Devs - why should I pay for a game I am denied to play?
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It’s both. I still Think Facecamping and tunneling should be less beneficial for the killer to do. I still Think it ruins the game. You are all saying that facecamping is not preventing the hooked survivor from playing the game, but none of you Can come up with actual counterplay or options for the person hooked the entire match.
Tunneling is not too bad if you are in a SWF but waay too strong when dealing with solo survivors because they are never guaranteed a helping hand from their teammates, often quite the opposite. Being unhooked right in front of the killer, gives you what options to survive? DS 3 second stun or a DH easy to wait out? People sandbagging, noone willing to take a hit ect. There is only so much you can do when you are on your own. If solo survivor is gonna survive, it needs to be balanced more and I Think this is a Way to do it. People need to feel that they can protect themselves and right now there are no perks strong enough to balance solo.
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Actually there is really easy counter to face camping, don't get found and don't get hooked.
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If everyone was just hiding in a locker until someone Else Got found, nothing would ever get done. It’s not really a counter. Against a strong killer who knows what they are doing, everyone Will go Down at Some point. It’s enevitable. Especially against killers like nurse, Huntress and Blight. And it still doesn’t solve the issue with Solo… cause facecamped solo survivors have absolutely no reason to stay in the match… most of Them Will either try to Kobe or DC and the remaining survivors are doomed.
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I would suggest practicing and strengthening your stealth play. This seems to be where your struggling; you did specifically point out that your not even avoiding the killer long enough to touch an objective. Survive long enough to not be the first and you will have solved quite a few of those problems.
And yes we are all a hostage once the killer puts us on hook. Its the final result after the culmination of several events. This means a survivor failed to avoid detection, failed to escape the chase, and now must wait for teammates to provide an additional chance at risk of the rescuer.
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Just out of curiosity do survivors feel that playing video games like fighting games or Batlle royales also are "not playing the game"? Bad players in fighting games can get basically killed in two hits by a great player, and never get an offensive attack off. Battle royales, well...SOMEONE has to be the first guy killed. He didn't get to play. Clearly fortnite needs protection so I cannot die early on! Also, you did play. If you got hooked then you played, because a chase started. If you went down so fast you feel you "didn't get to play" then that is genuinely just you not being good and wanting training wheels to ensure you continue playing regardless of skill. Otherwise, you looped the killer and ran from them, which is gameplay. It's no one elses fault if you went down in 2 seconds because you tried to hide against Doc or something
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My first killer today was camping and tunnelling, so I get it. You sit down in the evening to play a game and that first one kind of sets your mood. My second game though was a 2 hook Nurse (basically a killer confident enough not to tunnel or camp, who will 2 hook everyone before the sacrificing starts) so you kind of just take the good with the bad. One of the players was even afk for the first part of the game, and the nurse left them alone when she realised, only going after them once they came back. As with any online game, it's a mixed bag of who you get matched with. You'll definitely have better outcomes in a swf.
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play killer then so you won't have those troubles
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You don't have to be in locker to stay hidden, just don't be first.
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NO ONE said FACECAMPING isn't preventing you from playing, they said TUNNELING isn't.
Don't twist the truth for your agenda.
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I think you underestimate how many people play this game. I think if even the entire forum tried to skew the stats it would barely make a dent in the kill rates
Let alone one person
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Try perks such as decisive, Off the record and Adrenaline.
If it doesnt work, just git gud
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Why don't you play killer and find out?
Not condoning camping at 5 gens, but you might understand why less experienced killers do this.
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None of the perks you are mentioning are helping specifically against camping or tunneling? Besides from DS, which is useless now with only a 3 second stun.
I give up on this Forum. I came on here to adress a serious balance issue with Solo versus SWF and to tell my side of why I and many others choose switch to killer or find a SWF group instead of staying in solo. Nowhere do I ask for killers to be nerfed or for killer perks to be removed, and yet I keep getting attacked for my post. People are only looking for “things not adding up” in my post, questioning my rank, my skills ect when even really experienced and skilled DBD streamers are giving up on Solo and play more SWF and survive with viewers. But apparently it’s just me.. None of you are actually able to come up with anything besides from “Git Gud”, “don’t get caught first or “live with it”, which doesn’t really fix anything in the Long run. I kind of understand the State the game is in, considering How toxic and indifferent it’s community is. Everytime someone on the Forum tries to speak up about an issue, this is what they are met with.
Post edited by Rizzo on1 -
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A lot of Them say that neither are preventing me from playing the game? I am not twisting anything, read the comments, lmao.
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I do. But my entire post was an attempt to save solo survivor. If we all just play killer or go SWF it won’t fix the issue, just make it worse
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The problem is that the state the game is in right now, it’s more bad than good games and it has been for a while now. Like I Said in my original post, I don’t know how bad it is on the American servers, but the EU servers are really bad with almost every other game being a tunneler or a camper. Solo is just not strong enough to counter it, as survivors playing alone don’t have strong enough perks to protect themselves. If you find yourself with unexperienced or farming/sandbagging teammates, you lack options to keep yourself safe and alive longer. Solo lack options of Security that every SWF team has.
