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Why is killer able to see survivor items in lobby?
So, I know the first thing everyone will say, and that's so the killer can strategize on what perks to bring. However, all that goes out the window when survivors swap characters at 6 seconds and everything gets locked in,something made even easier with the new saved builds thing. So, why even bother to show me what items the survivors are bringing when they have nothing in their hands, then BAM FOUR FLASHLIGHTS AND MATCH IS STARTING.
The problem also is when that happens, it's a red flag you are going against a coordinated Discord 4-man SWF and... you're going to get rolled the entire match. I've gotten to the point that I run Franklin's Demise on Pig at all times, don't even care if the survivors don't have flashlights and BNP Toolboxes, etc... They will either swap at the last second, or they'll find them in match.
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I gotta know when to switch to lightborn to cpunter the flashlight bully squads. I prestiged hillbilly for a reason. It certainly wasnt to play him lol.
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I still like the idea that the survivors get 30 seconds to finalize their builds, then it locks. Then killer has an additional 30 seconds to set theirs. What killer is being used is then revealed to the survivors (after they have finalized, so they can't switch to counter him) so if they don't want to play, they can dip. You'd have significantly less disconnects/suicides this way. I would also reveal the number of players that queued together from the onset. Put little brackets over them to show they were in a party together.
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Yes, that sounds good, though not so much the telling of a SWF as many players would dodge all SWFs and the game would be nearly unplayable.
But, just making you unable to change items once you are in the killer lobby would IMO be enough. Set your character before, same as killer has to do.
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I'm okay with that though. Now that I have to leave crossplay on for incentive bonus, I notice killers dip all the time when it's 4 steam players. Before, when I had crossplay off, I would spend probably 2-3 minutes in lobby as the first half dozen or so killers leave purely because it was 4 steam users. Even with no items equipped.
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Imo the whole pre-game lobby phase could be skipped. Imagine how much time would be saved. No more dodging, no more waiting to ready up. I wish.
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Any indication of the killer will result in so much lobby dodging that certain killers will be unplayable.
You will never see four survivors at once that are happy to load into a game knowing it's going to be Nurse.
And before anyone says it, no it's not a sign that "Nurse is broken" or anything like that (regardless of how true that may be).
If you give survivors a consequence-free way to shop around for their 'favourite' (easier) killers, they will.
It's the exact same reason killers shouldn't know if the survivors in their lobby are a SWF.
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Just adjust your own play style.
If i find a team going for multiple flash light saves i'll just slug and camp.
You know its going to be a hard game, so make it hard on your terms, either someone will sit there dying for 3 minutes or you'll be trading slugs.
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Right, so let's load the lobby and have people DC/suicde instead. OR... we can be honest and admit that if there is such a huge problem with certain killers that they should be looked into and not just ignored. Killers dodge lobbies constantly as it is. Why are you the only ones that get to avoid what looks to be an unpleasant game for you? Oh, right, because it's all about you, isn't it?
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Nobody should be DCing or dodging lobbies, and no, those killers arent broken, players just dont want to try. Oh wait your the guy who twists other people's words into what you want to argue against.
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This. Not to mention that lobby dodging messes with the matchmaking process, by trying to fill in replacement players as soon as possible (rather than another similarly ranked survivor or killer).
Survivors have a right to equip items they bought or acquired in a previous trial, without some major prejudice from the killer. Items are part of the game, and flashlights are situational enough as it is that survivors don’t need to face a perk that punishes you just for trying to use the item for its intended purpose.
If you want a sure way to counter flashlights or other items, equip your anti-item perks in advance. Survivors don’t get to consider what killer, add-ons, or perks they may be facing. They can only guess. Same should be true for killer.
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There is no twisting. This is what you're saying. You just don't seem to comprehend what it is you're asking for. There are many things in this game that are not remotely balanced. They can't be, by nature of many things like map design, item/addon rarities, perk builds, and so on. One game against a huntress will go one one, but if the huntress switches to her best addons and the survivors bring no items, the balance is heavily skewed in her favor, and this could be the exact same five players.
Why should anyone be forced to suffer through a 10-20minute game against things they hate? No one complains when the killer DC's against three people that have been doing nothing but set up headons and blinds for ten minutes. In fact, the ones considered at fault at the survivors. Wait... I think I see the pattern here. It's always the survivor at fault. Wait for bot mode. You won't have any more DC's or toxic survivors then.
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You're literally making up a load of killer complaints and attributing them to me.
My stance is, as I've already said; no one should be DCing and lobby dodging.
Maybe try reading what I say instead of twisting my words to suit your narrative.
Grow a spine. Yes the game isn't and never will be perfectly balanced, suck it up instead of throwing a tantrum when you don't get your way. The fact that survivors DC isn't an indication of a killer being broken, because survivors DC wheneve they so much as stub their toe.
Oh no, I said something anti-survivor, I must be a "killer main"! How dare I blaspheme so, I must be verbally crucified on the forums by Nihilus!
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Since I can't switch my killer character in the lobby like a survivor can, I do take note of items. For example, if I am playing a killer I don't play often, I might take different perks or addons to get through the match
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Better question is: Why can't we switch a killer in the lobby?
