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Did Emblem match making give better teammates?
I just started DbD when the switch from Emblem to the current match making took place so I don't really have a point of comparison.
However, while many of my teammates range from decent to better than me, I see a lot of complaints about bad teammates. I've also run into the 'I'm looking out for number one' types as well who generally cause a potential 3E to turn into a 4K.
For those of you who did have a decent to high rank before the change, did you find that your teammates were better before?
I was wondering as when you pip up at Iri that requires, on the average, 3 gens completed, 2 safe unhooks and heals, 45 seconds of being chased, and surviving 7 minutes. However, after that dying still lowers your MMR while you contributed greatly to getting your teammates out.
Is there a noticeable difference in overall teammate quality now?
Comments
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No, the MMR system is actually a better estimate from what I can tell. Evidence for that also came up when they did their big batch of MMR tests earlier this year, the closest matches were the ones where the algorithm most strictly followed the MMR to pair people up and was worst when it followed MMR more loosely or used Grades (which are the same as the old emblem system).
P.S. That's not to be confused with the matchmaking algorithm as a whole. MMR is the underlying rating every player has for survivor and for each killer they own. The matchmaking algorithm is what actually pairs people up. It tries to use the MMR as a guide but there are a lot of situations where it can end up ignoring MMR because of time constraints and lobby dodging and swfs and such and that's where you get most of the mismatches you might see.
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If you go back to when the matched based on Rank color, I think it did, yes. Before about mid-2019.
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Kind of.
With how the emblem system works the survivors would have to have some capability of doing gens, lasting long in chase, or rescuing others. Meaning that there was baseline expectations you could get from survivors in red ranks.
Though it wasn't perfect and the rank system was adjusted many times to make it easier to stay in higher ranks without needing to climb there.
MMR has some issues and it sure isn't perfect, but the main issue is with the match making. The match making system will loosen up and throw people together to reduce queue times over quality games.
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I think it's definitely better at matching Killer with Survivor. I'm just curious if it's working as well with matching survivors with other survivors of similar skill levels. It should but some survivors are amazing and then some others are obviously learning. It's an eclectic mix at times.
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Emblem-Matchmaking and bigger Rank Reset (from 1 to 10 instead of 1 to 5) and you got decent teammates for around 3 weeks. Week 4 was rough, but after Rank Reset games were alright again.
Once they changed it that you only go back to the next Color, the quality of games went downhill pretty fast IMO.
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Yeah, some of that I think is either lobby dodging and/or people with an outlier MMR waiting too long for a match and the system putting them in the next available spot. Also brand new players start out with an average or slightly below average rating and then it goes down as they lose matches so a player who is brand new will probably be against some not-so-no players at first.
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When MMR got activated, I often got good survivors in my team against good killers. But then many killer mains were crying because they couldn’t go against noobs anymore and 4K every match.
Now we have a non functioning matchmaking where people with 1K hours and 50 hours get matched together. Killers 4K most of the time and teammates are terrible.
Solo Q needs buffs.
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MMR now is better than the old emblem system. A complex version of the emblem system with more similarities may provide a better experience, but I can imagine waiting times would be horrid.
It was a good change by BHVR, and even now I wholly support this change and feel it has made the game much better.
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Consistently way better teammates under old ranking. Not perfect, the occasional ‘Why are you here?’ ... but lightyears better than what we have now.
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It was better for me as Survivor but worse for Killer.
As Killer, I did not get fair matches and would go on large winstreaks.
As Survivor, I got semi-competent teammates. Better than what I get now.
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That's kind of how I thought it would be. It seems MMR is better at generally matching Killers with survivors but my impression is that a lot of people get teammates that don't have a basic understanding of what to do for some reason.
Most likely, as @dugman stated, lobby dodging and queue backfilling is creating more issues. Before, an iri or purple ranked Survivor teammate would have guaranteed at least a basic understanding of what to do and I don't think a bronze Survivor would have been queued against a purple or Iri Killer (or I hope they wouldn't have been anyway).
Now, maybe it's worse due to population and MMR bracket issues in some areas? I'm fortunate to get good teammates the majority of the time but that could just be my region and the times I play.
If that is the case, do you think having your MMR affected by how many survivors escape would make a difference?
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I do not.
Our games usually either end in 4E or 4K's with little variation.
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That sucks, sorry to hear that.
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I feel like it was the most accurate from when it was implemented last year up until 2-3 months ago, at least from the survivor side. I for like 7-8 months I really felt like most of my teammates were as good or better than I was, which was great.
I don't feel like the old rank system was terribly accurate, and right now it just feels like chaos to me. I think the shifting in the player base, DCing, suiciding and dodging post 6.1.0 has really scrambled MMR's eggs.
