Boons not balanced w/ Hex totems
Boons can constantly be rekindled/ Hex needs undying. I’m aware of the perk that breaks boons. I guess killers might want to keep totems for some reasons. Killers lose hex totem’s early and it’s tuff luck. Survivors just go back and relight it. Imagine if killers could do the same. I don’t want it , but this is obviously uneven. Survivors need a perk -rekindled to reuse it. We should only get one use a totem otherwise. When it’s snuffed that’s it. This is even. Killers need to run a second perk of 4 to reuse it only once.
‘As a survivor I appreciate the boons occasionally, but honestly they waste a ton of time. I get annoyed when there my teammates priority over helping everyone get out by doing gens instead.
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One use per totem unless there is another perk would feel really, really bad. The boons would be borderline useless (like most Survivor perks...) Would rather see the opposite where Killers can relight their Hexes.
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Boon should be one use. Then they will be equal. Sure relighting hex sounds great but that’s the risk reward with a very powerful perk. Boon heal, hide scratches, auras and unlimited Unbreakable that can be relight countless times. This is OP and should be happening.
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Hex is already active, provides stronger effect, is not blue (it can blend in), does not make such a distinct and loud sound, works on whole map, take quite some time to destroy
These are the advantages of hexes over boons. By these things hexes are balanced over boons. Lift those conditions (maybe not strength) and boons can be also 1-time usage
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It’s perfectly fine for Boons and Hexes to not work identically so long as the individual perks are balanced around that. And that’s already the case, most Boons aren’t even used more than average because their effects are ok but not top tier. The only Boon anybody ever actually complains about is Circle of Healing, it’s an exception among these perks in that its effect is top tier and that’s why it’s in the top four or five most used survivor perks.
Personally I don’t think Circle of Healing even needs a nerf at this point, it’s a solid perk but I’ve seen plenty of games where survivors actually lost the match because they spent so much time trying to keep that perk up they neglected the gens in the process. It a great perk but might not actually be an overpowered one. So even if it turned out to need a nerf still it would just be a small one and not a total overhaul. And the Boon system as a whole definitely doesn’t need a nerf, do you really think Dark Theory and Exponential and Shadowstep ought to be weaker?
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The rekindling seems unfair in comparison. That’s all. Every boon is powerful just not common to see
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survivors even get up to 5 useable totems plus infinite rekindling. White up to 4 players using them. This is a lot of power
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dark theory is useless. It would be useless even if it was map wide. It could work only if it stacked AND was map wide. The percentage is just too low to be usable ever - and that's why nobody ever plays this boon
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I don’t think Exponential and Dark Theory are all that effective honestly. I’m not saying they’re useless, sometimes they work, but I definitely wouldn’t call them “powerful”. 🤷♂️
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BHVR has came out and said that those are two different things.... I can't remember when or where they said it but they did
Hexes work from the beginning but Boons have to be lit
Hexes work until the Totem is cleansed or Blessed... Boons can be relit
It's also the same reason why Hexes aren't used all that much
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How is Unlimited and boosted revival and No scratch’s Not GOD tier?. These are practically game breaking, just not common
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They're not God tier because;
Exponential: You have to be within range of the boon while also the killer needs to slug you in said range. And if the killer sees the boon when they chase you or down you they can just remove it. This is incredibly niche and will very rarely get any use. For reference I've seen this boon used multiple times while playing and I've never seen someone get use out of it even though I don't shy away from slugging.
As for Dark Theory, no scratch marks isn't too powerful. You can hear survivors run and breathe, and if they're injured not only do they make grunts of pain, but they literally leave a blood trail that you can follow instead of the scratch marks, rendering this perk mostly useless.
The only strong boon is Circle of Healing. The rest of them need buffs.
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They’re situational and God within range
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Some perks can only be so good if they're that situational.
The two boons I mentioned, more so Exponential than Dark Theory, are great examples of that.
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Boons should not be compared to Hexes. Their only similarity is that they are shiny Totems, otherwise, they are different mechanics and it makes 0 sense to compare them.