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Well, i feel the same, because i just played several killer games full of flashlights and sabo-squads, where i could down people, but never hook them. Do you consider that to be toxic and being prevented from playing the game, too? Because i do.
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You Cannot compare the two things. Because in games like that you are equally strong. You are both armed, you both have the same chance of being the first person to shoot. In DBD SWF and killers are more or less equally strong, and then you have solo which is a whole different league. You never know what kind of teammates you get. If you have a teammate unhooking you with the killer right next to you, what Can you do? Can you refuse to be unhooked? No… Can you get anywhere if the killer chooses to tunnel and there are no loops nearby? No.. you don’t even have the option to bring in perks to prevent any of the above from happening. If you buy a shooting game, you know the gameplay is just to nuke the other People as fast as possible. There are no objectives other than that. Survivors actually need to do quite a lot to get a decent amount of BP and solo is just nowhere near worth playing compared to killer or SWF.
If you go play SWF, you get to do gens, loop, unhook, heal, set boons ect. You Can have a Long match cause you know your teammates are gonna be somewhat decent and help you out when needed. What does solo have to offer in compare? Honestly? Why would anyone group up with a team of randoms who Will most likely be dead within minutes, or try to get you killed to save their own arse. Can you honestly mention just one decent antitunneling or anticamping perk that would be useful for a person to protect themselves in solo?
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The Killer is supposed to be a threat and through gameplay mistakes the Killer can absolutely destroy you alone.
You are playing the game when you get tunneled and destroyed, You are experiencing what happens in a Horror movie.
Losing in a Video Game is not, Not playing it.
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You still Got options don’t you? In the lobby you see what items the survivors bring in and Can make a plan accordingly. Lots or flashlights -lightborn. Lots of toolboxes - gen perks. You have the option to make a plan before you even go into the game.
You decide which survivors you want to chase, for How Long. Are you going to put pressure on gens, are you going to make a 3-gen strategy… even in the shittiest games, you still get a decent amount of BP for chases, kicking gens, slugging ect.. even with no kills
If you are facecamped you have absolutely zero actual options. You are wasting an entire match doing nothing, because the killer chose this “strategy” and you Can either DC and get zero points, try to kobe (most likely die) and get zero points or stay on the hook and buy your teammates time (still die) and get a ridiculous amount of BP for your trouble. Same with tunneling. If your teammates are sandbagging you, unhooking you in front of the killer ect you don’t have any perks to actually counter it. Killers have the option of countering everything the survivors bring into the game, and even have perks to stalling the end-game. Survivors doesn’t have ######### to counter tunneling or facecamping… absolutely nothing after DS Got nerfed to the Ground
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The game is supposed to be pretty balanced. It’s not a killer should win almost every match kind of game. There should still be a 40-50 % chance of you at least making it to the end-game, but Solo is nowhere near that balance. If survivors should just accept not doing ######### the entire match and be eliminated within minutes, you might as well play against bots and remove the survivor option.
Survivors also play to have fun and earn BP, but as it is right Now, solo doesn’t provide options to make it worth it compared to what SWF can do. You can only stay alive for so long If you get farmed off the hook, sandbagged or if your team throws the game after a minute.
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SoloQ is extremely weak, so I understand that you don't like to play it, it's the simple truth you have no control over SoloQ games as survivor.
So yeah if you are solo, then you should play killer, 99% of streamers only playing killer, or do SWF only with friends or viewers. Even players like Ayrun who have 30k+ hours on survivor, rarely playing SoloQ anymore, it's mostly killer or SWF.
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I only play solo so i totally get it. I'm in Australia so I *think* I play on an Asian server, and it's honestly not too bad. If it got any worse I'd probably just move on. People will come up with all sorts of reasons for why they play the way they do, and it's usually to do with gen rushing (which I don't do), or Dead Hard (which I've never used), or gen progression perks (which I don't use), or survivor meta builds (which I don't use). So often times players like us are just suffering for the "sins" of others I guess.
I think when people say the best thing to do is not play anymore, they dont necessarily mean it in a bad way. I have an escape rate of about 30%. If it ever dropped to below 20% I would probably stop playing. I don't mind dying - I'm very altruistic and 5k bloodpoints mean less to me than my team getting out. But it's a nice dopamine hit when a good escape happens. When you stop feeling good while playing a game, there's probably no point in playing. And unfortunately, you can't pick who you get matched with. That's out of all of our control.
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Statistically, it is about a 60% kill rate. Which is the devs' goal, apparently. So, once we factor in all the suicides on first hook, it's not that far off.
Again, either you in particular are doing something if your games actually do always have you out first, or you're over-emphasising the ones where it does happen.
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The game is designed to have killers at a about 50 to 65% Kill rate of 4 Survivors.
So others may live, but the weakest Survivors usually dont.
