Anyone try playing Twins on PTB? I imagine it is horrible.
I really thought that the Twins would be receiving an update this patch, as they have not been touched in months.
Instead there is a new basekit unbreakable on the one killer that is more likely to slug, not because they want to, but because the game tries to make it as clunky as possible to go pick up and hook a survivor after Victor downs somebody.
Seriously, this feels like the perfect chapter to introduce a Twins Rework, right alongside the new Mori system designed to make slugging more bearable. The complete absence of any adjustments to Twins this PTB feels so bizarre.
Comments
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The PTB is not the next mid chapter, or the next chapter likely. It needs time to collect feedback and the feedback is overall not very positive right now, to say the least.
There might be a Twins rework before the changes are implemented (if they are, as they might be completely changed or scrapped before coming to live).
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Here you go.
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"I'm not misplaying, I'm not making mistakes"
She says, leaving the survivor slugged on the ground while no one is around to stop her from hooking, then spending about 20 seconds fishing for another slug, failing, then anticipating the Head-on play and not playing in against it.
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As someone who very much dislikes Victor, I'd love it if they made Victor stay attached to the downed survivor, preventing the downed survivor from recovering. Charlotte can then choose to recall Victor and risk the recovery, or chase without her power while she maintains pressure with her slug.
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I'm trying to feel really bad about it, I promise.
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A streamer being pessimistic about a new DBD update? You don't see that very often.
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What happens when the survivor goes down in a hook deadzone where they can't be hooked? They just get up for free? I'm guessing that's also the killer's fault.
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She played awfully around the downed people, there were so many chances for hooks but she went over and over for a 4 slug instawin while she should have picked up, had a lot of chances and wasted them all, she really needs to adapt to use hooks instead of slugs as Twins, great mechanical skill, awful decission making skill, being good is not only having good reflexes and muscle memory, being able to make the correct decissions and adapt your strategy is part of playing well, she failed miserable at it.
Also people fail to notice this kind of gameplay its just a free win for the Killer, had several Survivors going for this strategy, they got up several times but gens werent progressing and pallets were getting drop, its detrimental to play the way they played, did they even fix a single gen?.
Hook deadzones are not very common except on certain licensed indoor maps but thats well known and has been demanded for changes for a time, on regular maps is very rare to have only one hook around unless 1 or 2 people have been already sacrificed and by that time the game is already on the Killer bag.
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But that doesn't mean it's the killer's fault. It's a mechanic that shouldn't be there, see? It doesn't matter if "the killer's probably winning anyway". It can take away a well-deserved down or even a kill.
I'm just curious to see what he says. There are some people who think that it's the killer's responsibility, on top of everything else they're juggling in their head, to know exactly which hooks to sacrifice people on so that in a hypothetical scenario later in the game, they can't just go down near there and be unhookable. Like, "Oh, that happened to you? Don't make that mistake next time." To me, that's nonsense.
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In her case it was her fault, she could have hooked them so many times but she didnt, she went for slugs even when fully aware they all have Unbreakable, she made horrible decissions and they just kept getting up over and over.
- 0:20 she should have picked Feng plus you can see Claudette running towards the locker, she switches back to Charlotte and can snag someone out of the locker.
- 2:10 she should have picked Feng she could use the corner to avoid the flashlight.
- 2:20 she should have picked Feng after downing Claudette but she went for Jane who didnt have a flashlight, smart move would be pick up Feng, hook in front of the Saloon and then go back to either go after Claudette or Jane after unhook.
- 2:30 again not picking anyone.
- 3:40 same train of actions, downing several people but deciding to not pick anyone, Jane didnt bring a flashlight so its safe to pick up with her around.
- 3:55 again switching to Victor instead of going to pickup someone.
- 4:05 same playstyle, downs someone sees someone else on the distance and goes for them instead of picking up people already downed.
And thats in the first 4 minutes of video, are you telling us this wasnt the Killers fault?.