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Dark theory is 2% speed boost. You got it wrong.
Shadow step (the one you actually talked about) can be good. It's just not awesome because - most killers hunt by seeing or hearing survivor, then by blood and only after these things fail they use scratchmarks. Because scratchmarks can be misleading (they randomly stop or continue in wrong direction for 1-2m etc). So you only get value if you can get distance and block line of sight. For these resons the perk is fine I guess, but totally not even close to meta.
Alternative usage is to hide auras for safer CoH (e.g. nurses calling). Otherwise the perk makes very little usage.
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TBH, I completely agree and I don't normally say the following (but for strong reasons, I think it applies) I think the people here complaining about Shadow Step (which is the one that hides scratch marks and auras) and Dark Theory (increases movement speed) kinda speaks to their level of skill. Shadow Step gets countered easily if a Survivor is injured and footsteps can still be heard easily. You need other perks to make this Boon work (like Bite the Bullet or Lucky Break). COH does not require other perks which is another reason why it's so good.
Dark Theory... Haste is barely anything unless it's a significant amount or if it makes you faster than the Killer when stacked. Dark Theory does none of these things without a dedicated build to it. You need to be stacking multiple Haste perks in order to get extra speed. And there isn't that many Haste perks that aren't super conditional (like Blood Pact and how a SWF is needed to take advantage of it).
Exponential requires builds or maps picked out to make work. It's not that good either.
I would like it if Boons could go on large cooldowns when snuffed (or given fair nerfs to increase the risk) or couldn't be stacked with other Boons. This way they could be buffed massively in order to compete with COH. As it is now, COH is the only boon worth using. The other 2 are garbage and Shadow Step requires an entire build.
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Boons are completely fine. The problem is not Shadowstep or Dark Theory. Survivors have to set up the boon to get an advantage in a limited area so the effects should be strong and also reusable. The only problematic boon is CoH. CoH is so much stronger than the rest that it needs to be treated different.
If CoH was just as strong as it was on the PTB but one use only with the totem disappearing after the killer snuffs it, I would be more or less fine with it. It would be an insanely strong perk but still a gamble, just like the good Hexes.
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1-time use CoH would make it about as strong as second wind. I mean still better then buckle up, but most of it's usage would come from perk rulet usage. Dead perk. Inefficient heal that can be lost even before 1st use
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That is the way it SHOULD be. A perk that is insanely strong but is also risky to use. That was exactly the way Boons were promoted in the first place. Shame they didn't design them that way. To compensate for that I also stated it should get buffed to it's PTB state. No one in their right mind can think that that was inefficient. You also have to consider that there is still less risk the boon gets snuffed before you get any value out of it than there is with Hexes. Its not 4 killers looking for your boons across the map but 1 that simultaneously has to chase and defend gens.
I can't see how CoH would be anywhere near Second Wind in terms of strength in this scenario. It would still be the strongest perk in the game (by a huge margin) but it would allow killers to deal with it. Right now there is no way of dealing with it other than running Shattered Hope every game. Its not a perfect solution because killers with low map mobility would still suffer immensely but I think its better than what we have now.
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In my opinion boons would be fine if there would be some kind of cooldown on particular totem, like after snuffing a boon, survivor is unable to make it boon again for 60 seconds or so. Relighting it after it was just snuffed is obnoxious.
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Sure but only if boons don't make any noise and work map wide as well as snuffing taking 10 seconds
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You clearly have no idea how inefficient it can be to place and use boons. Go play survivors and measure it yourself. I am 100% positive that if you make them 1-use, the perk is dead (same way as dark theory already is).
Just please do the experiment - play 10 survivor games and try to heal with boon the moment you can heal. Measure your time - but all of it. From the moment you need it until you are healthy - include running time/going to boon and include games where boons are impossible. Then tell us your average (so we can compare it to 3s running time + 42s self care time).
I am sure some of your heals will be way quicker. But as someone already pointed out - you will loose some games because you will want to get healed and you will not be in 2 whole minutes or longer.
