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Explaining The Recently Released Escape/Kill-Rates
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Before diving into this, I will make it known that with any form of forum post, there is going to be at least some level of bias, even if minimal. Removing bias from a post made by someone, even myself, is physically impossible. We all have our own opinions and ideas which show in what we write and produce in the forums.
Keep this in mind going forward, especially with topics like this that require some level of speculation.
old killrates (Pre 6.1.0 patch)
- Killers: 53%
- Survivors: 47%
New Killrates (Post 6.1.0 Patch)
- Killers: 61%
- Survivors: 39%
What does this mean?
Killer kill-rates increased and survivor escape-rates decreased. Keep in mind these are rates across all MMR and skill levels.
As many of you might know, players who just installed the game are not going to be that good since they are really new. So really low MMR lobbies typically are dominated by the killer role since most survivors do not progress their objective fast enough to escape and most players have no idea what they are doing.
However at higher MMR levels, the killer role really seemed to struggle a lot more than survivor, kill-rates for most players were really low at high MMR since survivors consistently brought in strong perks and items that made gaining the upper-hand as killer really hard.
(This part is where speculation comes in. Take anything with a grain of salt.) Tying back to earlier, the killer role dominated low MMR, and the killer role struggled at high MMR. The goal of the 6.1.0 Patch was to increase the kill-rates at high MMR by buffing the various weak areas of the killer role. This of course increase the kill-rates further at low MMR which were already killer dominated.
Is This Good or not?
Well, it really depends on your way of looking at things. Something like this comes down to subjectivity. There is no objectively right answer here.
Killers have a better chance at high MMR. Survivors get absolutely stomped at low MMR.
There is really not much you can do to buff the killer role without having adverse effects upon all MMR levels. If you buff the killer role, low MMR survivors suffer more. If you nerf the killer role, high MMR killers suffer more. As to rather it would be better to balance and buff/nerf around high, mid, or low MMR comes down to you.
And while we cannot see the escape-rates and kill-rates at certain MMR levels, I believe BHVR's intention was to raise the kill-rates of high MMR killers more align with a 50% escape-rate and kill-rate to promote better balance amongst the highest of skilled players. Just unfortunately, it really did come at the cost of low MMR and mid MMR players.
(Also yes, this is basically what I said earlier, just half the time I have to restate this over and over since people either miss what I say and jump to conclusions, or people just cut towards the end and don't read anything else. Also I cannot stress enough the subjectivity and the amount of speculation needed with this type of post, take everything with a grain of salt.)
Please be civil with any response.
Comments
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Everything you said is correct. And from my competitive game background I always prefer multiplayer games to be balanced around higher(not the top 1%) mmr. In league for example they would nerf a character like pin head because he is a low elo stomper and that's all he will ever will be, Where as a character like blight would be balanced around high mmr due to his skill curve. A lot of people in this game are casual and that's fine but if you are casual then you shouldn't be taking the game seriously. Balancing around low or even just mid mmr will make long term players lose interest and kill the game quickly.
The devs are taking this game in a mid to high mmr balance direction, while QoL for solo queue would be nice reverting the changes to killers in 6.1.0 would be the wrong move as that pretty much just gave B and C tier killers the ability to play the game.
Nerf/rework nurse, nerf c33 and alch ring and give survivors base kit info. Doing anything drastic before those changes happen would be awful. Although my opinion on why they have not nerfed blights add-ons is because they need a killer that has the capability to combat the highest level of swfs and they plan on nerfing/reworking nurse soon.
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Wouldn't it be cool if the perk stats changed with mmr?
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one thing makes me wonder. if survivor mmr is based on escapes and you are more likely to die than to survive, wouldn't that mean match making cant match equally skilled survivors together because everyone's mmr is low?
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Escaping used to be more common. Which is why they did all of the recent perk changes.
Another thing, the hatch used to appear after so many gens were completed and you could open it with a key.
Currently, it is definitely harder to escape.
You raise a good point though. Will new players ever get to reach higher mmr? Especially with a 31% escape rate across the board?
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Well, it's actually an interesting topic.