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No, he's saying that sometimes all survivors will play one side of the map and die there. Leaving it a complete dead zone outside of your control. He then asked you why the killer should get 0 value out of a down for that happening. I didn't watch the video I am just telling you, forced slugging via survivors is going to be an issue even if the perk UB gets deleted.
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Any side of a normal map has more than enough hooks to put at least 3 people there unless you are in a deep corner (which then you may be close to only 1 or 2) and 3 people running towards the same corner after the hook is destroyed from sacrificing someone is not something thats gonna happen on a daily basis.
Even if it happens, is their funeral, going to be like Lynxi game, they just get up over and over but gens are not being done and they just bleed out, has happened to me in the PTB too, everyone playing super aggressive, everyone trying to be a pest around the downed guy so you cant pick him up, they just trade slugs while the bleeding clock still ticks, Survivors will eventually learn doing that may make it harder to put them on hooks but they are losing the game anyway. The main difference its going to be their fault for ending like that instead of being the Killer doing, if an entire team bleeds to death they cant go around "AAAAAH KILLER SLUGGED ME FOR NO REASON!!" because its entirely on them.
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Literally not what we're talking about, buddy boy. I'm all for fixing hook distribution on maps.
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You're kidding, right?
I can't believe the fact that after watching this Twins video, the story is being told that the Twins are bad.
Could it be that it is common to match up with these not so good survivor teams?
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All that AND she still killed everybody.
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I'm talking strictly about a survivor going down in a hook dead zone.
It's relevant.
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I actually like this idea assuming a rescuing survivor could still come kick the babeh.
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Uh, yes. Knowing which hook to use is absolutely something you need to keep in mind as the killer. You definitely should be paying attention to where your remaining hooks are when you death hook. If you make the deadzone yourself, you have only yourself to blame.
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Lets assume you managed to kill two in one spot and now have a deadzone. Are the remaining gens in this dead zone? If not, leave the are and don't chase people to it. If so, you can just camp your slugs and keep reslugging until they bleed out.
One person is unlikely to complete multiple gens that quickly solo to keep you from getting an easy 3k.
Point is, you have counterplay and you just want to stamp your feet and scream "unfair". This is why these forums have the reputation of being killer sided and won't be happy until all 4 survivors just spawn on hooks.
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I commented about this video in another thread, she made mistakes. Its called being greedy. if she wanted to hook she could've. She didn't even attempt too. This video isn't the "gotcha" you think it is. At one point she had 3 people slugged. You telling me she didn't have the time to hook atleast one of them? She absolutely did, if she wasn't being greedy.
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Lynxi is a sweetheart, but yeah she made some mistakes there. Take your hooks when you can.
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Not to what I'm pointing out, it isn't.
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You all fail to understand that she's also slugging to avoid getting flashlight saved. That's why she says "I didn't make a mistake and I got punished."
Dwight, Claudette, and Feng Min all had flashlights. When she was slugging, one of them or multiple of them were around. She couldn't take her hooks, because she'd get flashlight saved and be back to square one.
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She simply refused to even try and hook a bunch of times when she was standing literally on top of them with Charlotte. Not a great example of Twins being worse honestly because it really seems like if she had hooked when she had the chances she could have won probably.
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Twins don't win by hooking unless it's against bad survivors.
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Hmmm seems like there's a perk that totally negates Clicky Clicks but what do I know.....it's not like a Killer can see what Survivors bring
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There were times where she absolutely could've done a pick up if she wanted. Obstacles are a thing. She also could've locker grabbed the Claudette at one point. She made bad decisions, and still won.
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No she is not, there is several points on the video where the 3 flashlight carriers are incapacitated yet she still goes for the fourth Survivor who doesnt have one (Jane) or she refuses to pick someone when the downed was against a wall making impossible flashlight saves.
She is slugging because she is a Twins main and thats how you play them on live servers, on the PTB you have to adapt to using hooks with them or risk what happened there... which was a 4K anyway...
