General Discussions
General Discussions
Any updates on the fix for slugging for a 4k?
Just wondered if there is any news about this, not really fun just laying here .. ( yes I know about unbreakable, it only works once)
Comments
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Why does this need a fix?
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because it's boring sitting on the ground for 4 minutes? It's incredibly obnoxious because you've already won the game if you're in a position to slug for the 4K. At least let the slugged person give up after they've been slugged for a certain amount of time. The obsession with the 4K is weird and wastes everyone's time.
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So if you have three people near the open exit gates and one dude across the map hooked, you always just leave right?
You never go back for that person for the 4 man out?
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I'm sorry I don't understand? Even in your scenario both the killer and survivor are contributing. Killer fighting of the 3 and survivors getting the hook. In a slug for 4k I'm just laying there, or at best slowly crawling in a direction I can't effect the game at all so it's boring .
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A Killer slugs because he doesn't want a 3 kill. He wants a 4 kill. So he wants to finish the game by going back.
A SWF goes back because he doesn't want a 3 escape. He wants a 4 escape. He wants to finish the game by going back.
Why is it okay for Survivors to not take the full win but bad when Killers do it?
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Probably because there's still a game to be played in one example.
For the Survivor who is slugged, they have zero agency. They can't do anything, they're stuck unless someone picks them up.
When Survivors go back for the 4-man out, everybody gets to participate. The Killer has an opportunity to get more than a 1K and the Survivors have the opportunity to get a 4 man out. Everybody has agency and the ability to affect the outcome of the match.
It's not that they aren't allowed to try for the 4K, it's just that it's dreadfully boring for the poor ######### slugged on the ground and clearly, BHVR agrees in some sense.
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This is why hatch should be changed so it incentivizes survivors to repair and killer to kill the third ASAP.
- Keys no longer open hatch
- Hatch now can only be opened by someone who fulfills the proper conditions (detailed below)
- Hatch can now spawn at 2 survivors left, but only appears on the map after at least 1 of them fulfills said conditions
- Hatch spawns closed
- Hatch only works for the first person of the 2 to use it. Will vanish after someone uses it. Starts modified EGC after someone uses it
- Endgame Collapse is changed. Gens will stay reparable, and Exit Gates will not be powered unless the last survivor fulfilled the proper conditions OR all 5 generators have been repaired
"Proper conditions": Once 2 survivors are left, each survivor has a personal goal to obtain 90 seconds (number subject to change) of repairing, healing, or chase. Unhooks count as +20 (number subject to change) sounds towards that 90 seconds. Doing said 90 seconds counts as fulfilling the proper conditions.
This means for survivors, hiding and doing nothing hoping for hatch/Exit Gate means you LITERALLY can't use either of them to escape. This also means for killers, they want to kill the third ASAP, since one of those 2 will now be able to escape at 2 survivors left if they get those 90s and find where hatch spawned. And if killer found and killed both before either could get those 90s, then it means killer did better than both of the remaining two. So certain death at that point.
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"It's not fun for the other side" cannot be a game design argument.
It sucks because you are losing. Very few games are fun to lose.
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No, it sucks because I literally can't do anything. And it already is used for game design, that's pretty much why locker saves were removed. Were they strong? No. Was that team gonna win? Probably not. But it wasn't fun to face so it got removed.
I am literally better off going to make a sandwich while waiting to bleed out
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Ask the devs to get rid of hatch. This would solve your issue over night.
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Nope nope they want their middle ground, hatch and no slugging to work around it.
Listen, I realize the basekit Unbreakable/Mori changes from that PTB won't likely go live in that form, but some kind of it is coming.
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no mither? if you really just hate being bored, thats how you stop it
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Locker saves were removed because they were literally uncounterable if you didn't have Lightborn.
As for the ground, you are not supposed to be able to do anything. You are in the DYING state.
You think you should be allowed to loop and do gens while in the DYING state?
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I don't really think either of us are going to find a resolution here.
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Slugging for 4k is a way to bypass a game mechanic (the hatch) by forcefully extending an unwinnable situation for the last survivor and essentially playing hide and seek with them for 4 minutes in the hopes of securing a meaningless 4k. It's pathetic, and boring to play against.
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This is a direct response to not wanting to give a survivor the chance for a free escape. Hatch needs to go if you don’t want this to happen.
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Yeah cause you're being reasonable against a terribly bad take. Why do you bother when the first thing someone comes up with as counterexample is "the others at the exit gates don't leave to save the last survivor" lmao
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Well, what kind of dynamic gameplay do you think DYING survivors are entitled to? Or would you rather they just die instantly? I'm trying to see here what you think SHOULD happen.
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Lots of mechanics exist to by pass another mechanic. That's not a pejorative.
And being boring to play against indicates you get to tell other people how the can play.
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I would rather there be a more interesting way to wind the game down.
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I'd advise bringing Boon Exponential if you have it. Not perfect but probably your best bet if you're being left slugged for extended periods of time often
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And yet again no one cares that the 4th survivor is hiding instead of helping the slug. More specifically the last survivor is explicitley waiting for the slug to die so the hatch spawns. Funnily most often the 3rd and 4th survivors both would do this regardless who gets found first.
Afterall they stopped trying to do remaining gens once 2 die.
As for the "killer delays hatch gamestate" argument? 99'ing gates does this too and isnt being considered "bad", hypocrites.
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Removing the Hatch would solve this instantly.
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Bad argument.
I dont mind losing. But I mind lying around for 4 minutes, because the Killer really needs to push their ego for a 4K, when they won anyway. A 3K with potential Hatch Escape is still a win. (Especially since the Killer has the advantage in finding the Hatch)
So when I am losing, I dont mind, but I would like to move on and go into the next game.