A lot of the players that really tank the escape-rates down are literally brand new players, but since they are bedrock MMR, their MMR can only go so low while they are already at the borderline lowest it can be. Outside of that there is no real way to tell how much this effects the broad scope of things, BHVR has the numbers behind that, we don't, anything further would be just speculation.
Keep in mind, MMR has always had functionality issues with the matchmaking though, it's not uncommon to see high MMR players going against mid MMR players because there aren't enough high MMR players, so I wouldn't be surprised if more issues come from this, the more they add and change is just kicking the hornets nest but the nest is already stirred.
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I play for Tome Challenges and even losing 15 games in a row doesn't mean anything to me as I mostly care about getting my challenge done.
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I wish there was a way to buff kill rates in high mmr without throwing low and mid mmr survivors under the bus.
I understand when people say "casuals shouldn't take the game seriously anyway" but it does seem unfair that you're not allowed to be frustrated when the game sets you up to fail, just because "you shouldn't take the game seriously".
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I have them all done, not I am playing for the adept 🤣
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It's an average 39% escape rate between 4 survivors. Someone individually can exceed a 50% escape rate and thus they would climb. Survivors can also still 4 man escape, it's just much harder to pull off and the killer is likely to at least secure a 1K in the end game now. Basically good survivors should still be able to climb up with the only difference is that they might die in a few extra games now.
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Very well written. And sorry, you forgot about the swf vs solo q issue. There are tournament swf teams that stomp almost every killer, even full time streamers, that make a living from playing video games.
My opinion is that average high MMR killers have to be buffed to be able to compete against average high MMR swf. And then solo Q has to be buffed. One way to achieve this would be reworks of maps. Get rid of too many paletts.
I am saying this as player who plays 90% of matches as survivor. There should not be a thing like free unhooks or free escapes. In my opinion survivors have to earn their escape (and their points). So 47% was way too high and 39% is much better.
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Well bad players shouldn't escape as often...
If a certain role has the ability to be the strongest should it be made easy?
Those low mmr survivors have every opportunity to become good, DBD isnt a game that has any complex or highly skilled actions like other games most of it comes down to knowledge and how much a survivor puts into learning and trying.
Nurse is the same as low mmr survivors, in the right hands it becomes very strong but we cant go making the stronger thing stronger, we wouldn't balance for bad nurses to win nor should we balance for bad survivors to win
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I think it's a good system. When you purchase DBD and lose your first 20 games as Survivor, then you either play Killer or play another game.
This solves the imbalance with too few Killers. Make Survivor as miserable for any new player as you possibly can, stunt your growth for that role (yeah they're only 80% of the playerbase but w/e) and try to make Killer experience feel better by giving them a few buffs here and there.
The great thing about implementing a system like this is that no matter what content they release, the playercount will go down to what it was now after just 2 weeks and 80% of your new players will drop the game.
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As a newer player the solo q survivor experience is awful. I've hit the game hard, been playing about a month and got 5 days playtime already. Spent couple weeks reading the wiki and learning about the game before i brought it.
I'm reasonably competent, certainly but i struggle to survive solo games with my mmr. I have survivors who either refuse to unhook or all cluster round the hook and get 2 players downed to unhook 1. It's rare for me to see all 5 gens get done in my games, even when i managed to finish 1 or 2 gens myself.
I've played a fair bit of solo q over the last 3 days because I've been off work and my survival rate is like 10-15% max. I could probably raise it by giving up half way through and just hiding to play for hatch. But feels like a pretty naff strategy.
Even coming up against fairly weak killers like sadako and trapper at least 3 out of 4 of my games end in 4ks. Tough to raise my mmr when my teammates are dying rapidly or doing particularly stupid things that end up getting me downed.
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A solution to buffing high MMR killers without touching low MMR is adjust pallet distribution and generator times for high MMR SWFs but every time something like that is suggested people screech YOU CANT PUNISH PEOPLE FOR PLAYING WITH THEIR FRIENDS!!!!
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BHVR could start by reworking perks like hyperfocus, that does almost nothing at low MMR, but can combo together for -30 seconds to a generator for the high MMR survivors they can hit the skill checks. The same goes for dead hard, which lost a lot of value at low MMR, but is even more powerful than before with high MMR survivors that can use dead hard on reaction.