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MMR gives you more accurate teammates. That means that good players are more likely to get consistently good teammates, and bad ones with other bad ones. That said, Low MMR has a very significant "gravitational pull" due to various factors like ragequitting, sandbagging, and generally throwing matches. This means that the skill of one needs to be able to both be proportionate to their role in the 1v4, while also being enough to offset teammates who are not.
Since the sole determining factor of the ranking is based on survival through the exit gate specifically, it leaves multiple places for good players to do bad and bad players to do well. It refines over time as good players are more likely to carry and survive regardless of their allies. This is why when you get to high MMR, everyone is already trained to play well beyond 1/4th of their team, and you get extremely solid teammates. most of the time.
Since bad players can still get carried, you get the occasional person who doesn't belong, just like you can get unlucky good players who are stuck in
ELOMMR hell because people make most of their games uncarryable (which to be fair, still did happen less frequently with emblems.) compared to the emblem system, its much harder to climb in general, which is why it has a pretty decent correlation to skill even while skipping most of the factors regarding skill in the game. Since none of those considerations are present in the emblem system, it basically becomes a matter of average players being able to climb as much as strong ones, just taking longer to get there.I would say that MMR is more accurate, but I wouldn't necessarily say its better. The game is much more balanced for emblems than MMR, since the game itself is horribly unbalanced. There are simply too many match deciding factors that can have little to nothing to do with player input on either side, far too much agency denial, and all MMR does is teach people how to min/max those more effectively. It removes nearly all variety at high level play, while also making it harder to get there in the first place. Its just not a very even distribution, nor is it fitting for the game's original design.
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I've always seen it as a side grade tbh both have problems and I don't think its gotten any better
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No that's not what happened. Survivor's used to get queued against worse killer's because of them being filled into their lobby's. Now that the ratios is changed it's the opposite. We could have matchmaking be "tighter" were It doesn't just hit 3 min and start filling in who ever is available.
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Yes, the old system was better till they changed it. Once they made the reset only move one bracket that's when it started causing big issues.
Sure towards the end of the month it was more watered down but good players quickly climbed to iri 1.
The best thing about the system is YOU WAS REWARDED FOR YOUR SKILL, now its escape or you did bad in the system eyes...
Old system just needed tweaks, it actually tracked what happened in games and judge you on it
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I felt the emblem system was better in the sense that everyone seemed on the same level of play.
It was also a clear indicator of skill level. It didn't feel like it was kept hidden. As a yellow rank ghostface getting dunked on by a red rank lobby of Meta Mike and the boys was frustrating but I thought "they are more experienced than me" not "I suck".
I know people will take issue with rank = skill but at the very least it indicates time played. I equate time played to experience and experience to skill.
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It was a lot better as survivor for me. Now a days i play mostly in duo with my boyfriend and we tend to get horrible teammates that never do gens and dont last long in chases so we try to get full parties with friends that at least can do something. And we are both good so i dont get why we get bad teammates. We die most of our matches because of our horrible teammates. When im in solo q at times i get some decent ones but most of the time they are awful. I always try to do as much as i can objective, chase and altruism wise but its hard to have a good match when most of the time the game throws you people that play like its their first game. Before I always got teammates that were at my level, except in rank reset when it was always a mix. As killer on the other hand its a 50/50. I suck at killer cause i dont really like it nearly as much as survivor but half my matches are horrible survivors and the other half are coordinated SWF bullies. I dont think the current system works as intended cause it doesnt have a good criteria to match players and MMR levels with. For me it should have stayed emblem based cause at least emblems showed how much effort you put into the different aspects of the game to be able to progress through them. If you were rank 1 you clearly play a lot and contribute to matches meaning youll get matches with players like that too. Instead now i get paired with people that stay crouching and running around the entire match when im always doing something to get gens done and help my teammates. Current MMR is a broken system that should have never been implemented.
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It was really bad. A lot of incompetent people in red ranks, and far worse: people in the forum, who ended every post with "and im in red rank, so my opinion is right".
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No. At night I kept getting rank 20 team mates when I was rank 1.
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Speaking from a day 1 perspective and seeing all the changes I believe there was a short period of time when the ranked system was actually better than MMR but survivors complained they couldn't rank up and they had long que times at high ranks, so the devs altered the change and it went haywire and didn't work properly, the current MMR is better than what was in place right before it but there was one time during ranked matchmaking where it was the most balanced and even matchmaking I've ever seen in the game, unfortunately the group of whiny survivors that never play killer got it taken away because they couldn't be rank 1 and the best player ever in their mind anymore and the ego couldn't take it.
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Given recent revelations about how SBMM works, at least for "high MMR" games it's pretty much identical to the old rank based matchmaking with red ranks.
I do think it's a bit more accurate for lower MMR brackets though.
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