What IF---Survivors Had Totems/Lanterns
So what if Survivors had those Lanterns from the Lunar event and they had a perk that was powerful and destroying the Lantern completely disabled their perk? The Survivor would not need to be hooked to destroy the lantern because we ALL SAW how imbalanbced that was, the Killer just finds it and breaks it like that, bam.
I'm just putting this out there because we Killers have breakable perks and Survivors get to keep all of their crutches with very few counters while Killers have powerful perks with 1 HUGE counter that completely nullifies it instead of weakening it. Just screw with the Survivor system and see them complain about the game being fair all of a sudden. This sounds serious but i'm saying it jokingly.
Comments
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No.6
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@brokedownpalace said:
No."lol" that's what I wanted
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It would be fair. But keep in mind that killers don't have to do it sneakily.2
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The problem is that killers can stop survivors from breaking totems generally. And survivors need to find those totems while being cautious. Killers don't need to and can't be stopped in the same way, so the perk would end up actually being extremely weak.
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@ClogWench said:
The problem is that killers can stop survivors from breaking totems generally. And survivors need to find those totems while being cautious. Killers don't need to and can't be stopped in the same way, so the perk would end up actually being extremely weak.That is true, it wouldn't be fair at all, Killers can stop Survivors from cleansing but Survivors can't stop Killers from doing the same. This was even stupider than I thought it was.
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It could be cool but maybe make it so there's a way to be able to destroy the thing. Such as having to get a hook and once they're unhooked you have like 30-60 seconds to break the thing0
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@HatCreature said:
So what if Survivors had those Lanterns from the Lunar event and they had a perk that was powerful and destroying the Lantern completely disabled their perk? The Survivor would not need to be hooked to destroy the lantern because we ALL SAW how imbalanbced that was, the Killer just finds it and breaks it like that, bam.I'm just putting this out there because we Killers have breakable perks and Survivors get to keep all of their crutches with very few counters while Killers have powerful perks with 1 HUGE counter that completely nullifies it instead of weakening it. Just screw with the Survivor system and see them complain about the game being fair all of a sudden. This sounds serious but i'm saying it jokingly.
Nah destroyable perks? Not on the survivor side....
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There's a couple pretty big differences between survivors searching the map for a totem and a killer searching the map for a lantern. If a survivor needs to cleanse a totem, only a quarter of the team stops progressing on the main objective (generators). If a killer needs to search for a lantern, the killer needs to divert their entire attention to search for it. They basically need to stop killing just to go look for it. While the survivors need to avoid the killer while finding a totem, killers are free to roam the map. While a killer can protect a totem, survivors cannot, the killer could easily down them if they tried to block it.
With the asymmetrical nature of the game, I don't think 'hex' perks would translate well to 'lantern' perks. Killers do not have time to spare, they are constantly on the clock. Survivors have the luxury of slowing things down and remaining undetected while searching for a totem, but a killer does not. If the killer stops to look for it, that greatly reduces the amount of time they have to do their objective and gives the survivors more time to do generators.1 -
Peanits said:There's a couple pretty big differences between survivors searching the map for a totem and a killer searching the map for a lantern. If a survivor needs to cleanse a totem, only a quarter of the team stops progressing on the main objective (generators). If a killer needs to search for a lantern, the killer needs to divert their entire attention to search for it. They basically need to stop killing just to go look for it. While the survivors need to avoid the killer while finding a totem, killers are free to roam the map. While a killer can protect a totem, survivors cannot, the killer could easily down them if they tried to block it.
With the asymmetrical nature of the game, I don't think 'hex' perks would translate well to 'lantern' perks. Killers do not have time to spare, they are constantly on the clock. Survivors have the luxury of slowing things down and remaining undetected while searching for a totem, but a killer does not. If the killer stops to look for it, that greatly reduces the amount of time they have to do their objective and gives the survivors more time to do generators.
Should not be the clock reversed?
Why is the killer on a clock and not the survivors? This would put more pressure on the survivors, what directly would increase their horror and terror.
By limiting the survivors time you would directly determent how long a match can go until it's over.
All of a sudden it's not just all about genrushing, but also, who is gonna distracting the killer and maybe we need to sacrifice someone for the survival of the team.
It would shift the tone of the game more in a dark and grim environment.
What are your thoughts on this?0 -
@Peanits said:
There's a couple pretty big differences between survivors searching the map for a totem and a killer searching the map for a lantern. If a survivor needs to cleanse a totem, only a quarter of the team stops progressing on the main objective (generators). If a killer needs to search for a lantern, the killer needs to divert their entire attention to search for it. They basically need to stop killing just to go look for it. While the survivors need to avoid the killer while finding a totem, killers are free to roam the map. While a killer can protect a totem, survivors cannot, the killer could easily down them if they tried to block it.With the asymmetrical nature of the game, I don't think 'hex' perks would translate well to 'lantern' perks. Killers do not have time to spare, they are constantly on the clock. Survivors have the luxury of slowing things down and remaining undetected while searching for a totem, but a killer does not. If the killer stops to look for it, that greatly reduces the amount of time they have to do their objective and gives the survivors more time to do generators.