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Just how DS was dead after they nerfed it from it's broken state when killers were forced to drop survivors every 2 feet? Or how Dead Hard is completely dead and no one uses it now?
Your argument reminds me of people trying to justify Nurse's strength because "She is hard to play". If you can't use a perk correctly, that's a skill issue. If it gets snuffed before you got any value out of it, you either got very unlucky, which can happen sometimes, or you have no clue how to use your resources.
If CoH was as inefficient as you make it out you wouldn't see so many people using it. So instead of trying to explain how bad the perk is maybe think about how to actually use it. Setting up CoH in the killers face or taking him anywhere near that area is the same as killers chasing you into their Hexes or hooking you next to them: A bad decision. Most killers have no chance to walk around the map looking for your boon without loosing 2 gens for it.
Lastly you forgot the most significant part of CoH. It is not an advantage that YOU, the person who set up the boon gets, it works on the entire team. That means you can heal yourself (stupidly fast with the PTB speed) and no other survivor needs to come for you and leave a gen, while they could all do the same for the cost of 1 perk slot and a bit of time to set it up. Combine the speed of CoH with medkits and the entire team can be healed in under 10 seconds. How is that for inefficiency? CoH allows you to heal with very little strings attached.
DBD is a game where decisions matter more than anything. Decisions like finish the gen and unhook or heal later or to leave that survivor and chase another. Wasting your time to run across the map for a heal should put you at a disadvantage, so what is your point with that last part? If you want to heal insanely fast anywhere, use a medkit.
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DS is dead. It does not do what it's meaned to do any more. It no longer disincentives killer to stop tunneling. Now everyone will eat DS even if they 100% know it's in play, because most likely it will prolong chase for 5 seconds (but sure - if you drop near god pallet and it's not nurse, the chase can possibly restart). Meaning every sweaty killer now tunnels, because there is exactly 0 reason not to do that.
And CoH is used so much only because swf (where 2 boons can save you 2 perks for everyone to be able to heal) and because self care got pop treatment. If they didn't touch SC, there would be way less boons in game. Old SC was 100% more efficient solo-wise. And that was fine, because everyone will bring their own way to heal and you can't just hope someone will boon for you.
And ofcourse nobody does totem to killer's face. But if you didn't notice, boons are pretty loud and quite good to see. Some totems are totally useless for boons, because you can see them from 60m distance. Others are semi-hidden, but next to a gen which means setting it up while the gen is not fixed is again waste. This makes looking for good totem that much longer.
About healing in 10 seconds. Sure. And canibal can down entire team also in 10 seconds. Also with autodidact it can be 6 seconds to full heal whole team (immediate double skillcheck on both survivors). Does that ever happen? Of course not. But it is possible. Same as medkit with CoH (who would waste their medkit for quicker heal in boon if it's not absolute emergency?)
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They would not. It doesn't make sense the unlimited use of boons. They should work like pentimento.
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How would it be useless? Compare CoH to Inner Healing.
IH: one heal per totem consumed
CoH: infinite heals for any survivor per totem, not consumed
Even if CoH used up the totem, you could still get multiple heals out of it.
Totems should beresources players have to manage? They should be expendable, which is why Shattered Hope should have been basekit from the start.
If that was the case, then you could revert the hex blessing time back to normal, and remove the killer notification that a totem has been blesed. Maybe just showing an icon once a boon is used. E.g. when the first survivor recovers a health state using CoH, the killer gets the 'blessing' debuff icon, like survivors get cursed. This would ensure the perk gets used before it's snuffed.
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But then again, a Survivor simple cannot defend their boon; while a Killer can defend their Hex. That is the one agreement I can make as to why I think Survivor should be allow to Boon as many time as you like... however... I do agree that Survivor needs a new requirement to Boon so that Survivor do not mindlessly Boon all the time. I am not sure how but I do think
1.) Boon shouldn't work on multiple floor and cover a huge area because of it. It should only cover one floor and not be a huge cylinder bubble.
