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So survivors nerf update became killer nerf update? KEKW
There were only two things I cared the most about in this update: DH and CoH.
DH: so one rescue gives two activations at once? Wow, so we keep seeing this ######### perk in every chase except first two? You know what, BHVR? I'm not sure that you thought about it, but the killers for 7 years of the game have deserved the right to swing at a injured survivor without being afraid to give him a third stage of health. That's was the biggest problem with this perk and it is now still here. To justify this buff by tunneling is very stupid, because it does not work and has never worked this way, but with this update I'll be tunneling a lot more on killers.
CoH: You make healing as it was (imo all healing should be 20 sec, but ok, i don't really care much about this revert), but still decided to buff CoH? 8 seconds to one survivors to be healed? 16 seconds on two? You're a little late with April Fools' jokes, to be honest. Well, two CoHs on the map and now hits doesn't matter even more than before lmao
Yeah, and "but when you crunched the numbers, Circle of Healing rarely provided any benefit." Yeah, you know what? CoB NOW SAVING YOU 4 SECONDS provided that no one touched the generator for a whole minute. How about this numbers? Yeah, you don't care.
PR "buff" still garbage, too situational and pointless. 3 times more weaker than old Pop. And this is if you do not remember that you have only 4 hooks on the map, the spawns of which do not allow you to use this perk the whole game sometimes. At this point, 10 times more weaker, than old Pop.
So lets most boosted survivors perks stay as it was with minor adjustments. Lets revert healing, because before ptb we see problems with it, but now every problem magically disappeared and began to look balanced again lol. Lets destroy all killers regress perk to oblivion and one more time buff survivors genrush perks. (29% Resilience + Overzealous (with cleansed hex) still do nothing about it, wow, really balanced. My new build btw). A small nerf of medkits, which will hardly be noticeable, because 2 CoH on the map and you will be better than before the update. Back to meta, yeah, cool.
Words can't describe how this news turns the whole update upside down. This is absurd and ridiculous. Well, I'll continue to sit on survivors much more and win matches with one button with my swf.
Comments
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Amen brother. I'm playing meet your maker idc what they do with this game anymore.
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Hmmmm, no.
This update seems pretty good right now.
Med-Kits are still rightfully nerfed. CoH's main issue is fixed, no more infinite self-heals. DH is in a good spot, it gets more powerful the weaker the Survivor team is. PR got a good buff from the PTB, 25% is huge value.
Oh, and Billy got a net buff, which is always appreciated.
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PR got changed from sustain regression to burst. It's 25x4=100/15=6.66 so you need to put each survivor once on a scourge hook and you get regression equal to 6.66 PR hooks on current patch. Keep in mind you don't always get scourge hooks nor need them very deep into the game. Shouldn't do anything other than nerf players that tunnel and camp.
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Pushing people away from tunneling and camping is always a W, imo.
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how does one rescue gives two activations at once, have you read the change correctly?
dh is pretty much dead so is coh but coh might be broken with swfs who can coordinate and regroup at the boon and reset in seconds.
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I mean to be hooonest... if im 100% honest here this new DH change will actually give me a reason to tunnel
If i hit the person off the hook they get endurance effect and they can't use their DH. Makes more reason to tunnel them so they can't use it right.
Not saying i will im just saying NOTHING changed. This update is really survivor sided, and as much as i love the medkit change i don't think CoH should have been 100% again. Survivors will just use we'll make it anyways so nothing changes. People will be healed fast and killers will struggle at higher MMR, now with worse perks.
Billy buff is nice. He deserves it. I think i will take a break from killer side.
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As if SWF is not broken as it is
Or with the old COH
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Yes, indeed, I read it wrong at first. Thank you for paying attention to this! Then this perk update is not as bad as it could be.
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I'd argue that removing the ability for all 4 survivors to heal themselves whenever they want using a single perk slot, and instead forcing other survivors to take themselves away from their primary objective to run across the map to heal another survivor in a potentially bad spot of the map a buff and not a nerf, and limiting DH to 2 uses per survivor per match is also a pretty hefty nerf, but what do I know
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CoH is now a risk reward perk.