Hook deadzones dont exist on regular maps except you make them yourself by sacrificing someone or you face a full dedicated sabo squad, its like saying "what if I get sent to a map with 0 pallets" that doesnt happen.
P.D. I said regular maps, several licensed maps like RPD or Midwich were acknowledge as having problems with hook locations and its something everyone is aware of, even the developers because it has been posted on this forum several times.
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Twins can win by hooking when the hooks are easy to get.
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You don't HAVE to 4 slug as Twins to win lol. Preemptively move Victor to the hook you're going to use then hook the survivor so you can long range camp with Charlotte!
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I specifically pointed out that the first slug in the match, she was completely unopposed. Everyone that showed up, showed up AFTER she greeded for the next slug.
EDIT: Also worthy of note is that she mentions 'she won the last few ones', despite the slugging nerfs.
EDIT2: The video just gets worse from there. 'See how easy it is to bully the killer?', she says, as she slugs the same survivor for the, what, sixth time in a row? No one has touched a gen in two minutes because they simply can't. She has complete control over the match and is throwing a tantrum that she doesn't get her free win at 2 minutes (Skipping 8 hook states) and instead has to work for it, because she's that adamant about getting the slug victory instead of just taking her W and hooking.
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Still proving my point. Watcha gonna do? Not kill someone because they could potentially create a hook dead zone? This is without sabotage squads. Maybe 1 body block and you don't get the hook. The killer should never be punished for killing a survivor.
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Which they aren't. Pre-drop a pallet, and Victor can't get you. If he's about to, jump in a locker and break out before Charlotte comes back. If he attaches to you, hold him hostage. If he misses, very easy with the inconsistent hitbox, free kick. If Charlotte's chasing you, she's an M1 killer. If you've got CoH, you win.
If you're talking about hooks simply being close when they down someone, sure they can get that hook. But Twins takes too long to down with Victor, switch back, walk all the way over, pick up, walk to hook, hook, get far enough away from hook to use Victor (if he hasn't been killed by then), and THEN you can get back to chasing with Victor. It's not feasible going for hooks with them. You can't count on survivors being bad and say that's why the killer is fine.
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Pre-drop a pallet, and Victor can't get you.
Victor jumps over a dropped pallet to get the survivor in the very video posted in this thread.
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Why'd they let him do that? Considering the first down was gained purely by Charlotte, these survivors weren't great.
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I'm talking about the specific video above. She downed people with Charlotte, not Victor, and had hooks right there with no chance of a pallet stun. Easy hooks.
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This.
I don't think a survivor who goes down from health in 5 seconds is playing well.
Or a player with a flashlight is lurking nearby, and not only is it possible to get stunned from a pickup, but also to escape with a base kit unbreakable once picked up. There is absolutely no need to intentionally even out an advantageous situation by choosing to hook.
Does the survivor believe that the killer is deliberately taking various choices to harass the survivor? They make choices because those choices will help the game progress in their favor.
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That's more of a problem with hook dead zones. I've never understood why you can be punished for hooking in the same area unless they want to discourage 3 gens or something, which they clearly don't.
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Sure, move those goalposts, buddy!
'These survivors are playing bad!'
Yeah, well so is the killer, but you don't look at that, everyone rarely discusses that, and the player herself actively denies her mistakes.
It's always the survivors', or the game's fault, because every killer is a 'top MMR' machine of mechanical and tactical perfection.
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if the survivors all group up and commit mass suicide by Victor and it STILL takes forever to win, I'm sure you can understand why she'd be frustrated.
Watching your enemy make every possible blunder and have it barely matter since they can just smash the undo button is truly an agonizing experience,
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Did any of them get any chance to work on any gen, anywhere in the match?
How does it 'barely matter'? I'd like to remind you that she's got the entire match locked down really early, and has insane pressure and control. But apparently that's not good enough and killer now need not just the 4K, but they need the 4K in under 2 minutes.
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The point is that the survivors can throw the game and it still drags out for 10 or so minutes. They deliberately CHOSE not to work on gens, since their teammates have infinite picksies upsies.
