Every change has brought as good as only advantages for the swf...
there are a lot of things that are very strong in swf that aren't usable in solo q or don't bring as much of an advantage as playing swf, from perks to information about where the killer is and much more, few examples:
MMR change, solo q: Very bad for the solo, people who are experienced and have thousands of hours are now made with hundreds of hours of players who hide at the edge of the map and get scared with a little TR, die very quickly in the chase and much more
SWF: you play with your friends everything stays the same only you don't get ok-good players like before the change, but now swf players also get 500h killers in the lobby who of course have no chance and ask him if it's fun if 5 gens are finished and he only has his 1 hook
killer buffs and Meta Perk changes, solo q: Your mates in the solo q didn't last long before either, but since the change to the basekit for the killers, they die much faster and the changes to the meta perks result in a lot of dcs and self kills on the hook because they don't last long survive and if it's a nurse, many will do it immediately because they're already frustrated, no more ds if they die again in 10sec and are tunneled accordingly, no dead hard to get to a loop quickly, no iron will where they can hide next to the killer because they are not so good at looping and hiding also brings time in, all that and much more is left out for the solo q who also had it very difficult
SWF: the changes were a bit small for the swf, the group members won't start dying or becoming usless faster, less cooldown after a hit ? break pallets faster? Longer gene time? a swf that doesn't consist of bots laughs about it, Perks changes... "hay mate you get tunneled ? yes, come to the shack i need a tank", just don't forget bloodlust, just bad in the solo q, how can you buff that ? in a swf "I need a hit tank that wants me to bloodlust" hit tank and everything is gone
and now comes Perma Unbreakable: solo q: "Oh boy I don't need a mate I can get up myself" done
SWF: Benefits for the swf: We can play as many perk builds that killers troll all day, just Sabo swf alone, or even better Power struggle swf, a mate simply has to be nearby who is being chased and then you as a killer can't do anything, and neither of them other mates can make gens, as it was before it was obvious that the solo q will go down, bhvr little spoiler i'm not clairvoyant but many will be so upset that you'll do something to the sabo stuff and to power struggle, that's like RPD with sabo swf....
swf is like Nurse, just not healthy for the game, perks have to be changed because the swf can abuse it (one of thousand examples, build over because of swf troops on rpd), like Nurse because of her a perk had to be changed because she does it can abuse too much
DOWN WITH SWF AND DOWN WITH NURSE ! so that the game can regain its health
Comments
-
At least 50% of the survivor player base is made up of SWF. Not every swf is a death squad out to ruin the killer's game. Hell, not even the majority of swf are out to ruin the killer's game. Removing swf won't make the game healthier, it'll kill it.
11 -
I will never understand the argument that the killer buffs affected solo queue more than swf survivors. Yes, solo queue can be rough, it could be rough, and now even more so. But the change hasn't affected matches with bad team mates anymore than it has affected matches for good swf teams. It's the same with nerfs to meta perks. The Dead Hard nerf hit swf survivors just as hard as solo survivors. It's just that solo survivors were already in a weaker spot.
And the same goes for the basekit Unbreakeable. In fact, I believe that would indeed help solo survivors more than swf survivors, because now solo survivors do not have to rely on team mates to pick them up, and vice versa, as a solo survivor, you know that the downed survivor can pick themselves up now if they are left on the ground.
10 seconds more on gens for example had the exact same effect on swf as it had on solo survivor. The problem is arguably just that solo survivors need to be brought up more to the level of swf survivors soon enough, when killers get balanced more around swf survivors.
Camping and tunneling are also the biggest frustrations for survivors to deal with at the moment, and it becomes especially frustrating when realising that both those strategies are clearly harder to deal with for solo survivors than for swf survivors. Just nerfing those tactics in proper ways would already close the gap between solo and swf survvors.
The game also defniitely needs to finally buff solo survivors by giving them more information that swf survivors have. With nerfs to tunneling and camping, this might require some more improvements to killer as well, hard to tell. But it surely needs to happen.
2 -
Removing swf is a bad idea. A game without the ability to play with friends is insane. Solo q needs a buff that applies to it only. Keep saying there needs to be a vc function in game so solo q survs can communicate. Would make solo q more bearable and not affect swf
2 -
Feels like you got "swf" and "experienced, high skill swf" (and for good measure, "trolling swf/bully squad") a bit confused. Very common mistake.
But most swfs aren't that good. Arguably, most swfs are in the low-to-average skill pool, which makes them not that much harder to face than solos, and their escape rate at equal skill is almost always "within a few percent" of solos' escape rate. (Quoting Peanits).
I think the matchmaking is more to blame than the abstract fact of "swf", a.k.a. letting people play with their friends.
1 -
you can't be sure of it since we should see 1st how things will go in a similar case... honestly if SWF won't be relegated only in custom matches, the nurse can stay the way she is right now (or even BUFFED)... if it was for me, both things would be dumpered into the fire once and for all due to their gamebreaking nature...
0 -
Voice chat only works for US players. In EU people speak different languages.