You need to take the time to set up a Boon and you need two Survivors to heal with it. All of that is essentially free time for me as a Killer.
I expect this to be a somewhat fair patch, though it is difficult to tell. I don't expect it to affect my kill rates much.
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For me lately gen speeds and healing have been an issue, and i think it will continue to be the same. This new CoH speed will be really broken with SWFS and good survivors will bring a healing perk like we'll make it to the game instead of self care.
I'm little worried since ive been playing with Jolt only lately and against good survivors i have to sweat and tunnel my ass off..which isnt fun.
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Good Survivors weren't using Self-Care.
Likewise, if you are using only Jolt and you are playing against optimal players, why should you win? You are handicapping yourself and they aren't.
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Yeah, these killer mains don't agree with you
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Because i don't want to be playing with jolt, corrupted, eruption and deadlock. Also all those perks are kinda poopoo.
I love using some info perks, and i love slobby. I won't play with 4 crappy gen defenses.
Also youd be surprised how many 2-3k hour survivors ive seen using self care...at those hours they should know better.
In perfect world id like this game to be balanced so killers can actually use perks for chasing and for info without having to worry about gens flying which is the case now.
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But would you go after unhooker if he has 3 health state versus one on unhooked? Now it will be 2 health state vs 2 health state. Actually with the change you don't have to tunnel it's worth to chase someone else especially if you use new pr 25% regression. I will personally tunnel lot less with these changes.
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If i go after the person who got unhooked he or she will be injured and if you hit them during BT they can't use DH anymore. So techically this new DH courages people to tunnel as well. This way you make sure they wont come bodyblock later on with DH in their arsenal. Thats why im saying nothing really changed on the tunneling aspect. Killers will tunnel if they want to tunnel. If killer doesnt wanna deal with DH tunneling is the best option.
Its not like they get insta healed off the hook and im assuming they still need to press that famous E and time it right.
Also i won't use this new pain res. I rather use pop which at least will work during the whole match.
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That's fine.
You shouldn't be able to beat players who are playing optimally (assuming you are at the same skill level) if you aren't also playing optimally.
In order to achieve your idea of balance, we would need to delete ALL gen regression or blocking perks and re-balance the base game.
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I still think the self healing change still hits solo q pretty hard, unfortunately.
I'm expecting most people will just run self care (with or without botany), and we'll be back to 'self care in the corner' that existed before boons became a thing. Although there might be a few who still run Circle and spam crouch until someone comes to heal them.
The slow down nerfs will help tho, so I'll have to try it and see how it is in practice.
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The risk is minimal. Only one survivor needs to have the perk for all 4 to get value out of it. Survivors have 16 perk slots in total, so dedicating only one to get faster heals is pretty worth it. Also, the time to set up a boon isn't that big as long as you know totem spawns, so I don't see this "risk" of CoH.
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The risk is high. 14 seconds spent on a totem is 14 seconds not on a gen.
Take this hypothetical scenario.
Most players will not know every totem spawn and some maps (Midwich, ######### off) have weird spawns. We'll say, considering this, that it takes 25 seconds to find a totem on AVERAGE. 14 seconds to Bless it. We'll say it's a small map and it only takes 10 seconds to run to the Boon range. Now, it's an 8 second heal, I think.
So, in total, we're looking at around a 75 second time investment, assuming the Killer doesn't snuff the Totem prior to you healing.
25 to find + 14 to Bless + 20 (two Survivors run to the Boon) + 16 (two Survivors healing) = 75 seconds of total time investment to heal once.
There are situations where it can be very good, but it won't be consistently good now that it's main strength (self-healing) was completely removed.
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If you think that this CoH nerf wasn't harsh, then you clearly didn't understand what made it strong in the first place.
Oh, and there's more maps without good Boon spots (like Autohaven maps) as there are with good Boon spots (Ironworks).
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14 seconds for survivor isn't that much of a deal. Also, the most popular totem spawns are well known and pretty obvious. On Ironworks of Misery for example, everyone knows the totem on the second floor of the main building and that place is so inconvenient that killers won't even bother going there to snuff the totem. Again, you are pretty much investing 14 seconds of your time so you and your teammates can get faster heals for an indefinite time, which is still huge.