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I find it hilarious how angry survivors get at killers who camp and tunnel. When I first started playing the game it made the most sense strategically to target survs with more hooks on them. If I got a quick down before the first gen popped I would camp that hook to get them to a second hook stage since I had time to spare (depending on killer). The end game I got grief for camping when its literally our only option with 3-4 alive when the gate is opened. Its survs like this that have led to un-fun changes like base kit BT that ruined the game.
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No, they say neither is "taking you hostage". And they aren't. The definition of taking someone hostage in this game is that you are forced to stay in a match indefinitely.
You just attributed that phrase to not being able to play.
You are not bodyblocked in a corner unable to do anything.
Hanging on hook has a definitive end and is part of the gameplay loop. Same with chasing, even when the killer tunnelvisions you out.
And what you want is perks for survivor that let them fight the killer on eye level in certain scenarios while also saying "swf wouldn't waste a perk slot" on something like a 10 second stun DS.
But newsflash, they would with pleasure since it makes their games easier. Swf already ran old DS+UB+BT+DH regularly. According to you they wouldn't do that because they can cover for each other. Pfffft, dream on.
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You still Got options don’t you? In the lobby you see what items the survivors bring in and Can make a plan accordingly. Lots or flashlights -lightborn. Lots of toolboxes - gen perks. You have the option to make a plan before you even go into the game.
You decide which survivors you want to chase, for How Long. Are you going to put pressure on gens, are you going to make a 3-gen strategy… even in the shittiest games, you still get a decent amount of BP for chases, kicking gens, slugging ect.. even with no kills
I love how you downplay or straight up ignore all the frustration/stress of playing killer playing like "being the fat kid in tag" getting denied at every pallet, window or due to perks when playing casual.
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Killers very often return to the hook if they're not in chase because "I know there are 2 survivors at the hook, so I'm guaranteed to find and chase 1 of them." There are basekit measures to help with tunneling, but if the recuer's healthy then the killer has to go through 2 health states no matter who he chases, and may as well tunnel.
Either survivors need to be able to unhook from a distance (like in Death Garden) so that the killer isn't guaranteed 2 survivors at the hook, or the unhooked survivor needs 3 health states.
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I tunnel as killer, but I don't tunnel just to tunnel. I do it to force some altruism and free hits from other survivors before switching to them. Laurie and Rebecca are not going to just come up to me and give me a free hit, but if they see me chasing the death-hook Jill they might. And this means that 3 survivors are not doing gens.
Tunneling costs 0 perk slots to do (though Save the Best for Last helps), and has too many incentives. If a survivor cannot 1v1 the killer for several minutes, either the game quickly becomes a 3v1 or the others damn near throw the match trying to stop the tunnel.
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This is a typical killer main response. Completely overlooking their own level of toxicity in the game and blaming the survivors for every bad thing that ever happened to this game. Killers sit in here and cry about Eruption, genrush, flashlight saves, DH, SWF swat teams and what not, but when they people that actually still fight to keep Solo in the game try to adress an issue, they just get attacked and belitttled for their opinion. People start to hardcore tunnel and camp already at 5 gens in most games, so it's not about being pressured or being the "only"" option. It's because it's the easiest and most convinient option for killers. They get to do the bare minimum, earn good BP for it and then too bad for the first survivor being caught I guess..
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I wouldn't try to explain it burt0r I think responded to Op at least once with the explanation of what "Holding Hostage" was and was ignored....OP will just call Camping and Tunneling what they want to.
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I don't deny that killer can be hard at times. I am saying you can't compare the "having no options at all" to actually being able to do stuff and change playstyle throughout the game? You guys are compairing being facecamped all match, to sweating against SWFs and no I don't think it's comparable.. It's nowhere near the same. You can still choose to give up a chase, go for someone else, do something else. If you are facecamped, farmed by your teammates, sandbagged ect you got no options at all..
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Yeah it's not the same:
- One ends after two minutes
- the other can keep on going for indefinite if your opponents so desire.
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Lmao.. I know that the "official" understanding of the phrase "taking the game hostage" means to prevent the game from progressing. Facecamping IS actually the "real" definition of a hostage. You have no options, no counterplay and therefore I think counterplay should be added if this is a "legit" strategy. I don't understand why you guys are so butthurt about it. If the Survivors could "Stun" the killer all game and they could do absolutely nothing, not even move until the match was over imagine the crying and drama on here. It's only "Acceptable" because 80% of people on here are entitled killer mains who consider survivors nothing but bots with no actual right to having fun in the game.
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Back in the day, there were streamers whose games were held hostage in the sense of they literally could not end it; sometimes for longer than 6 hours or even longer.
Unless the killer or a teammate is actively preventing you from moving around e.g. body-blocking you in a corner for a very long time, I don't think much else is considered as being held hostage. BHVR has now made it so that no game can last longer than 2 hours.
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At a guess, i think you're running deliverance, I'd say take it off so you don't get hit by the curse
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