Thanks for this, I thought of this on the fly and didn't really think about it too hard but the more you look at it it's really broken and unfair. I've just always hated that Survivors can completely disable Killer abilities while Killers can't do anything like that for Survivors, Killers can slow the game but that's different, I don't want to disable Survivor abilities I just don't want Killer abilities to be completely nullified and be 1 perk down.
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@Cymer said:
Peanits said:There's a couple pretty big differences between survivors searching the map for a totem and a killer searching the map for a lantern. If a survivor needs to cleanse a totem, only a quarter of the team stops progressing on the main objective (generators). If a killer needs to search for a lantern, the killer needs to divert their entire attention to search for it. They basically need to stop killing just to go look for it. While the survivors need to avoid the killer while finding a totem, killers are free to roam the map. While a killer can protect a totem, survivors cannot, the killer could easily down them if they tried to block it.
With the asymmetrical nature of the game, I don't think 'hex' perks would translate well to 'lantern' perks. Killers do not have time to spare, they are constantly on the clock. Survivors have the luxury of slowing things down and remaining undetected while searching for a totem, but a killer does not. If the killer stops to look for it, that greatly reduces the amount of time they have to do their objective and gives the survivors more time to do generators.
Should not be the clock reversed?
Why is the killer on a clock and not the survivors? This would put more pressure on the survivors, what directly would increase their horror and terror.
By limiting the survivors time you would directly determent how long a match can go until it's over.
All of a sudden it's not just all about genrushing, but also, who is gonna distracting the killer and maybe we need to sacrifice someone for the survival of the team.
It would shift the tone of the game more in a dark and grim environment.
What are your thoughts on this?The game SHOULD be like this, but the problem is that a lot of things about the game would have to changed. I'm all for that and the only way to do it is to introduce it slowly, mostly because it takes a while to get those changes made and done correctly. But then again, those changes could be too big for this game. @AlwaysInAGoodShape has his ultimate fix for the game and I'd link you to the thread but forgot what it was called. All of his ideas would totally fix the game and I really beleive he/she should get into game design.
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They should add 4 special hooks per game. When a survivor is hooked on one they lose a random perk. Special hooks can only disable one perk then act as normal hooks. Sabotaging one of these hooks doesnt break it the first time, but disables the ability to remove a perk.
Only one perk may be removed from a survivor per game. What perk is removed is entirely up to RNG.1 -
@KingB said:
They should add 4 special hooks per game. When a survivor is hooked on one they lose a random perk. Special hooks can only disable one perk then act as normal hooks. Sabotaging one of these hooks doesnt break it the first time, but disables the ability to remove a perk.Only one perk may be removed from a survivor per game. What perk is removed is entirely up to RNG.
That sounds interesting, the Killer would need to hussle to those specific hooks which allow body blocking. The hook can be saboed, it's only 1 perk per Survivor, that's cool, a lot more balanced than I was saying. There's a lot of oppurtunities for these ''special hooks'' that keep being brought up in the forums, I hope the Devs take advantage of this system they created.
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@Cymer said:
Peanits said:There's a couple pretty big differences between survivors searching the map for a totem and a killer searching the map for a lantern. If a survivor needs to cleanse a totem, only a quarter of the team stops progressing on the main objective (generators). If a killer needs to search for a lantern, the killer needs to divert their entire attention to search for it. They basically need to stop killing just to go look for it. While the survivors need to avoid the killer while finding a totem, killers are free to roam the map. While a killer can protect a totem, survivors cannot, the killer could easily down them if they tried to block it.
With the asymmetrical nature of the game, I don't think 'hex' perks would translate well to 'lantern' perks. Killers do not have time to spare, they are constantly on the clock. Survivors have the luxury of slowing things down and remaining undetected while searching for a totem, but a killer does not. If the killer stops to look for it, that greatly reduces the amount of time they have to do their objective and gives the survivors more time to do generators.
Should not be the clock reversed?
Why is the killer on a clock and not the survivors? This would put more pressure on the survivors, what directly would increase their horror and terror.
By limiting the survivors time you would directly determent how long a match can go until it's over.
All of a sudden it's not just all about genrushing, but also, who is gonna distracting the killer and maybe we need to sacrifice someone for the survival of the team.
It would shift the tone of the game more in a dark and grim environment.
