Should Myers be able to mori when pulling survivors out of lockers??

So you're saying that Myers should go through piles of iridescent addons looking for a game that a.) he can 4k and b.) where the survivors aren't sore losers, because the killer should respect that survivors don't want them to get an achievement they've even when they've utterly lost and have no hope of escape?

You realize just how busted this is, isn't it? The equivalent is that... say you have an achievement that requires you to escape through the gates in solo queue. So already it's not applicable in every game - survivors have a hard enough time escaping in the current lay of the game, and solo queue is a pretty big penalty. But while the killer can't prevent them from escaping, they always have the option to prevent the achievement by, say, swinging their weapon, even if that doesn't accomplish anything for them. You are saying they should also respect that the killer can just decide "nope, ######### you, try again next time" and prevent them from getting the achievement arbitrarily, which they will do because they're mad at them escaping. Because the survivor isn't 'entitled' to an achievement that they otherwise got, even though the killer earns no benefit from stopping them other than the malicious glee of knowing they ruined someone else's chances.

Achievements should never be subject to player spite, because player spite is damn near ubiquitous when it comes to losing games. That's just idiotic. It's terrible achievement design and it's terrible to think that's acceptable. This is more an issue with achievement design than it is with addon design (though tombstones are their own separate can of worms), but that doesn't mean it's defensible.

Also, no, there isn't really a way for the killer to misplay and 'lose' when it's just them standing in front of a locker the survivor has no intention of exiting. Which is the situation I've been discussing from the start, so I think you're the one who's been misunderstanding the argument. 🤷

No. If anything they need to nerf several of his addons and make them less oppressive.

So...hide until your 3 friends speed run the 4 gens, 99 the fifth, have them die, finish gen, open exit gate, tada

Yeah I understand it's harder to achieve in soloQ, but at least you don't have someone waiting at locker to stall out the game to spite you

Except that doesn't check out. We're discussing hiding in a locker as the last survivor, right? Since we agree that there's nothing objectionable about hiding in lockers before the game has ended (and by extension, this should never be removed or tombstones wouldn't have any counterplay at all when they're already pretty poor game design)? If the Myers doesn't want the achievement and he's just taking a tombstone joyride, he won't care that you're in a locker; he'll take you out and slap you on a hook. Only a Myers that's going for the achievement is going to be stymied by this action. That's why locker stalling is specifically a spite move. The only thing it can ever accomplish is preventing an achievement.

I know tombstone games aren't remotely enjoyable, but I don't think it's wrong to have an issue with players taking action specifically to spite each other when it costs them more than doing nothing, or even that they have the power to do that at all. It's not a niche thing, either. It's really common to run into this when you go for Evil Incarnate, survivors that are fine with dying but refuse to let it be a mori. It wouldn't be a difficult achievement otherwise. And I think that's pretty sad, because all it does is push another tombstone game onto the next group when in all likelihood 0/5 players want to be playing this way.

The thing is, if you just want to live out your 4k fantasy, then you couldn't care less about that last survivor hiding in the locker: just pull them out and hook them. The 15min stand offs ONLY happen when a player want to get that achievment.

Myers' addons are the only reason why he's a viable killer. His basekit is a lot more decent than some people will ever admit, but he's still an M1 killer with no map pressure.

As far as tombstone addons go, they're really just not very good. Judith's is flat-out worthless, and Piece is situational at best. The amount of stalk that it takes to activate it makes it difficult to justify using unless you're running a good stalk addon and a lot of slowdown. He does have some insanely good builds, but that's not one of them.

Yes. Just because that achievement is awful.

Maybe that would only apply to the last survivor, or else there's a 30-60 second timer that allows the survivor to be Mori'd on the ground or from inside of the locker, which would mean that camping a locker would still be a bad play in all situations except when you're going for the achievement. That way, survivors can't deny it if the killer really wants it, but they have counterplay since Myers is still going to lose if he spends all match staring at lockers instead of pressuring gens.

That achievement shouldn't be in the game in the first place. If you're achievement hunting which is pretty much the only way to get that one, you have to center your entire build and playstyle around getting your entire team killed so you can have a shot at it. And it's such a difficult achievement to get that you pretty much have to try for it if you want it.

I think they meant the Left for Dead achievement, not the hatch one, which is almost as hard to get as Evil Incarnate.

But you're still half-correct. It's not an easy achievement to get, but it doesn't just require contributing nothing; if you want it, your best bet is to actively sabotage your entire team. I don't know why that one is still in the game.

The achievement needs to change, not the mechanics.

Actually, never mind.

I decided to try for the Left for Dead achievement and got it after five games, and a couple of them were close. I actually nearly died at the exit gates, but Nurse was merciful.

Didn't have to intentionally kill all of my teammates, either. They do a great job of that all on their own.

Used Adrenaline/Wake Up/Sole Survivor/Fast Track and just tried to hit all good skill checks until the last gen, at which point I had 75% bonus speed and up to 27 stacks on Fast Track.