3 -
Most people still speak English to some degree and are more than capable to communicate. Especially "younger" people under 40 years old speak English. If you don't speak English you can easily turn VC off.
0 -
Are you in EU servers? Because that’s completely false.
You can’t expect everyone to speak English. Plenty of players in my lobbies do not speak English.
So me someone who mains Solo Q would have to turn a big buff off and still have a miserable experience because of the place I live irl?
3 -
Yes I am. People who don't speak English is not very common in my experience. VC works in other games, why shouldn't it work in DBD?
2 -
I can be sure of it. Relegating SWF to customs only is not only punishing people for playing with their friends, it assumes that everybody has 4 friends to play with. Removing it outright would effectively kill this game.
Sure, a few thousand might still cling to the game but the vast majority would just quit. Too many people act like swf is this unbeatable behemoth. High MMR swfs are, but the majority of the player base is mid at best.
Not to mention the fact that there's no progression in custom games. You can't grade-up, you can't earn bp, you can't earn xp, and everyone basically abides by gentleman's rules.
2 -
No, it really doesn´t.
For example, gen times and regression perks. Imagine a gen done to 90%, then the killer comes, kicks it, and it regresses, while you get chased.
In swf you can always tell the others what gen was almost done and started regressing, so someone can just spend the time, go to that gen directly, and safe all your hard work.
In solo queue, you just cant. It is not uncommon to come back to a gen you had nearly finished and it regressed down to 0 again.
Thus, the 10 seconds extra and some of the perk changes really affected solo way more than swf, because communication can easily compensate for that.
Sure, dead hard affected both equaly, but an swf can organize a coordinated rescue against tunneling and camping, in a way solo can´t, thus those perks are more important in solo queue when they are in swf.
Also, more information will not help you with bad teammates, that hide in a corner anyway.
0 -
Well, the last survey had a question about casual and competitive play, as i remember? Changes might be coming anyway.
0 -
It already takes forever to find lobbies as killer. I wouldn't put much stock in that survey.
0 -
I still wonder why this game didn't go the Friday the 13th route, Its probably because certain streamers have a cult following and they're the only ones giving hope to this game even if the devs are barely doing anything.
0 -
VC on EU Servers would be a complete ######### fest - mainly because there seem to be two big languages: English and Russian. There are also a number of people who speak neither. Knowing that immature people are present in every game and that they will use VC to put their immaturity on display .... no thanks.
0 -
I get a lot of Eastern European players in my lobbies and 80% of them put no effort into speaking English and just speak their own language between each other.
1 -
That might be true for some people but for the most part people can communicate in English to some levels. I'm not denying it will be problematic in some cases but for players who wish to use VC there are possibilities to make it work.
0 -
So I guess just screw those people?
1 -
I guess you are not in europe, otherwise you were aware that it is not "some people". Having people in a solo queue you can not communicate with is rather the norm than the exception.
You already can use VC, a lot of swf do it. However, you cant bring it to the game, because then you need to balance around that as well, and that won´t be easier than now.
1 -
Mini basekit BT, Ressuarance and soon the mini basekit Unbreakable...
Every buff to Solos so far was a free buff for SWFs on top.
0 -
You're kidding yourself if you think Reassurance was good. Like, wow, you can get value out of it on Midwich, Gideon and RPD if you're directly above the hooked survivor.
0 -
In my region, half of the playerbase speaks spanish while the other half speaks portuguese. Even if i can understand english, i will never be able to understand a full speed portuguese speaker.
So in my case VC would probably lead to a hilarious shouting fest of people trying to say location and events and the others doing the exact opposite.
2 -
What do you mean screw those people? They are already being screwed right now aren't they? It can't possibly get any worse, can it?
You can't make the game perfect for everyone but you can at least make it better for as many people as possible.
I'm not saying VC will fix it all, but I believe it will make the game better for a lot of people. Just give solos SOMETHING at this point, and by something I mean tools to help for information. If not VC then something else.
0 -
I mean a lot of players I've randomly met up with online from the eu speak basic english, and there are a lot of other languages in common, even with u.s. residents i.e. spanish and french.
Even if there is a language barrier it doesn't make VC a detriment. Just a resource that can be used to help stop some solo q games turning into the headless chicken simulator I often see in solo q.
Edit: I live in the U.K. so my matchmaking is usually europe. I do occasionally come across people in games who don't speak english, but not all that often.
0 -
I wouldn't say give solos more than swf, then it feels like you're being punished for playing with friends. Action icons and basekit kindred would be really impactful though.
0 -
Again, VC will not fix anything when people don't speak the same language. Icons near the survivors showing what everyone is doing would be understood universally.
1 -
It's the devs' attempt to fix solo queue by making survivors broken in general. And just like killer nerfs, it makes the killer weaker, the survivors who know how to vs that killer get stronger, and the ones who don't know how to vs that killer stay the same. You can't balance the game for bad players without destroying it for good players. This includes matchmaking. If I'm good at survivor, I want 3 equally good teammates, not 1 good and 2 terrible.