To OP: "Look at the message above"
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it's hypocrisy
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Nothing's being made up. The complaints are all around you. I have plenty of spine. It's why I don't care what punishment you offer, you cannot and will not get me to try in a trial that's just awful. At best, you can make me bleed out while I go do something else, but you will not make me play as your punching bag. You want to punish DC's? Fine. I'll work on a gen until you pull me off and hook me, then get out. If you make the game unpleasant, I can not and will not be forced to make it fun for you in return.
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According to the poster LastChild this is fair and acceptable behavior.
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Killer "specific" MMR for the "working" matchmaking that totally isn't throwing all considerations into the wind for faster queue times. /S
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Matchmaking is a joke. As killer I get thrown against either completely inept people or 4 Einsteins. No inbetween, the MMR system is garbage.
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That was my point.
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Why not? Hillbilly's still pretty strong, super fun, has a skill ceiling, has instadowns, great anti-loop and insane mobility. Overheat does nothing unless you're camping or are unrealistically bad at playing him. He's arguably near A tier if in the right hands with the right addons!
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I just dont get on with him personally. Always struggle to hit those chainsaw charges lol.
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Okay, so no flashlights in the lobby, no need to bring Lightborn.
10 9 8 7
6 4 FLASHLIGHTS APPEAR.
5 Sorry, you're locked in you can't change to Lightborn!
This is the problem I am talking about. If the survivors are worried about Lightborn or Franklin's, they will do this. So, that's my point, what is the point of even showing the killer what items the survivors are bringing if they can just swap at the very last second and everyone gets locked in?
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Yeah for me I feel it’s less about their items, and more that I know when they do that …they’re going to be toxic survivors. So I just mentally prep for it.
However, if a lobby loads up and there’s 3/4 toolboxes..I’m all set, gen rush someone else.
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Because they have eyeballs inside their head.
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Because items are essentially a temporary 5th perk slot. You bring a medkit and you have 2 free self cares as long as you use them strategically.
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Interesting thing to know...the loading tips will tell you what Killer your facing lol
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why not lock survivors from swapping then? the entire countdown system is pretty awful in general, and those types of changes should have been implimented when they stopped killers from being able to switch in lobby way back when. There isn't really any excuse to let survivors make such drastic changes so late during "prep time," especially since the killer equivalent was removed. Just make it so that items/characters cant be swapped once the timer reaches 30 seconds or something.
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If items are a “temporary 5th perk slot”, then what are add-ons for killer - which don’t expire until the match ends (outside of a few exceptions)?
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Only for the first three or so times you face them.
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Items can be gained mid match, traded between players, dropped in match, and arent even consumed unless left behind (or when certain addons use them.) Its a bit of a false equivalence to a consistently consumable part of a loadout that requires bloodweb grinding as the only method of replenishment. Thats before getting into comparitive impact, like being able to self heal (once or multiple times) compared to how absolutely unviable most addons actually are for a lot of killers (which of course shifts when comparing specific items vs specific addons.)
I get their point, that items are basically a temporary means of being able to surpass the limitations of playing without having them. Addons by comparison are more like "permanent" 5th perk slot that is both a forced consumable and wildly varying in quality/availability.
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I mean franklins will mess them up either way so I'd imagine most killers leave it on. Even if nobody in the lobby visibly has items on they'll probably pick up chest items or make flashbangs etc.
And as for lightborn if I'm clearly against a 4 stack I'll usually put it on as a precaution. But i haven't seen many people try this trick. and enpugh people run flashbang that it's just a good idea to keep it on anyway.
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The unbelievably annoying roar every chainsaw sprint is enough to never touch him again.
It's annoying as hell and a surefire signal for survivor saying "dodge NOW".
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Really I have faced over 20+ huntress and they keep showing the tips for her
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Survivors should be fully locked in at 15 seconds
Oh you were on the bloodweb? Too bad for you, if i can't level pig when queueing as ghostie then neither should survivors be able to level someone up other than the one that they intent to use
Better still, lock out the bloodweb when in the pregame lobby so that people actually ready up
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It is probably bugged then, reading what other players have to say about it on Reddit! Is it only Huntress you continue to see the tip for?
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Bad "what about" argument tbh. Sure some addons improve a killer majorly or in most cases... makes them actually playable like nemesis with marvins blood or twins with toy sword. And even then those addons which are considered the best don't change matches as drastically as lets say alch ring. But most addons for killers don't come close to the power of multiple medkits that have at least 2 self heals each.
Oh yeah and the points that Ryuhi made.
Either way just because 4 killers have completely game changing addons doesn't mean that killers shouldn't be able to see what items survivors are bringing.
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A few others like Doc, Oni, and Pyramid Head as well.
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Because not everyone are ######### like the survivors you described?
Seriously though, agree totally with the idea that survivors should get locked at about 15 seconds so the killer can react to last-minute shenanigans.
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why 15? Killers can't change in the lobby at all, only their perks and addons. If I'm playing hag and 4 flashlights appear im not scrambling to switchi in franklins and lightborne, im just straight up dodging the lobby if i can't switch to a killer who would actually have a power in that match. And even on the ones who would be fine in that case, you'd be forcing them to keep one of their 3 loadouts as a specific counter to said items. One for medkits and one for flashlights, now the entire point of saving louadouts becomes pointless since you only get one actual slot.
There's no reason for it not to be 30. that gives plenty of time to adjust items in lobby and you can spend forever getting set up before reaching the lobby in the first place. The only reactive part is to what other survivors are carrying as well.
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