Congratulations to BHVR for literally making an unplayable Killer
People DC as soon as they see Skully. You cannot play an actual game with her.
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There’s not a lot of people who want to play a 30 minute game trying to break a 3 gen against a killer who won’t chase.
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Do you see me blaming Survivors?
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I tried to play non 3-gen Skull Merchant, trying to go for hooks and not tunnel.
Idk but I don't think Survivors much appreciate it at all. One Survivor even said to me "fair?" (like "you are playing fair?"). That's what you get I quess for trying to play nice.
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I can't blame either side.
Looping/running for endless time is boring as hell. I thought DBD was originally about being sneaky? They've just moved so much away from stealth, and focused so much on just-- running?
Skull Merchant, imo, is the product of the game's inherently flawed DNA and them(the devs) thinking somehow that 3-Gen meta is a thing anyone wants to deal with? They could just introduce more in world mechanics aside from lockers, and pallets-- there's so much potential. TCSM is going to be a heavy hitter I think because of what they've talked about so far.
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They don't appreciate much of anything. Sadly BHVR has to keep the softness of the Survivor crowd in mind. They didn't here.
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Lol unbelievably condescending.
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I don't disagree.
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Good thing about SM is she can also give players more things to do if she wanted. I’ve been using SM with totems, and it’s been fun. No DCs. She’s the only killer that can effectively run a full totem build, and everyone sleeps on that. By keeping a drone on Thrill you ensure that cleanse attempts consume survivors time. Combined with Oppression you make 3 gens regress if you see multiple players trying to cleanse. If they manage to break your totems have Pentimento on standby until after someone dies… To inflict gen penalties… Remaining survivors would have to break rekindled totems, which you would’ve placed drones around them to alert you if they try. All of that gives her the full ability to leave her 3-gens to chase players. It isn’t the killer. Players decide to play with her in an unsportsmanlike way. DBD pretty much encourages foul play from both sides.
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Why do all that when they can just stand in one corner of the map and stall the game with significantly less effort?
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Exactly
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poor solo q. Had to suffer through the eruption 3gen era and now this. They just can't do them d@mn gens for anything hahaha
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Tell me you don't play Nurse or Legion or Spirit or Clown or Plague without telling me you don't play Nurse or Legion or Spirit or Clown or Plague.
Half joking, but survivors rage quit at the drop of a hat these days. I see it both as killer and survivor. It made me insanely angry when I was trying to get Adepts (both before and after the changes) because if anyone DCs, it's a wash. You can't get a 4K. Then I had the recent Spirit match where while they didn't DC, two survivors came straight to me and BMed, let me hook them, then tried to escape the hook on their own.. When they were saved, they came straight to me an BMed again. They obviously wanted to DC, but didn't want the matchmaking penalty. Heck, i've had people DC as soon as I come in on Pig before. They actually stuck around after the game to call me toxic for bringing the Video Tape and Crate of Gears addons.
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Because that’s boring. That’s why. It isn’t the killer. The player is the one deciding to play that way. People are always going to play foul by cheating. Use the most OP perks, or make the cheesiest plays to win. That will never go away.
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But almost every SM is playing like this and as such, they should have 0 expectations for survivors who don’t want to suffer through 30-60 minutes of trying to finish 1-2 gens against a killer who won’t chase.
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I’ve had a few DCs and self killing on hooks. But I use her for anti-loop and specifically let the final survivor leave unless its the obsession.
My build is Rancor, STBFL, Plaything, and No Way Out. Along with her Hinder and Haste add-ons. So I can deny pallet loops. Only time I put a drone near a gen is if that gen is bard to get to. Like DDS balcony or the Center of Pren.
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For the first time ever I can't say I blame anyone that dcs against her. I haven't had the displeasure of playing against her yet and I'm more than happy about it. Hopefully that won't change until her inevitable rework in a few months.