0 -
you can't take that as an argument, i mean most swf troop didn't abuse buil over on rpd, but still the perk was nerfed and rpd was modified to do so, by that logic nothing should ever be done to it, most swf troop clearly didn't abuse it... of course it makes no sense! even if only one swf troupe would abuse it, it would have to be changed as it is not right and not good for the game, I mean then you can say, why is a perk changed? most Nurse players are bad and don't play Starstruck, Agi... but it was changed anyway because of a few Nurse mains who abuse it! double standard ? you can also clearly check the stats Nurse has had a bad kill rate so far, does Nurse need a buff? why is a perk changed because of her? according to the logic it shouldn't be like that because most Nurse players would clearly not abuse it...
and i never say "kill swf or nurse", I say much more that the two need a nerf and not small but significant, as far as the swf is concerned you could give solo q good buffs that would also work, no matter what has to happen because many people no longer feel like solo q, at some point is the patience at the end (same for me) for almost 4 years I play dbd 95% solo q and I have over 8k+ hours and it has never been so frustrating to play dbd as it is now, there is only SWF, killer or dies
swf is too easy, solo q is death and just frustrating, killer isn't that nice either because you are currently encountering many swf troops because the solo q players are running away from bhvr, either you get a 4 man swf or solo q bots die dcing -selfkill on the hook, so the range between solo q and swf has never been as big as it is now
0 -
Well I disagree. I get your point, but I feel like that is quite the rarity. Often enough, survivors are already working on other gens, so it might not be worth it running over to the gen that was kicked and being regressed. I feel by that logic, any nerf to survivor, or buff to killer, is better for swf than for solo survivor.
The etxra 10 seconds are extra 10 seconds, no matter if swf or solo. It's just that it's more noticeable with solo survivor, because that role was already in a rougher spot.
There is no doubt that solo survivors do need buffs, giving them a lot of the information that swf survivors have. It's impossible to balance a game perfectly if there is such a balance gap between solo and swf survivors.
Regarding the coordinated rescue against tunneling and camping, that is just another reason why I think nerfing camping and tunneling more should have the highest priority right now.
However, I do not have any idea how bad team mates are relevant when discussing balance like this? Bad team mates can't be fixed with balance.
0 -
You want to punish people for playing with their friends. That's what nerfing SWF is, and will also effectively kill the game. Perks can be nerfed and adjusted when they're overperforming. You can't nerf a collective group of players.
The solution is and always will be to bring solo queue up to the level of SWF and reduce the gap between the two as much as possible. On the killer side, maps need to be looked at. There needs to be less strong loops, more loops where there's counterplay, and maps made smaller so that killers can get downs at a consistent pace.
0 -
In solo queue, it'll be the same as it always has. No recent buff or nerf caused that.
Run Rookie Spirit if you're having trouble tracking regressing generators. Otherwise just pay more attention or pray that your teammates pay more attention. Even solo queue has a certain level of coordination, if everyone is individually decent.
People sometimes treat SWF as 4 Mohammed Ali who will beat on a baby killer, and solo queue survivors as some sort of handicapped children, when in reality, the vast majority of SWF are 4 pepe frogs trying their best (not that good) and solo queue is a bunch of pepe frogs trying their best (not that good either) without communication.
0 -
Read again, i was talking about solo. With coordination in a good SWFs Reassurance is strong as f.
Not only the 6m radius you can use on Gideon and Midwich to make it work on 2 floors. On other maps you still can just run pass the hook, maybe get injured and activate it. If the killer follows, keep looping. If not, you have more 30secs. more for gens. Not letting the hooked surv get into struggle phase is huge. Also, it can work multiple times when your mates have the perk too. It's like "Deadlock" for survs if you think about it.
And yes, i tried it to work in solo for like 30 games. Won't help if you're mates just farm anyway.
0 -
It’s 2022, why aren’t you all speaking Americ—I mean English? /s
0 -
If I could talk to my survivor teammates I'd be banned after two matches because I have to find SOME way to put into words just how useless they are.
0 -
There isn't much BHVR can do about it
But yea adding icons on the HUD and basekit Kindred can help
But will that stop some players for trying to save... (not really cause it's a choice)
0 -
Pretty sure it's possible to do that without getting banned. Unless you have the impulse control of a hyperactive 12 year old who just discovered curse words. I've constructively criticised teammates and opponents after my dbd games in dms, and haven't had any issues there.
Hell if i can calm down someone i tunneled out early game while sweating for an adept. Im sure you can behave like a reasonable human being on VC, and if that is really too hard for you then you simply wouldn't need to put your mic in.
0 -
Ok well that was a joke but thanks so much for the advice
0 -
Lol fair enough. Hard to tell sarcasm online lol
0 -
All of this. I wish I could like it more than once, this is so on point
0 -
Yeah good point. I mean the entire mmr system is flawed because it only being based off of kills and escapes, but I 100% agree that the skill-range should be narrowed again. The max mmr cap was also decreased at some point I remember, that also needs to be reverted if you ask me.
0