2.) Boon that get snuff by the killer, should punished the Survivor will a cooldown; so that they need to wait it out in order to bless again. There need to be some reward for killer to snuffing, such as buying time by wasting Survivor time.
3.) Totems need to be hidden better, especially not next to Generators and not spawn next to Survivor; if possible. So that not only it convenient for both sides; but also gives Killer's hex perks a chance to still be active before it is cleansed.
4.) Blessing Hex Perks with Boon, should never destroy the Hex; instead it should disable it; so it incentives important decision making by the Survivors end.
"If I Boon this Totem, I will have my boons; but the killer can snuff it and bring the hex Totem back, or should I cleansed the Hex for good and ensure that the killer will never have it."
Plus, do not think alot of boons are a problem; it just CoH that gives Boons a bad name; it needs a proper nerf; especially when it different from every Boon perk. That difference is; Every Boon perk is most effective when the killer is close or in proximity of the Boon Radius, while CoH is powerful anywhere you place it, especially when it is far outside the Killer's patrol area, in a dead zone or complete gens which is a "terrible idea" for killer to chase and waste valuable time stuffing.
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Boons should take 30 seconds to light and CAN NOT!! Cover/undo a HEX.
IDK if this happens, but Hex’s should snuff any boons when activated
‘Here are 2 changes that could even them out more. The possibility of FREE heals for everyone all game long is crazy nowadays. Plus shadow step and the unbreakable one…Wow survivors still have it easy.
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So please know I say this as a killer main who is...pretty openly wrathful towards survivor players
1.) most hexes are game changing and VERY powerful. Devour hope, ruin, and haunted grounds and all solo carry if they don't break. Its risk reward. Often worth it, and even if they break thats time not spent on gens. until youre in HIGHEST mmr, totems aren't THAT weak, im sorry but they aren't. And even then i routinely have games where survivors never break totems and still get a 1-2 escape. They know to not break haunted grounds, they know to stay on the gen cuz of ruin, etc. Hell one game I had them unhooking in front of me/ flashbang and exhaustion perks to make the save and left devour up all game. Told me so in end game and I was actually impressed. Never saw using unsafe hook rescues to avoid devour/undying before but it kinda worked
2.) most of the boons are trash. Unless the survivors are stacking them they aren't that strong. circle of healing is pretty good ill admit, IF the survivors put it in a smart place. They usually don't. All the other boons are situational at best. The anti slug boon is countered by just not slugging and rarely seen. The scratch mark boon is so so. Depends on map and killer so even that not a big deal
3.) too many killer complain that the boon can be reset. Yes. Thats a good thing. It takes us killers ONE second to snuff it and the survivor then has to waste time finding a totem again, AND waste time setting the boon, AND you get a notification sound it was set. I memorized totem spawns back when I mained survivor and now just keep my eyes out as killer and can typically find the boon while patroling gens or chasing. Boons waste a LOT of survivors time.
4.) unless its a two story clusterfuck where you down someone and can't get them to a hook, and the anti slug boon is on a different floor, or they have CoH on the opposite side of the map from the gens, the boons are bad. Those are the only two situations where they feel op. And even then thats a LOT of thinking and coordination from the survivors that I think justifies it being op in THAT scenario
Generally speaking bud if they are healing a hundred times per match because of CoH you just need to step it up. I rarely see people heal with CoH because I hit them, then hit them again and hook them. They may get healed after the unhook but I got my hook. Often by then I've snuffed the boon and it has to be reset. Frankly if you can get hooks and keep snuffing the boon they will never get gens done and call the boon player a thrower.
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Just to say. I ranked to red 2 as killer and didn’t lose a match last season. I never play the camp tunnel 1 out style either.
I made to Red 1 a survivor last season as well.
I think you need to work harder for these sharing power perks. That’s all
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I see fellow survivors do nothing but self care and boon lighting getting more bp than me some games and they did NOTHING to help us get out by doing gens. Boon kinda bother me on the survivor side more than help my soloQ games. As a killer I snuff them ASAP.
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