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Gen rushing = Camping/tunneling
I don’t understand why most people can’t see the correlation between gen rushing and face camping?
SWF’s load up with perks to bust out gens, bring map offerings and coordinate everything. It’s 4 v. 1. You’re not winning (if you win) because you’re skilled, you’re winning because you’re in constant communication w each other.
I am a Trapper main (and honestly I do quite well, but I constantly face tough SWF teams), yesterday I had a team bring me to Ormond. Okay I’ll make the best of it…game starts, I set down a trap..walk a short distance, put down another trap..a gen pops ALREADY. Start first chase, gen pops, down survivor, gen pops…hook survivor, gen pops…I don’t know how it’s possible..but that’s 4 gens in mere minutes. There’s 1 gen left…the game just started, why am I not going to camp the person I just hooked? 1 gen left. Game is already over. I ended up w a 3k, but it’s irrelevant. Still lost a pip. Had zero fun.
At 5 gens, camping and tunneling is completely ridiculous. Yes. But being gen rushed and camping/tunneling go hand in hand. Expecting to gen rush and have the killer give everyone their three hooks each, is highly unrealistic.
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There is no correlation
Killers call genrushing what most times is the result of their own misplays (commonly referred to as "the game is survivor sided 😢"). And killers camp and tunnel even if the game is going clearly in their favor already
Post edited by egg_ on54 -
Because survivors are allowed to do whatever they want to give themselves the huge edge in the match, but if the killer uses any tactics like camping/tunneling/slugging to give themselves the upper hand they're being a toxic piece of #########. Losing 2 or 3 gens at the first chase is basically standard against coordinated survivors because of how ridiculously safe and pallet dense the maps are. I use Lethal Pursuer and plenty of times 1 to 2 gens will go even when getting directly to a survivor immediately and downing them in a reasonably fast time. Anyone that's playing killer and they have 1 or 2 hooks before a gen pops are playing against bad survivors. The gens fly faster than ever after the newest update, it's obnoxious
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Game is already over. I ended up w a 3k, but it’s irrelevant. Still lost a pip. Had zero fun.
Sounds more like a problem with the pip system than anything else if you killed three survivors and lost a pip.
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Spoken like a spoiled survivor main *yawn*
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100% agree. I think the pip system is something dbd needs to work on.
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I have not been in these so called "games where the survs pop 3/4 gens in the first chase" not even once in my entire dbd playtime.
The only times i can remember of a similar situation are when killers were purposely AFK or the killer was very new to the game and could not use their character properly.
Do you know why i havent been in these situations?
Because that kind of play are usually reserved to high MMR matches where you cant possibly reach unless you play a good swf team.
As current MMR works, it is way easier to up your mmr as killer than soloq survs. So expect constant SWF teams as you must have passed the point where you could get matched with normal soloQ players like me.
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The pip system is really just a legacy relic of the old matchmaking system, personally I just totally ignore it. Yeah there’s a monthly bloodpoint bonus for Grades but I honestly don’t care about that too much. 🤷♂️
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I play solo survivor too and trust me, my teams are nothing like the teams I have as killer. I play with a bunch of potatoes and then end up playing against the navy seals …it’s ridiculous.
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There is no such thing as gen rushing.
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Killers here say it’s basically when survivors don’t save teammates & instead just focus gens.
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Are they talking about survivors sitting on gens and saving at last second? Cause honestly thats pretty scary to go against. Still not genrushing though, just being smart.
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It seems it’s just survivors who refuse to do anything but work on gens. Not sure how that is possible since killers can chase survivors off gens, trap gens, and manipulate them otherwise, but the specific example commonly used to illustrate genrushing is survivors letting a teammate die on hook in priority of finishing gens. The tactic is said to be most common amongst SWF, although I personally have never seen this.
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Just now I got camped at 5 gens. Must have been that crazy genrushing am I right?
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Yes, it is unrealistic to hook everyone three times and expect to win, especially against a coordinated SWF team. The real issue is that a lot of survivors who complain about camping and tunneling have either never played killer or don’t play often enough to go against good survivors on a regular basis, so they have zero idea of what it takes to win as killer. Especially lower tier killers like Trapper
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Oh no, the survivors did their only objective. "HOW DARE THEY!"
Should they twiddle their thumbs when killers arent pressuring them?
A killer that cant find them on a gen cant be chased (for those who ascribe to the 'chases are the only fun part of the game')
Also, No Way Out and NOED are extremely effective at getting at LEAST one more kill in your average match if you're even barely competent with killer as a whole.
If you cant see why there isnt a correlation, you have MUCH to learn my friend.
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Well you wouldn’t be the one genrushing; your team letting you die & finishing all five gens while you were hooked (instead of trading or whatever) would be genrushing. Did the others get out? And were they using perks designed to counter gen regression perks (hyperfocus vs. thanatophobia, Repressed Alliance vs. Jolt/Call of Brine, etc). Certain perks are genrushy too even though they exist to counteract killer slowdown perks.
