a opinion completely gets invalidated because people say: "you're xxx main!"
Yesterday I've seen a streamer, who said that the survivor meta perks still work. Only to get tons of negative feedback, that he's a killer main, and that his opinion doesn't matter. He proceeded to show how the perks still work perfectly fine.
2 -
obstinate or unreasonable attachment to a belief, opinion, or faction; in particular, prejudice against a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group.
You call really anyone who has an opposing view a "Killer Main" so
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If a killer plays to win against solo queue, the match isn't even worth loading into. If the stacked slowdown doesn't go to plan, camping and tunneling is still there as a fallback. This game suffers because of the low expectations that killer mains set for themselves.
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Really? Hm. You seem like the type to talk like that.
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I didn't make it very clear but I was just trying to add on to what you said. Like yeah killer mains shouldn't really have a say in survivor issues (like how survivors shouldn't have much say in killer issues) but as a community we also shouldn't just label someone as a killer or survivor main JUST because they have an opposing perception of what's been happening on that side.
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That is a good point for me why the game feels so bad at the moment.
Before, playing killer could be very frustrating. To me, killer was never as rewarding as survivor, even if i managed a 4k, simply because killer games are a lot more binary. For each survivor, you are either better, worse, or equal to in skill. Equal happens seldom, so you either are better than your survivors and handle them with ease, wich lead to unrewarding victorys, or you have one or more that are better than you, leading to a very frustrating game.
Survivor, on the other hand, could lead to good games even if i died, because of plays i managed to do, or because i bought the rest of the team time to escape. there was frustration too, mainly with camping or tunneling leading to boring games, but it had its upsides.
Thoser are gone now, and to me, both sides play more frustrating than rewarding. (but that might have to do with the fact i am a survivor main, who also plays killer, but not equaly.)
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Thanks for saying this so eloquently. I wanted to say mu own piece, but then you did so and basically addressed everything I wanted to say, so I'll just back you up.
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DS nerf was overkill and i play both sides but update was good but also to much to fast.
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I was Solo Q against a Nemesis. 2 Surv. left (inc. my Felix). Downed both of us. The _____ Disconnected. Nemesis Let me get exit gate. I hate DC'ing.
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The snowball of a SoloQ disconnect is too strong and its happening more, people DC way less in SWF because its harder to get mad with other survivors errors. I had a lot of 3 men survivor trials that we could have won if we had the 4 guy at least to get hooked for the remaining health states.
I think the survivor bots should be implemented soon to deal with that, at least we would have more hands on deck
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But instead the general opinion seems to be inorder for solo to be better killers need to be rubbish.
The issue is with swf's and how much they skew any semblance of balance. Someone will alwaysbe the c tier, if it isn't killers it's solo survs.
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yep it seems like that, nice nickname lol, but talking about historical people: blue beard >>>>>>barbarossa
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