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And generate it's own host of problems, not least turning every 3K into an automatic 4K because the final survivor hasn't a hope in hell of repairing generators by themself.
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"It's not fun for the other side" cannot be a game design argument.
It absolutely can, and I hate this misconception.
Most people believe it because most of the egregious examples that prove that this is a valid design argument never see the light of day, or get trimmed relatively quickly. But you can absolutely create something utterly balanced, and yet necessitate its removal because it's just damn unhealthy for the game.
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This just an argument of impatience. It's 4 minutes, assuming you never spent any time whatsoever on the ground at all the entire game AND the killer takes that long to hook the last survivor.
VERY few people slugged for the 4K reach the full four minutes.
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Misconception?
The misconception here is that people think it should be fun to be lying on the ground. I'm sorry you guys can't play Twister while on the floor.
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Why did dead hard need a fix?
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Honestly, just here to say there is no point trying to have a reasonable conversation with WesCravenFan. I’ve learned there is no point and it is a waste of time. Life is too short.
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Dude ######### adding sex to DBD, add a Twister slug mini-game
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My God, do not give them ideas. This is a pathway to shirtless Myers that cannot be undone.
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Because it had an over 86% pick rate during its peak.
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What is unreasonable is thinking being on the floor because you lost somehow needs to be entertaining. It's like listening to someone complain that there's no fun factor in being shot in the head during a first person shooter.
For a wait time that is realistically two minutes.
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I wish I could chat to my last teammate that just leave me on the ground for 4min and wait for hatch, so I can just tab out and draw.
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I would say there is no "Your fun is not my responsibility"
Nowaday, its "My responsibility to make you miserable"
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Solution is simple: Basekit Unbreakable is only active after all gens are done. On top of that they should finally get rid of hatch.
Because sometimes killers need some slugging pressure during the game. Take that away and they'll tend to camp and tunnel even more.
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That is not at least most boring thing in the game is it? Sometimes it can be most fun part of match. It can all play to killer's hand if survivors mess up the save. Smart thing for survivors would be just leave if the survivor is hooked other side of the map. I would compare it to hatch race rather killer trying to get that last kill but it's not quaranteed just like that 4 escape is not.
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Still I don't understand the logic, getting shot in the head in a fps means I'm dead and can go about my business. Being slugged means I can't do anything, can I at least get a suicide button or something?
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Still don't understand the logic, getting shot in the head in a fps means I'm dead and can go about my business. Getting slugged means I'm laying g the ground not doing anything. It would be like a 4 minutes of camera stuck on your dead body before you were allowed to respawn or find a new game.. that's would be boring as hell .
Can I at least get a suicide button ?
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It's a difficult thing to fix. No one likes 'slugging for the 4k' because as mentioned here it's incredibly boring for the slug, and it's usually already a lost game for the survivors in general. How often does the 4th survivor pick up the slug, they repair the gens and escape? Virtually never I'd assume.
BHVR is clearly trying to think of ways to fix this issue but it's a difficult issue to fix. The most obvious fix, basekit UB had it's own glaring issues and so it's unlikely that'll be added or it'll have to be changed considerably to iron out the exploits with it.
Plus, sometimes there are valid reasons to slug for the 4k. There are a few archives that require the killer get a 4k, the upcoming killer adept changes mean it'll require a 4k, and if the killer wants to maximise their chance to pip/double pip, they'll need a 4k. It's not always the killer just needlessly being sweaty or ruining the survivors day, it's only mostly that 😏
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let's remove the hooks, because while the survivor on the hook, he cannot move and repair generators,
camping is not allowed, tunneling is not allowed, just knocking down a survivor is also not allowed, I have a question, where are these rules in relation to the surv?
where the rule is that if all 4 escape 1 survivor must kill himself, survivors cannot make 5 generators at 100% they must make 8 generators at 90% etc
I'm waiting for the topic that the killer should not kill the survivors
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You do realize the Hatch is there so the game can't be held hostage by either the Killer and Last Survivor right....
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Have you seriously never played an FPS where once you die you get to do nothing more than spectate and wait for your teammates to finish?
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Because it NEEDED to be fixed. The main issue as the Devs have said DH for distance to extend the chase was not the intended use for it and they saw a problem with it.
Now the issue we have are hackers with their Auto DH but besides that it's now more "skill based"
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Which would then result in the corresponding killer nerfs.
Killers slug, because they fear the last survivor escapes through the hatch and writes "gg ez". Removing the hatch would completely solve this. Not only that, it would also help with endgame toxicity. Since a lot of survivors prefer to hide and wait for their teammates to get caught first/run the killer to their teammates.
I don´t see the problem here. Only a solution to a lot of issues.
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You want to nerf killers to the point that a 1v1 scenario with multiple generators to complete would be even odds?
Do you understand what that would mean?
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It was 20% pick at low mmr, 40% pick at mid-mmr, and 75% pick at high mmr (BHVRs stats)
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Oh i definetly understand what that would mean. A completely new branch of endgame perks that could help, the less survivors are around. Killers would be incentivized to not applying pressure by tunneling someone out as soon as possible. Because that could mean that the rest of the survivors become stronger. Suiciding survivors wouldn´t be a death sentence for the rest of the team.
I only see benefits on removing it.
Hatch is a outdated mechanic and it still creates toxicity on both sides. Something that could be avoided by removing it.
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The best improvement to my forums experience is the ignore feature.
If anyone is unaware, you can go to your own 'edit profile' and manually add users to an ignore list to never see their messages on here. Doing it through your own profile works even if they have set theirs to 'private'.
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