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STBFL survived another patch...
How? idk... When this perk going to be nerfed?
Comments
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Why should it be?
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We don't know what the actual mid chapter has in store yet, the mori stuff is basically a bonus
There's still a whole patch we haven't been told about yet
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Still see no reason why it should be nerfed. Maybe cause you can't just hold W anymore for over 5 loops after being hit?
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First, the blog post was only about experimental changes going on the ptb that aren't part of the midchapter.
Second, STBFL may not actually be a problem
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To be fair we have no idea yet what’s actually going to be in the midchapter.
That said, STBFL is probably a bit overtuned right now. Just a little though.
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It was strong perk, now after basekit killer changes is now a broken perk.
It should be 5 stacks at most.
Yes.
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I can give you a good reason
It turns camping from a risk vs reward scenario into a turn your brain off scenario
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It was... always like that? If you hit the survivor at least 4 meters away from the hook the travel time would be too long before they could unhook to trade.
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But it's even harder now, since the (granted, minor) killer buffs
You asked for a reason why it should be changed (or toned down), I think that's a good one.
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I feel like STBFL is fine as is. Get the obsession to take a hit. If you're the obsession, take a hit.
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It still really didn't change much. Only really helped m1 killers and m2 stayed basically the same. You save maybe 2 seconds with the basekit cool down reduction and post hit sprint burst reduction.
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Its not killer fault that there is no counter-play to survivors properly bodyblocking and abusing the killer's long cooldown timer to get free unhooks at base-kit without having instant down.
Do you want just free unhooks without the killer being able to hook-trade at all? in end game, it can lead to free escapes with survivor kongo lines.
I am just playing devil advocate on your complaint on the perk.
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I think it's camping potential is why it should be changed regardless of the 6.1.0 patch
Like, the counterplay to STBFL feels nonexistant in solo Q. Especially when you have killers who can ignore the perks only real downside.
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It's not free though. If someone unhooks close by - you can basically always hit one of them. By definition that's not free, you gain something from it.
In the endgame though yeah it's a problem, I 100% agree but having a perk essentially make camping extremely easy isn't the solution. All you get is killers who can ignore the perks downside camping in the early/mid game. I have no issues with the perk being used to make chases quicker, I just hate how it doubles as idiotproofing for camping killers.
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STBFL is fine as it is. It was only affected a little with the 6.1.0 patch, but not a lot to where it became broken.
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Abusing killer's long cooldown timer to get free un-hooks
There's a difference between abusing a mechanic and literally using a basic strategy.
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It is actually more broken on m2 killers like Demo or Nemesis more than Sadako or GF.
It is not that simple. What if the obsession was injured? what if the killer uses m2 on obsession? what if it was solo game?
Don't remove the perk, Just nerf it. 5 stack max instaed of 8 is reasonable change.
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I mean im probably the most biased survivor main out there. My solo games, the obsession knows their job. If they're injured they go down. If its to block a rescue, they can only do it once before they need to build up stacks again.
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Health-states vs losing the status of 1 person on a hook dying is not an equal trade for the killer. equal trade for killer would be an unhook for 1 person slugged. One of the impressive aspects for survivor for high MMR is that sometimes, if a teammate goes to unhook with you because teammate knows the killer is camping, I will often circle around the killer, get close enough to the killer while looking at my teammate's position and take a hit on purpose and somehow, my teammate knows to utilizes killer cooldown to get the unhook. Its impressive that you can do this reliably in soloq with no communication, some killer will accuse you of swf but it seems like its understood strategy for survivor at higher-level.
Its not just end-game thing. its all-game and its effective strategy to counter facecamping killers at hooks. The camping wraith cannot secure kills if you use this strategy. Its obviously most potent in end game because you can change say a 2 or 3 man escape into 4 man escape but the killer has to not be good at camping hooks. I.e no instant down, no faster recovery etc.
At one point(1.5 years ago), I thought it was unfair strategy for killer to be able to do this with the perk, so I suggested a rework to the perk on forums that was something along lines that instead of reducing killer's cooldown time by 40%, It reduces survivor's sprint burst by 0.25/0.50/0.75/1.0 seconds so it is more chase perk but I suppose dev consider face-camp as fair strategy to gain kills given that they buffed the killer's cooldown time from 3 second->2.7 seconds.
It seems that camping and tunnelling are good strategies while slugging should be punished. As a result, I do not see them changing the perk.
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STBFL is fine. People way overestimate how much it does post attack CD buff.
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I've always been a fan of STBFL, but there are some issues with how it can make rescue impossible in a camp situation even where all 3 players are coordinated and baiting the killer around the hook. Those end game camps where you've got all survivors alive really should benefit those survivor given the course of match and their strength in full numbers, and they traditionally do.
That said, STBFL has always had that hook-slaughter element going for it.
It certainly saved my ass more than once back in the day of old soul guard--with its uncapped endurance for the infinite self-recovery against hexes--letting me flip the script on hooligans running their WGLF/unbreakable builds where a 4 man can just keep picking each other up literally faster than the killer can down them. Actually... sounds like we're circling back to those days, so good thing they didn't touch STBFL....
STBFL at least takes a perk and build-up to pull off. I think a bigger issue responsible for the sort of heavy gameplay we're seeing so much along low/mid MMR killers would be the inherent attack cooldown itself.
One of the reasons camping spiked is because its just that much harder for a single survivor to pull off a guaranteed save against a face camping killer. It's not impossible, but the timing is that much tighter where taking a hit first doesn't even guarantee you'll get them off the hook without getting grabbed if you were just a bit too far when you got hit. If you did get them saved, your odds getting out of there to a loop/pallet are a lot lower too since the timing puts the chase on you that much quicker now.
Hook-trading use to be way more stable, but what use to be a rather neutral-counter (trading pressure for other pressure, allowing a team to spread it out) ends up hugely favoring the killer because the chance of survivors messing up is meaningfully increased while the cost of messing up was always very severe, with half your team down & pulling the others from their tasks.
I just don't know how to improve this situation at all without totally sacrificing hit cooldown speed benefit to normal chases, which I find a very good/healthy adjustment for the game and would hate to turn back the clock on, leaving the whole matter a conundrum in my opinion.
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STBFL broken? 🤣😂 its a perfectly balanced perk. If you are being serious I can see you never played killer in your life.
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No i have never played killer in my life. Have you ever played DBD? Do you know what STBFL even means?
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It was meh perk, and it still is.
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STFBL is a balanced perk.
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I think the perk was already fairly strong when it gave you a maximum 40% CD buff. Then they buffed it to 50% with the basekit changes AND reduced the distance a survivor could get upon being hit by a fair margin. Now I feel it's almost unreasonably strong in how much quicker it can help you end chases all in exchange for just hitting survivors. Not to mention that hitting the Obsession can be easily negated if the killer has a special attack ability, meaning on particular killers they can keep their stacks for the rest of the game.
You could knock it back down to 40% with a max of six stacks and it would still be perfectly viable. That's how it was pre-buff and without the added bonus of survivors making less distance upon being hit. It would still be a buff to the pre midchapter version, just a less powerful one. So yeah, I think it needs a nerf, if not a very subtle one.
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Survivors want more perks that Killers have to earn, and this is it.
To even benefit from this perk, you have to land hits while letting the Obsession get off scot-free. I'd say this perk needs no nerfing at all.
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Probably one of the most overrated perks in DBD. It's a good perk but I'd take it instead of another slowdown. Try playing with it and you see that even with 8 stacks the survivors still have plenty of time to reach a loop after a hit. I agree it shines with camping but that's more of a problem with camping than it is with a perk.
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