If even one of the survivors was hard committing to gens, it would have been a three or four man out. Instead, the survivors were just having fun with a troll match and vibing out. I seriously doubt any of those players were planning on escaping.
It barely mattered because if the survivors were trying to escape instead of trying to troll and be silly, the killer in the video would have genuinely been unable to really do much of anything. She down each survivor like what, 5 times? 10 times? The Twins are the only killer in the game that can have that much pressure, but still only hang onto the game by a thread the entire time.
I love the Twins, but Lord are they miserable to play at times.
Playing a video game should not be a constantly miserable and hyper-stressful uphill battle, which is what the 6.1.0 update tried to do for killer.
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She down each survivor like what, 5 times? 10 times? The Twins are the only killer in the game that can have that much pressure, but still only hang onto the game by a thread the entire time.
You've been watching an entirely different video if you think that! She was greeding REALLY hard and she constantly had the entire match under control. This was super easy mode for her and you and her are complaining about 'well if the survivors played better', while never once addressing that she played like trash herself. She's constantly making huge mistakes and getting upset over not getting the win thrown in her lap.
The game wasn't 'hanging by a thread' at all. It was squarely in her corner the entire match. She was just getting pissed off that she couldn't get the four man slug win and skip 8 hook states. She got her win, and she would've gotten it a hell of a lot faster if she wasn't so damn greedy, but that goes over her head and yours.
Playing a video game should not be a constantly miserable and hyper-stressful uphill battle
What do you think this match is like for the survivors? What do you think slug-based plays are like for survivors, especially against twins?
Stop whinging that you can't slug-win anymore after the update specifically meant to discourage slug-wins. This is like those people that go 'anti-camp measures are fine, but only if they don't impede my ability to camp'. She specifically played to maximise the value of the anti-slug changes and she STILL consistently wins as twins.
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No, your point is people getting downed on deadzones which I said is almost impossible unless they run towards a corner and even there you are usually in range of at least 1 hook or 2 depending on distribution. The only way of people getting downed in deadzones is if the hooks break after sacrificing at least 2 people, and by that time slugging or no slugging becomes pointless for the Killer has the game in the bag almost always.
And if for some reason the map manages to spawn with a corner where there are no hooks (which is almost impossible unless the RNG bugged) and the Survivors manage to reach that corner every single time before you are able to down them closer to any hook... well thats a skill problem on your part and there isnt much to do.
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No one touched generators because they're literally playing as bad as possible while getting unlimited second chances until they finally bleed out. why should match be prolonged when the survivor is playing as bad as possible? She's not making any mistakes but she is getting punished by their anti-slug system. unlimited unbreakable with no limitations/drawback is unhealthy. The video is highlighting the problem of having no limits to being pick up, both via teammates and the unlimited breakable. it takes forever to die and it takes forever for survivor to get punished for poor play.
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It takes forever because the killer is actively playing into the unlimited unbreakable to maximise its effect. She's literally stringing together a chain of colossal misplays, playing to the worst available tactic, and she still gets a landslide win.
You want to talk about getting punished for poor play, talk about hers.
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after a 4k, too.
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she is downing the survivors.... the twins are often forced into actively playing into the unbreakable effect. against these survivor, it does not matter, but against the better survivors, those unbreakables are going to hurt twins a lot. this is why twins has like 1% player-rate and why she is not popular. there is nothing wrong with twins itself in term of the gameplay but the balance of slugging is somewhat unfair for the killer. the survivor has to mess up too much.
Post edited by Devil_hit11 on3 -
And? She still gets tremendous pressure, she just doesn't get to close the match in under two minutes from a 4-slug. That's the literal only disadvantage she suffers here: She has to actually play the match. And that's with her messing up over and over and over and over and not just going for hooks instead of the 4-slug.
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If you’re that concerned about hook deadzones bring Mad Grit, Agitation, and/or Iron Grasp. You can make it really far with those perks. :)
Post edited by Ayodam on0