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And camping/tunneling = gen rushing
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I died at 5gens, so what do you think?
There was no genrushing.
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The fact none of you even know what gen rushing is, is sad. You’re either low level killers or survivor mains with no regard for how anything else in dbd works. Or faking ignorant.
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Can you not read? Or did you intentionally ignore the part where I said camping at 5 gens is uncalled for?
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No. Any good killer knows if you’re camping against a good team, you’re allowing survivors that time to bust out gens without fear of being chased off. So like I said, it’s the other way around.
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It's uncalled for yet it happens all the time.
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You obviously don’t understand what gen rushing is, and I’m not going to repeat myself. So maybe read the post again slowly. And if you were as woke to DBD as you think you are, you would realize how weak NOED is against good swfs …noed is for baby teams.
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There is no correlation. As an example many times it isn’t “gen rushing” it is the killers own inability to catch someone so they overcommit to a chase. As a result they think their only option is to camp and tunnel that person. That isn’t gen rushing, it’s only because it’s much easier to blame it on that than your own skill (or lack there of).
There are legit times when the term gen rushing becomes an excuse, rather than what it really is.
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>Game is already over. I ended up w a 3k
I'm not saying what you described isn't frustrating, but if I was going to pop a quick anecdote into my post, I'd probably pick one that supported my argument better... maybe even one that rose to the level of "at all"
Like, we've all camped to secure a 1k. Just say that.
"Ended with a 3k" unbelievable
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You’ve heard of teams being too altruistic? Apparently these forums are full of survivors and low level killers. I’ve seen maybe two people with an actual understanding.
So, let me help you, when teams are overly altruistic, it usually leads to death or multiple survivors. So two of them came to rescue their Ada and got downed. The 4th survivor left, instead of trying to save either of them. So the point was, even though it was a 3k, I lost a pip and the only survivor had 17k points. Pointless game. But 95% of you don’t even understand what grn rushing is so 🤷🏻♀️
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Both are choices made either before the match or during the match
Both are choices made to shorten the match... in one way, shape or form
Both aren't fun for the other side
Both are hard to solve... either due to coding or ideas
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All Killers (except Nurse & Blight) need a huge buff. They will add base kit unbreakable, for Killer, they should add base kit Corrupt Intervention.
A lot of Killers are unplayable against a SWF teams, not matter what. Sometimes your chases end very fast, but still is not enough.
In future Patch Killer will not Slug (it was the best way to make pressure on the map, just 1 slugged person). Camping is nerfed, Tunneling is nerfed.
In future Killer won't be able to do anything... And the worst part of it - strong & confident (sometimes very toxic) SWF will abuse it.
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I agree and I think corrupt intervention base kit would be 100% fair as a match to unbreakable base kit. But I doubt they’ll ever go for it, this game caters to SWF survivors.
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But... that's...gen rushing, at least my definition, ik it's not a real thing, but that's...idk how to explain it, but it's gen rushing, lol
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It’s exactly what I said it is, hon. Anything else?
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The only reason they’re adding basekit UB is because with the new killer mori system, without basekit UB a killer can slug three survivors, mori the 4th, and then the other three are auto sacrificed. Devs don’t give a hoot about slugging but they’re not nimrods. They know there’s no way that basekit mori can go live without some sort of check/balance.
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Rules are for killers. Not survivors.
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No. That is using your time wisely, not gen rushing.
Gen rushing, is when a SWF coordinates with each other to all load up on gen rushing perks and fully loaded toolboxes. But everyone on this board is acting like they have no idea what it is. Like there isn’t 50 other posts about perks regarding gen rushing. When SWF teams plan to “gen rush,” they know exactly what they’re doing ahead of time.
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I don't understand the correlation of camping and genrushing, but I do see OP's point with tunneling. Tunneling can also be caused by survivor misplays. Your point with genrushing being caused by misplays is also something I agree on.
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I'm killer main, I play both side but I prefer killer. Trust me, sometimes I tried to camp/tunnel only at 3 gens, it ended up losing/having bad time to win because anybody was dead and the gen were a lot faster. If someone camp and tunnel at 5 gens is only because he/she knows very well that if she doesn't do that the game will be hard/impossible to win.
Genrush and camping/tunneling are the same thing: doing the objective as fast as possible to win, but the first is ok, the seconds are toxic behaviour for the community. Why? People didn't tunnel years ago because genrush wasn't a problem, now people tunnel because isn't fun to "play fair" and loose because you don't have the time to chase someone else.
I'm a veteran of the game, tunneling doesn't come naturally to me, because in the first years of playing I didn't need it. Now, even with chases lasting about 20 seconds, you can't keep up with the gen.
