So if it's SWF, just accept the loss?

And he's supposed to just assume they don't have DS or OTR? And as if you can't loop or something if you don't have an exhaustion perk. The biggest thing he wasn't allowed to do was slugging, because they all had No Mither. So what is he supposed to do for pressure?

Any other disproven talking points?

So just play an M1 killer and expect to win? Not happening.

This was not a genrush problem but more a SWF problem.

Nah, they would have to post 4 Survivors with dumb meme builds like 4 No Mithers with Circle of Healing, Self Care, and Botany Knowledge against a meta Nurse to = this Trapper one. Nurse in general will just slaughter most teams without any care about what they brought if the Nurse has any experience. Trapper is already on the weak side and that build wasn't helping in this case. Then they just happened to go against hyper sweat team on top of that.

Run a better build for starters. Agitation/Mad Grit/Franklins is a complete meme against a decent group. Trapper without Corrupt Intervention is a throw pick.

And if a killer is struggling to generate chase pressure against 4 Broken survivors without exhaustion perks, the problem isn't the survivor loadouts. Doesn't matter what map it is. Chases should be ending very quickly if the killer is playing well

4 toolboxes, 4 No Mithers, and gens probably go quickly early game. That should give a killer a very good idea about their builds and give them some information to act accordingly.

Except that such games as Nurse are no edge cases. Once you picked up Nurse you will win against the majority of Survivors you encounter and it is not that hard to learn her.

Even myself, who is not that good with her, win way more games than I lose as her. And I play without Slowdown and without Add Ons. If I would add in those I would probably win even more. As a complete average Nurse player.

You acutally made me laugh! Thx! I appreciate!

Well, kind of the problem here is a balance issue.

True, against a slow, methodological killer like trapper this is difficult to win against, although you could arguably have went on to chase them directly rather than playing a normal trapper game. Might have worked.

However, certain killers, such as nurse, blight, spirit, heck even wraith, could have slaughtered them since they Excell at getting in that first hit, so reducing repair efficiency, in this scenario could have easily led to a hopeless game for the survivors.

Naturally the solution would be to adjust killers to have a similar degree of viability against different situations by the application of variable game styles (also solo queue).

Also naturally, this is extremely difficult to do, to the point that I don't think anyone, anywhere even knows how to do it, certainly not me, so it's unlikely we ever get to see this. It's a deep seethed problem.

My advice? Accept that there simply is a degree of entropy to this game, that adds a level of unpredictability and varying potential to each side of every trial.

Sometimes you might get an easy game due to the nature of the killer and your build (4 medkit squad against my plague, lol) , sometimes you might receive a fair challenge and might or may not do well and sometimes you will face the absolute worst scenario with different factors stacked against you and its up to you to give up, get annoyed or try and embrace the challenge knowing that you will probably lose anyway.

And you know what? IMHO, this is not such a bad thing. I can understand the allure of a perfectly balanced game, every match a delicate balance of skill expression, but in its entropy, dead by daylight has gifted me with moments of ridiculous implausibility that are highly enjoyable and entertaining.

This is what keeps every trial off the realm of boredom and sameness for me. LOL didn't have this for me for this very same reason. You almost always could tell from minute 2 if you were going to win or lose on your lane. From minute 4 you knew the outcome of the game.

Was this fair? Very. Was it fun? For me, it wasn't. Win or lose I found no thrill. And in DBD, I do.

My 2 cents, take what you will. Or not.

Its always a tough balancing act. On one hand, doing gens is the premier survivor objective, but on the other hand so is killing off the survivors. The sweet spot for a fun game lies somewhere in the middle, where you chase the survivors around, hook everyone a couple of times, while they slowly whittle down the gens.

Most games sooner then later favor one of the two sides and sadly rarely keep thus balanced till the end. Thats why I think that a catchup mechanic would help a lot, ie buff the side with the worse ratio of hook states vs gens done. People always balk against such a catch up mechanic, stating things like "wow, so I get punished for playing well?" or "yeah cool, reward the other side for playing badly and not doing their job".

The 6.1 patch showed that buffing alone sadly won't keep killers from tunneling, but often tunneling is an expression of desperation when the game is slipping from the killers hands and they need to quickly delete a player in order to regain some semblance of control. The stick can't be always employed, sometimes you also need a carrot. Make spreading hooks and not tunneling worthwhile while also not letting the killer sabotage themselves by not tunneling a survivor.

In most games the first sacrifice happens at the 3 gens mark. If the survivors manage to do 3 gens while all four are still alive and kicking, I don`t know, make all gens break down until spare parts on the maps have been found (you could make this an alternative use for brand new parts, ie skip this search for one gen if you didnt`t use the parts up in order to slam a gen). And if a survivor gets sacrificed at 5 or 4 gens remaining make the one gen pop.

Last game with the Clown I had just such a match on Ormont. I was doing reasonable fast chases and by the time I downed my third survivor the third gen popped. I then tunneled the recently hooked survivor hard out of the game. That wasn't nice for sure, but what other option did I have? Patroling Ormont from one side to the other, keeping the last 5 gens save and sound while spreading hooks? Yeah, well... so I tunneled that poor Mikaela out as hard as I could and then focused on another survivor. This way I could barely turn the game around and it ended with a 3k and hatch escape at 1 gen with the last gen being at least 90% done, if not 95%. Without tunneling this would probably had ended in a 4E. I actually hate sweating it like that, because this will just lead to more sweaty matches in the future ... but on the other hand I don`t like getting stomped.

Barely anyone plays Nurse? If I get below 5 Nurse-games during one playing session, I am already wondering if I died often enough to be in Potato-MMR again. Nurse is the second-most Killer I go against after Wesker.

There's no guaranteeing kills in this game, absolutely not. Even still, just 1 or 2 max? It speaks to how OP SWF is.

Yeah, but 4 man SWF death squads are much rarer then people sometimes make them to be. Most SWFs are 2 man duos of just friends hanging out, doing gens, helping each other out and sometimes trying some meme build together. You get the occasional toxic duo, but this are rare. A lot of Twitch players are 3 man SWFs with one random or a full 4 man SWF, and while this are often good players and a fair amount of them play toxic for views, only a small percentage of them are really that what you would call a seal team.

The real 4 man SWF death squads aren't that high of an occurence, but I would still want to see after a match who was in a SWF with whom. I think that this would help with both: peeps hiding behind SWFs and claiming that they were all solos and just randomly together and seeing how many SWFs are actually in games that you as the killer totally dominated and stomped.

buff killers

make solo q even more atrocious

"Give SWF a gen debuff"

There is no way the game knows if a team is SWF

Queueing up together is not SWF

lol you're literally playing the worse killer in the game on the worse map for him in the game vs survivors who are bringing the most op items on their side in the game. If you bring weak stuff into the game you're gonna have to accept that you're gonna lose some matches that you simply have no power to stop.

This isn't a "muh genrushing problem" This situation can easily be flipped to the survivors POV if they killer brought the sweatiest build they can bring