What are your thoughts on this?It's tricky because it's not necessarily by design. The killer is not on a timer because the game said so, the killer is on a timer because there are four survivors doing their objective and your time runs out as soon as they finish it. The killer's job is to stop the survivors from doing their objective, but the survivor's job isn't necessarily to stop the killer from doing their objective (though it would be beneficial to them to unhook and heal each other, which would be stopping the killer, it's not necessary to escape). I don't really think there's a way to invert that without completely changing the game. The second the killer is trying to do a goal while the survivors try to stop them the killer is no longer a killer, the killer becomes the survivor.
If we're talking about a hard time limit, though, I wouldn't want to see that. I could easily play doctor or hag and guard the three closest generators for ~20 minutes or so.
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@Peanits said:
If we're talking about a hard time limit, though, I wouldn't want to see that. I could easily play doctor or hag and guard the three closest generators for ~20 minutes or so.
I was thinking more about Billy/Nurse/Spirit and doing nothing but flying around the map scaring survivors off gens and also doing a 3 gen strat. You'd give them the outer gens but if 3 were close together it's gg and if they're close together and then you run NOED well lulz.
Throw in Ruin, perhaps Thanatobia, and say UP and even a Clown just sitting there throwing bottles on a 3 gen will cause issues.
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Peanits said:
If we're talking about a hard time limit, though, I wouldn't want to see that. I could easily play doctor or hag and guard the three closest generators for ~20 minutes or so.
I myself love the Hag and play frequently Doctor to farm points. I have become pretty good at controlling the map, that I can consistently pull of the 3 gen strat, but then the game ends in a stalemate.
The survivors refuse to do the last gen and I would only lose to leave the gens.
In the end the survivors either DC or hide so long until I found one and slug the player only to play hide and seek until he bleeds out. Then the game evolves into a run for the hatch. If the survivor is lucky he get the free escape if I get lucky we have the hatch standoff. Similar to the 3 gens, if I leave now, I risk to lose the game.0 -
I like you idea... but I think it should be a bit different. This idea could actually help with a few other issues the game has. One in particular, the grind.
With your idea, what if...
Remove all the tiers in perks, remove all tier 2 abilities. Make all perks for survivor tier one only. Then each perk has a tier 2, (the old tier 3), which can only be activate when carrying a lantern. (obviously some perks might need to be adjusted a bit to make this work, but you get the idea.)
Now the grind is only for 1 perk per level, and not having to grind out to three tiers of each perk.
Keep the default of only 2 lanterns per match, unless offerings are put out on either side to remove or add one more lantern.
Then for a survivor to "soup" up their perks, they need to get and carry a lantern in the match. Which shows the killer they are souping up their perks and makes them a target. When hooking that survivor, the lantern returns to its stand. The killer has the option to go and destroy it... Or not.
The killer doesn't have to destroy the lantern, cause the effect is the survivors can only bring up their perks to the highest level of the perk. Which is no different then that survivor taking all tier 3 perks now.
Add in a point bonus for the survivor carrying the lantern.
Add in a point bonus for the killer destroying the lantern.Now for killers what do you do?... How do they get some bonus on their perks?... They don't need one, just make the perks only one tier and either use the tier 3 version or tier 2 version.
That way there is a secondary objective for both sides... More so for survivors to waste time looking for lanterns. Also it removes the grind in the game... or at least lowers it enough to make it easier for new people to get in.
Post edited by TheBean on1 -
One word
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@TheBean said:
I like you idea... but I think it should be a bit different. This idea could actually help with a few other issues the game has. One in particular, the grind.With your idea, what if...
Remove all the tiers in perks, remove all tier 2 abilities. Make all perks for survivor tier one only. Then each perk has a tier 2, (the old tier 3), which can only be activate when carrying a lantern. (obviously some perks might need to be adjusted a bit to make this work, but you get the idea.)
Now the grind is only for 1 perk per level, and not having to grind out to three tiers of each perk.
Keep the default of only 2 lanterns per match, unless offerings are put out on either side to remove or add one more lantern.
Then for a survivor to "soup" up their perks, they need to get and carry a lantern in the match. Which shows the killer they are souping up their perks and makes them a target. When hooking that survivor, the lantern returns to its stand. The killer has the option to go and destroy it... Or not.
The killer doesn't have to destroy the lantern, cause the effect is the survivors can only bring up their perks to the highest level of the perk. Which is no different then that survivor taking all tier 3 perks now.
Add in a point bonus for the survivor carrying the lantern.
Add in a point bonus for the killer destroying the lantern.Now for killers what do you do?... How do they get some bonus on their perks?... They don't need one, just make the perks only one tier and either use the tier 3 version or tier 2 version.
That way there is a secondary objective for both sides... More so for survivors to waste time looking for lanterns. Also it removes the grind in the game... or at least lowers it enough to make it easier for new people to get in.
Interesting, it's a boost but a necessary boost, that's prett cool.
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