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I can't blame them either. I've always been very anti-DC and if I saw a team mate trying to let go on hook I'd drop everything to go and unhook them immediately. Now though, when a team mate DCs or lets go in a SM game I don't even care. I actually feel like the bad person insisting they stay.
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Yeah and IMO the Survivors really cannot be blamed for that. It is just miserable to go against a Skull Merchant who decides to 3-Gen. I played one game today against a Skull Merchant who in fact did use the Drones on Gens, but was not super-hard on the 3-Gen and it was ok.
But I also played against 3 Skull Merchants who were just 3-genning and not really chasing anyone. One of them burned The Game as well. And nobody really wants to play a game of trying to break a 3-Gen for 40+ minutes while not even getting the chance to go into a decent chase. Sure, you get a good amount of BPs because the game is so long, but you would have gotten more BPs in the 3 games you can play instead of that one 40+ minute game...
Skull Merchant is the one Killer since original Legion where I feel constantly miserable to play against and dont want to play at all. She is also not really fun to play in my opinion since she is not really strong (outside of her 3-Gen) but more because she is really dull to play AND kind of distracting...
And well - aside from being the first Killer since Legion which really makes me want to not play against it, I also think that this is the first Killer where I have to say - just killswitch her. Killswitch her, rework her and bring her back in a few months. And when bringing her back, include a Refund-option (for money, ACs or Shards, whatever the people paid for it) in case they dont like the reworked version of Skull Merchant. Because the current design really should not be in the game and BHVR should really pull her back for now and start from scratch.
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Are you saying looping isn't fun as survivor or it's not fun playing against survivors in chase.
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I'm trying out SM again to see if I can find a way to enjoy her. I play her without going for a 3-gen (3-gens bore the piss out of me as killer and survivor), I run my normal perk loadout (the only gen perk I use is Deadlock, because lazy), and I still get at least one quitter each match. Some matches have a disconnect and an AFKer or suicider.
I can't get a feel for her at all because I can't have a normal match.
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This is so weird I've played 40+ games with her so far and no ones DC'd beyond 2 games so???
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Yeah cause screw everyone who likes her lol. You don't like her so now no one should be allowed to play her? I'll make sure before I do anything in DBD I'll come and ask you for permission first to make sure you enjoy it mkay <3
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This is a Live game, everything is expected to have changes. Quite a bunch of Killers were already changed, some more drastically than others (e.g. Freddy, Doctor also received a bunch of changes). And you cannot really say that Skull Merchant is currently healthy with her ability to 3-Gen. And without it, she is quite weak overall (not terribly weak, but far from strong either).
And while 3-genning does not take a lot of skill in the first place, her Drones make it even easier.
I ignore the snarkiness of your comment, but I can say - the Devs did not really test her when planning her.
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Thank god that I am not the only person that calls her Skully.
in anycase, yea I been hearing about people DCing vs Skully that makes me NOT want to play her at the moment.
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So your suggestion is to keep her this way for the sake of the 10 people that like her and ruin the games of everyone who has to face her? This killer is objectively unhealthy for the game. She needs a rework.
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When you can eat 5 DC penalties in a row and it's still faster than the actual trial.
BHVR peak design.
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most underrated way to describe the skunk merchant experience,,,very well said
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Based people
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Best comment right here
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It's a map/perk + skill issue though? Like I consistently see people mention the same maps over and over when talking about SM doing a 3 gen. It seems like people are purposefully bringing themselves to those maps as SM because they know it's much less viable if you get a larger map like Torment Creek or Ironworks. Factor in the fact that the meta is 3 gen based anyway and people were literally already complaining about it before SM ever came out and this is very obviously not an issue exclusive to SM she's just the community's favorite punching bag atm.
People also have zero clue how to play against her as well which is a skill issue. If everyone disarms the drones as soon as she leaves an area she literally cannot keep up her zone and the 3 gen gets broken. This probably is harder on smaller maps but again that's a problem with the map, trying to 3 gen as SM is fairly weak on any average to large sized map against a good team.