Exponential has much more of a risk involved, since if the killer don't slug you won't get value out of it, and it is still a great perk since it can nullify a playstyle for just a tiny price. Of course, as a solo, your perk slots are more valuable since.you won't know the full build of your teammates, but on a SWF you can use those perks since it much easier to get synergy between builds.
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The lack of self-heal is not a problem anymore now when it's back to 100% heal as well as the reverted changes to healing. Two survivors can still go and heal each other quickly without a problem.
There's no such thing as good or bad boon spots. Boons can be relit over and over. Hexes on the other hand are applied to random totem and random totem spawn points can decide if Hex will last long enough to do any job or not.
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Who said anything about Hexes?
Again, like I said, you clearly don't understand WHY CoH was strong.
I don't think it's a bad perk now, just not really worth it unless you're a 4-man, which heavily limits it's usage.
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Already addressed this.
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Well, you said there is such a thing as bad spot for Boon to be applied. I said there is no such thing because boon can be applied to any totem and re-applied over and over as long as there is a totem standing.
So you say COH was strong for something else than it's ability to grant free self heal for a single person? Tell me what else it did offer to survivors.
I doubt it's for Swfs. It should work just fine if survivor goes for healer / support build. Of course in Solo Q any build can be hit or miss but that's because it's unknown if your team mates do actually try to play or decide to die on the first hook. The way I see, COH can work with decent randoms and certainly has a purpose.
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Survivor can have ds so he will get back dh... Meanwhile unhooker does not have dh so killer can avoid dh that way for sure. Ofcourse after you're hooked everyone once then hard tunneling someone is good option to avoid dh.
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Too bad new PR doesn’t do that, and actually incentivizes it funny enough.
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The update was good except for dead hard. They need to kill that perk like they need to kill nurse.
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Oh?
You get to use PR by tunneling? Do tell me more about that.
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I’d rather save my tokens for late game, so the unhooked survivor would be a much more appropriate target for pressure.
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Coh is a perk I've always despised, I don't care about Dead Hard that much anymore, every killer hates it so I guess it can go as long as I can continue to combo exhaustion perks with No Mither. All in all, this patch is alright, I don't think it's as bad as you're saying though.
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I knew they would kneel down this time again.
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If you don´t see the issue of a 100% CoH heal, that stacks with Med kits and other perks, then i really don´t know what to tell you.
Streamers pointed out extreme cases of 6 minute heals, that we will never encounter in a real match. Less than 5 second heals are however effectivly doable by SWF that stack healing perks.
But i guess, no issue in that.
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If you want it to be useless till the end be my guest. Enjoy your 1 time proc then you get nothing till you change targets. Unlike before were you could just spam it by forcing trades,camps, and tunnels.
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You're not going to get 100% out of CoH though, due to the 14 second time investment of setting it up, and the restricted range. As it was, the 50% was simply not giving the perk any value, making it a flat worse version of Botany Knowledge. It needed something to be worth running.
This is not what I would've chosen, but I think it does work.
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My question here is.. why do survivor perks need something worth to be running for? Theme with killers have been to destroy their perks so they won't be used anymore. So why can't they do the same for survivors? This new CoH is almost as broken as the old one. I can see it becoming an issue again. They were too scared to go through with the DH nerf so they ..balanced it. Making it so we will again see 8 DH in 1 match.
So answer why can't they give the survivor perks that are clearly overused and overperfoming the same treatment they have given killers?
Point to these metashake ups is to make killers and survivors use different perks, but obviously it only affects killers since survivors will just continue using the same perks as they do now.
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We´ll see. CoH, with its current 50% bonus healing speed, can currently perform extremely quick heals in combination with med kits and other healing perks. You usually only have to set it up once or twice at the start of the match.
I was actually surprised, that i never see people stacking healing perks to altruistically heal. But maybe that changes with the patch.
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So you want both sides to be treated poorly, as opposed to both sides being treated better?