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I don't know. I do think high skill players should be rewarded. If someone can hit all of their great skillchecks, by all means, they deserve a perk for it in my opinion.
Same with Dead Hard being really hard to time (when latency doesn't screw you over), I don't mind going against a full DH lobby that uses it well, since I feel like it requires skill and a great deal of luck.
In my opinion it's okay that some perks take skill to get value from. There are perks that are clearly for beginners, and perks that require skill to use. Sometimes the former are useful on all levels, sometimes they aren't. Sometimes perks that require skill can give some amount of value in lower skill level (Sprint Burst), sometimes they don't. It's okay. But the game as a whole should not be casual-hostile (skewing chances towards killer at low and mid mmr). It's more about global balance than individual perks in my opinion.
(And I 100% get that making the game balanced both at mid and high mmr is virtually impossible in DbD's current configuration, this is all but wishful thinking)
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I wasn't clear in my point. You nerf killers that are problematic in low tier play and will never be viable in high tier play because of their kit. So like genuinely nerf pig. But seriously survivor as a whole does not need help and even high mmr survivors are doing fine. What needs help is solo queue in particular, which if you saw my suggested changes you would know I think that should happen before they start reverting 6.1.0. Base kit info and more accurate mmr is also a must.
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Brother, we must stick together, lol
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I'm sorry, but what?
DBD literally explained that it had to do with perks and all the changes they did to them. Yet you're talking about an MMR none of us have a single clue about. We don't know how the MMR works. You're speculating that that's why the killer rates are 61%. You're missing the fact that before, killer rates and survivor rates were at least close, but now has a significant gap in rates.
How can you completely dismiss the DbD post that literally says:
"In Dead by Daylight, the Killer should strike fear into the Survivors. Part of this comes from being a big, scary looking person or monster, while another part of this comes from their ability to kill you. Before the 6.1.0 Update, we found Killers to be a little lacking. As a result, we introduced several changes to improve Killer quality of life & make them more deadly. Beyond that, we made significant changes to many of the most & least used Killer perks.
The result of these changes: The average kill rate (percentage of all Survivors killed) rose by about 8%. This leaves Killers- on average- within a range that we’re comfortable with, making them deadly, but not oppressive.
More significantly, the variety of perks being used saw huge improvements. The previously most used perk, Barbecue & Chilli, went from being used in 40% of all Killer loadouts to only 17%. Jolt, meanwhile, climbed from 13% usage to 19%. Scourge Hook: Pain Resonance dropped slightly, going from 20% usage to 17%, just barely beating Barbecue and Chilli for the number 2 spot.
Other top 10 most used Killer perks include: Sloppy Butcher, Save the Best for Last, Overcharge, Thanatophobia, Call of Brine, Hex: No One Escapes Death, and Corrupt Intervention.
Overall, the disparity between the highest and lowest usage rates is significantly smaller than before. We intend to continue monitoring and fine-tuning perks as needed going forward, but already we’re seeing far more variety than in the old meta."
^ you're just gonna ignore that then?
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Please be civil with any response.
Sorry I couldn't resist.
The numbers really don't mean anything to me.
But I have been having a lot of fun playing survivor recently. SoloQ of course, because I have no friends.
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I agree with some of your points here, but why should I as a solo a survivor be punished because my team
a) leaves me on hook and refuses to unhook me
b) they are scared and run off as soon as the hear the terror radius with no killer in sight
c) are more worried about completing their challenge than doing the objective and escape.
d) Sacrifice themselves on first hook because they don’t like the killer
I had a couple matches tonight where I did 2 gens, and recused people of hook and the only gens that competed were mine because everyone else ran and his when they heard the terror radius.
escapes shouldn’t be the only thing that’s towards mmr. I’m it saying people should have free escapes, but I shouldn’t be penalized a die in 80% of my matches because I’m stuck with others that don’t want to work as team and only care about themselves
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I never forgot about SoloQ vs SWF, I just felt like it was unnecessary to put into the post since it was more so a look at how MMR ranges are affected by the changes (since some people do not understand how to read basic statistics and/or jump to conclusions about the data without reading what BHVR themselves put). I feel as if SoloQ vs SWF is talked about a lot as well, so it would basically contribute nothing new to the topic.
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