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You’re placing too many stipulations on random people (solo queue) to combat an unfair, unfun inherent design (3-Gen). “A good team” requires coordination that solo players don’t intrinsically have. Personally I think it’s refreshing to have killers who specialize not in anti-loop but Gen defense. But I’ve also played a 46 minute match against a Skull Merchant on Garden of Joy who got a 2K (nearly a 3K) from her 3-gen strategy. And disabling the drones wasn’t really enough to prevent that because she becomes stealthy while in the drone’s radius or when they’re disabled or whatever the add-on did. And she’s pretty fast.
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What is there to be done in a game that is 6 years old and has not had a significant update to core gameplay when the killer in question's power is inherently better suited to controlling specific areas rather than engaging in late game chases?
That's the issue, is if the devs are going to make killers who by design are just average or below average in the chase power wise people aren't going to stress themselves chasing. It makes little sense to do so when know that the reward for doing so is very small compared to just holding strategic positions. It's been pretty clear for a long time that ultimately a m1 killer needs to not ship with a utility only power with no thought put into chase support. Can't really get mad at players for doing what the killer is designed best to do.
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If SM wasn't the problem we'd have seen way more complaints about 3-gens before she got released. Only that wasn't case. You had the occasional discussion about Knight an his 3-gen ability but that was it. The complaints about Skull Merchant won't die down just like that. Even when her gens are spread halfway across the map she will still be able to defend them easily. That's how her power works. There is no such thing as skill in this particular playstyle.
You can make all the arguments about skill issues you want. The truth is that holding M1 on a gen takes as much skill as setting drones on gens and kicking them once they have a tiny bit of progress. Which is none at all. There is no skill involved here. It's just patience and coordination. Coordination that solos can never have.
I can make an example of why 3-gens aren't that big of an issue in theory. Just bring 4 toolboxes with BNPs and use them on the last gen. Easy. You see the problem here? That will never happen. SM's 3-gen strength is that ridiculous. You won't win every match but you can make every match miserable, if you set your mind to it. And if you don't SM is a killer with pretty much no power at all.
I agree that some gen spawns are absolutely stupid. But that doesn't mean that every map should be Mother's Dwelling. You need to consider what happens with other killers as well, if you move gens further apart. And for Skull Merchant to be unable to drag out games this long that needs to be a huge distance.
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How is this different than cenobite or plague though? Both of those killers also require a lot of coordination to beat as well, if nobody does box or the ceno makes the box their priority and nobody contests that nobody will be able to gens and that can happen at 5 gens. If a team isn't on the same page about cleansing plague will just run over a team with access to red vom and if nobody cleanses everyone is playing broken which isn't much different than ignoring the drones. I haven't seen anything that convinces me SM is egregiously worse than either of those killers.
Except everyone did complain about knight a ton especially after Hens released the 1 hour knight game he played on dead dawg. Not to mention all the eruption complaints really boiled down to making 3 gens too strong so I disagree nobody was talking about this before SM. Also you're doing the same fallacy a see a bunch of people do which is assuming mechanical skill is the only type of skill when it's not, game sense and decision making is also a skill and the average DBD player has the game sense of a potato. A lot of videos I'm seeing of people playing against me and other people playing SM boils down to bad decision making whether that's not committing to a gen that was nearly done or respecting the drones too much. Now some of this is match knowledge against SM that nobody has really cuz she just came out and the strategies against her haven't really formed yet and I don't blame anyone for that because those things take time. What does annoy me is when people go straight to "too strong please nerf" instead of actually trying to learn and test things and seeing if it can be beat before doing that. My experience so far is that SM is relatively balanced people just don't wanna actually take the time to learn so I roll my eyes at people complaining when it's very obvious they don't fully understand the killer.