I like to run mega heal-stack builds (not even necessarily CoH, it's not impressed me that much, and never with medkits), and while it can pay off and be pretty fun, there's also plenty of matches where I just don't get an opportunity to heal others, leaving those perks burning a hole in my pocket. That kind of coordination is still a bit of a pain, particularly for solo queue, so I can understand why people aren't too keen on running healing perks.
CoH feels more bluntly impactful, so it's a more popular pick, even if it isn't necessarily better.
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I want both sides to be treated equal, which i am not seeing. Lately its been 1 killer perk after another one thats been destroyed to the point of no usage. This has not happened to a single survivor perk yet.
No not give me iron will or spine chill. I still see both of those a lot in my games and both of them are very usable and good perks.
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Idk I see those killer perks used a few times in games. Are they strong as they were? No but killers in this game tend to be a bit dramatic and claim any nerf makes that perk less then useless
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You call killers dramatic when survivors were having a major meltdown over their nerfs? Most of them got fixed or improved.
When i see ruin nowdays i dont even bother cleansing it. Its so bad. Pop is only good on a gen thats 80-90% done. Thanatophobia only works on plague. Corrupted invention is a shadow of itself. I loved that perk to death but nowdays i rather use lethal.
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Yeah this will benefit mostly SWF. I´ve tried it a couple of times, stacking healing perks and Med kits. Its actually insane. I stopped, because as solo, my teammates often run away from me and start to heal themselves under my CoH, while i´m standing next to them...
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DH is still a fair bit weaker after the patch and CoH is significantly weaker after the patch, so not sure why you're complaining.
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Yeah, that's the point of my post. Devs just killer sided, you know
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DH is “a fair bit weaker”, but the killer perks are massively nerfed into the ground to the point where I need to remove them all from my perk loadouts.
Also, the original PTB version of dead hard was a good enough nerf, but it just got a massive un-nerf, and that’s a problem too, because seeing a decently nerfed DH gave people hope that it might drop from the meta.
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Also add the fact that solo survivors may stand in the aura for who knows how long waiting for help that might never come (we've all had those games where no one wants to heal you). So that's a survivor injured and off a gen for an extended period of time.
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Most survivor perks are already so poor/weak as to not be worth running. Calm spirit got nerfed and wasn't even close to being a 'meta' perk when that happened.
When was the last time you saw Premonition, Solidarity, Visionary, or even Smash Hit?
Survivor items are being 'gutted' harder than any killer perks. Not saying that medkits or BNP aren't in need of tuning, but most items aren't even worth considering outside of extremely niche use cases.
Maps have never been great, keys are a joke since the hatch changes, flashlights are being toned down in large chunks every patch or so, medkits get the axe in 6.7. Which leaves basically toolboxes untouched, and BNP does need a nerf, so likely toolboxes as a whole are getting nerfed whenever that happens.
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I mean, they did. In the 6.1 update. That update occurred because of ongoing complaints from killers about a lack of perk variety among the survivors they face. They were correct of course - most survivors usually a ran a combo of DH, DS, UB, IW, etc. So the devs nerfed a bunch of them, and it worked - ive seen much more variety among survivor builds since.
They changed things up on the killer side too but that was clearly for the better, as that's where the pretty successful gen regression meta came from. Most killers I faced started running it because they had better results. So we went from no variety on survivor builds to no variety on killer builds. And BHVR is obviously trying to do away with these meta builds. I don't think anyone could deny that had they not reverted some of these healing nerfs, that a new meta would have emerged on both sides (anti-healing builds from killers and healing and/or gen builds for survivors) thus going against everything BHVR have been trying to do with these overhauls in the first place.
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I mean mostly i see Is these 4 perks. Adrealine, Dead Hard, Unbreakable and resilience or windows. These are the 4-5 perks i see mostly. So i wouldnt say survivors are using "many" interesting perks. I wish people would. I really do wish the game would allow both sides to use whatever they want to, but sad truth is killers need gen regression and survivors need perks to help with camping and tunneling.
I just personally don't think this next patch is fair towards killer and keep in mind im mostly survivor player. SoloQ too or i play with my BF so duo. I hate matches that are too easy. i like challenge. I like endgames where both sides are fighting until the end.
They should have kept the DH nerf and they should have kept the CoH nerf.
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