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Maps are still a problem, but if it takes you 90 seconds do down a survivor without spreading damage at all, it is fairly likely you are being outplayed as well, or simply making a few misplays. Not to mention the game also has a fair amount of maps that are fairly balanced. I can assure you that if a killer has one or two hooks before a gen pops, it's not always because of bad survivors. That is just bullocks, made up by people that can't accept they aren't as good at killer as some other people.
Camping and tunneling are insanely unhealthy for the game. Pretty much everyone hates those tactics and for good reasons. This isn't about one side not allowed to do whatever it takes them to gain an advantage, this topic has always been about unfun and unhealthy gameplay that shouldn't be as effective.
Not to mention that there simply is no survivor equivalent of camping and tunneling at the moment, especially after the 6.1.0 update.
Is killer in a perfect spot now? Definitely not, and this is especially because of badly designed maps. No doubt. But killers already received a bunch of buffs that helped them out. Now it's the survivors turn to get some help against camping and tunneling. And from there on, the devs can continue to try and improve the game experience for both sides.
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both sides need to accept this simple fact: there is no wrong or right way to do your objective. There is nothing wrong with tunneling or camping or doing gens fast. If that’s what you want to do, do it. As a killer main, there is no way to tell if you will get an uncoordinated solo team or seal team 6. There’s also no way to gauge how fast or slow the gens will be (other than the fact that you are almost guaranteed to lose 2 gens in the first 90 seconds). Abandon made up rulebooks and just play how you want. There is no reward for playing nice as killer. They will teabag at the gate and/or complain in the end game chat either way.
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Only survivor tacticts are allowed in this game,you didn't know ?
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Define gen rushing. I see so many killers blame their losses on gen rushing when it was clearly their own fault. Personally i consider genrushing is when you center your entire build around generators (prove thyself, hyperfocus, bnp toolboxes...). but its not like you see that every game
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Yea it definitely seems like an exaggeration. I play trapper and i basically concede the first gen because i'm setting up my board with traps the way i need it. Sometimes conceding the first gen will mean 2 gens. I use corrupt intervention to lessen that. But i've never really had 3 on me right away and if it happens that quick it's definitely an elite team that will destroy me anyway.
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Lotta posts on both sides missing the core issue and focusing on one side or another. The issue is that survivors start stronger than the killer and become weaker than them: Killers need to reduce survivor efficiency as fast and efficiently as possible, while survivors need to crank out as much damage as they can before they start losing hands on deck. It creates a chicken/egg paradox where camping/tunneling and genrushing cause each other, due to players adapting to assuming X will happen to them, so they do Y preemptively. Killers like Trapper and Hag get especially hurt by this, as their setup time is directly anathema to their ability to reduce the efficiency of the survivors during the very time they need to the most.
People can go back and forth about how their side gets it worse than the other, but it is a universal design issue and was even addressed when concepts like some kind of "early game collapse" were kicked around internally. The bottom line is that survivors need to start weaker on gen pressure and lose less overall efficiency for each person down or out. There could be plenty of ways to apply a normalization to efficiency caps, but half the problems it currently causes are solutions to the other problems it causes, and they kinda go back and forth like that with each small bandaid adjustment that gets thrown in.
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Perfectly explaining why MMR is bad.
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Any complaints involving "SWF" should never be considered for the game balance.
If the game is balanced around SWF then the game is gonna be atrocious for solo q, therefore the game will die
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Why not as sanity checks or smoke tests? Limiting excessive potential without hurting general use is how you are supposed to balance for any ranked system, so ideally everything should be balanced in a way that only limits the potential of SWF without affecting normal play (or even casual SWF.)
It comes up because it is the cause of extremely frequent oversights that affect high level play a lot more than low level play. Addressing both is perfectly valid, and without SWF the same sanity and smoke testing would apply in different ways. Communication really does just make things extremely hard to balance when the game was specifically designed around disorganization.
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You say this like Gen Rushing doesn't exist yet people bring toolboxes with Hyperfocus/Stakeout/Fast Track to literally blow through gens in half the time.
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Repairing gens is an objective. Facecamping, slugging, or tunneling someone out is a conscious decision made by killers who lack the skill to control a match or focus on more than one person at a time. I'm not referring to aggressive survivors who put themselves in your way.
Survivors have no other way of escape, whereas killers can make a choice to play differently.
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If gen was 1% done it is genrushing and should be dealt with. The only proper response is tunneling at 5 gens.
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Communication is a big part of it, but the fact that items/addons increase so substantially in power makes the game really hard to balance.
Like tonight I was playing killer and I usually stick with brown/yellow addons. Got hit by a couple of good teams running purple gear and maybe communicating. So I switch to the best addons. Next game is against a group running browns and nothing gear wise and I crushed them. The gear can have a big impact on the game, but unless everyone comes on the same level it creates a clear mismatch.
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"Game is already over. I ended up w a 3k, but it’s irrelevant."
At some point, the goalpost moved from 'I just want a fair shot at 3k+' to 'Yeah, I got my 3k+, but it was hard, and that's unfair'.
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