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Oof. This reaction is so strong I can practically feel it pimp slapping me in the face. It's weird how many us v them posts y'all force into forums. Almost like it's an agenda atp
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^^^^
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Notice how they said to rework the character and refund people possibly and yet the snarky Andy such as yourself immediately went for passive aggression over nothing
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Bestie not the skunk merchant 💀
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Yep playing her is more or less impossible. Hell I’ve literally stopped kicking gens period in my last few games and still people just leave
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But she is and i'm very lenient 💅
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Fair enough. I'm calling her Predator from Wish.
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Not bad at all , i approve ^^
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What's there to understand about her exactly? She's arguably a worse Knight in terms of zoning, defending areas, and a power that literally gets deactivated after a duration? The only thing she has going for her is basically a built in insidious and Ghostface stalk but minus the danger associated
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I only see one side DCing regularly. It’s a fact. To consider it “us vs them” dismisses the issue.
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Your personal anecdotes aren't an objective fact. I've seen way more killers DC in the past weeks compared to survivors. Doesn't mean my experience is the only truth. So no, it is an us v them argument and is deliberately ignoring dcing is a problem for BOTH sides not just 1
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There is no skill involved in walking from gen to gen, resetting drones, kicking gens and occasionaly hitting a survivor without ever committing to a chase. Someone that just installed DBD could do that, if I told them to. It really is that simple.
Game sense is something you use on Pinhead and Doctor for example. Doctor can use his Static Blast to manage Madness and Pinhead can find the box again and again. That is not necessary when kicking gens and resetting drones like a bot.
SM has an insta down. So ignoring the drones, getting exposed, alarming the killer via killer instinct and going down in 1 hit is not exactly an option. Skull Merchant is not a strong killer. She is just poorly designed. Nerfing her would not help with this problem at all. Which is why I don't want her nerfed. I want her reworked. Completely.
She is not as complex as you give her credit for. It all comes down to 3-gen breaking with an extra delay via drones. That is the problem. If I wanted to I could easily drag the game out to be 40 minutes with her. I could lose but I can guarantee that no one will have fun in that game. That's why SM is poorly designed. It is always unfun to play against her because she combines everything nobody likes as a survivor. Zoning, area control, game delay and no actual chase. Apart from many people hating to play her as well for pretty much the same reasons.
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I was talking about game sense from the survivors side against the killer but SM needs game sense as well, you're assuming every SM playing 3 gens and those of us who are legit trying to learn the killer and push their limits generally don't. I have for a few games just to see what everyone is talking about and on certain maps I will admit it's kinda stupid but I see that as a problem with those maps and on other maps like ormond and ironworks it felt like a complete waste of time trying to 3 gen and the drones were only a mild annoyance to the survivors. I think what BHVR has done and turned certain formally fair maps like dead dawg and silent hill into the equivalent of red forest and garden for survivors and that's not at all good for the game and I think overall map size should be standardized with no small or large maps.
When I see a lot of streamers actively get multiple things wrong about how SM's power works I disagree that she's not complex. Seriously it's painful watching a lot of the big names play SM because it's obvious they don't know how she works and they're not that interested in learning. I think her mechanics are simple sure and I understand that's all most people care about but I think there's a ton involved in understanding the rules of her drones and how the radar works and how to take advantage of that including when to space drones out when to cluster them so you're taking control of the most important space at a given time. How to interpret the radar and when to act on that information and keeping people's traps on their arm to get them exposed because most people don't understand they get locked on faster with a trap on and how all that interacts with add-ons and perks to take an advantage of what what she can do. There's so many weird little obscure things about how she works with the drones, radar, and traps that anyone who says they fully understand her right now is liar to be perfectly honest.
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I don't wanna play her either. A majority of survivors don't want to play her because they know what perks she brings and it's annoying because this is supposed to be a game about chase and defense not just defense. Even if you don't bring 4 slowdowns the MOMENT her PTB came out everyone knew she was meant to be used with the gen kick meta and nothing else. She is a waste of a chapter.
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Post edited by xTripInThe6x on0
