Something I need to know
Okay so a killer slugs at let's say one gen or zero gens okay it's annoying but hey they at least want a kill go for it but what I want to know is why slug at 4 or 5 gens. The game barely started and already the killer slugs it's basically just having the finishing mori update but a lot less short since if the finishing mori update was done a few seconds of an animation I'm back in the lobby and in the next match. But with the killer slugging at 5 or 4 gens it's me sitting there self recovered at max while everyone is down with one other teammate basically running around. I just want to know why slug at 4 or 5 gens because 1 or none at least makes somewhat sense for trying to get a least one kill because I get it matchmaking is garbage and your just trying to get some BP.
Comments
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Because by the time two or three gens pops, it's too late to spread pressure around.
It goes same for tunneling/camping, all the strat only works when killer decided to do it from the start.
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because the developers allow it. maybe the devs would like to comment on why this type of tactic is in game.
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They did a while back saying that Camping, Tunneling, and Slugging are all valid strats for the Killer to use to apply pressure.
Hence why they won't just "Get Rid" of those strats or make something that would punish those Killers who use them correctly in a non BM way vs those who use them in a BM way.
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Perfectly legit way to build pressure when a killer is slugging selectively with good reason. It's straight up griefing if they're running Knock Out or something and slugging to bleed out with the gens up. There's no other reason for that playstyle.
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I'm not a dev, but I can offer an explanation.
While not the funnest experience being slugged doesn't produce a state in which the game can't end normally on its own. There are several ways to mitigate the effectiveness of slugging in the game already. Total prevention of slugging would be a very real detriment to killer gameplay which you can tell is something they considered early on as killers do have at least 1 perk that is specifically designed to aid in making it difficult to find a slugged survivor. It is a valid way to pressure the game when used in moderation as at that point you're just maximizing the value obtained from a core part of gameplay. Taking that away would probably require a change to the core gameplay of killers to compensate.
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Because the game is Dead by Daylight, not babysit the Survivors when they screw up and all get slugged.
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do we agree that 4 man slugging and bleedout without hooking anyone is just BM?
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I've done this before (although typically fewer gens) and I've done it mostly when I m playing a group of survivors that are playing very altruistically and flashlight blinding over and over. Tmit does make a bit more sense to slug out a team of survivors who aren't doing gens and are throwing everything at you to not hook well (flashlights, bodyblock, and sabotage hooks to name some fo the main ways). I won't let them bleed out though. Typically I'll even let one survivor struggle free to start saving their friends who are all hooked and that makes things a bit better (and discourages them from being as altruistic)
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Using a perk is not griefing.
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I dont get the complaints around slugging. Slugging is a worse strategy than just hooking survs, unless you have a build around slugging. I usually slug as killer if I think I can get another hit/down before the downed person is picked up.
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Because things like slugging, tunneling, and camping are the byproducts of a game focus around the killer killing survivors. These strategies have to exist otherwise the survivors have a way to become invincible which is not good.
Ultimately unless the game sees a massive overhaul to the core of the game, We all just have to deal with people being toxic with the game mechanics as the devs don't really punish toxic bhvr by itself.
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I think people respond so viscerally to being slugged because they know that it's inferior to being hooked.
Survivors instantly feel like there is this 'race against the clock' to get picked up before the Killer comes back to throw them on a hook. Occassionally you get a teammate that comes over to you once you've recovered, but then hides behind the rock next to you, because they hear the Killer's terror radius. There is plenty of time for your teammate to pick you up, but ultimately they stay behind that rock and watch the Killer come back to throw you on a hook--it's agonizing, really.
Also, the hook timer forces some urgency into your team. Most of the time you can rest assured that you'll be back in the action within a minute. When you're on the ground, your team might leave you there for 2 minutes AND THEN the Killer throws you on hook and you spend another full minute out of the game.
People have a pretty good idea of what happens next, when they are on a hook. When left on the ground, there is a lot more ambiguity about the Killer's next move, as well as your teammates', and I think that makes people uncomfortable.
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If I'm playing killer and you bring Boil Over and are purposely going to an unhookable area, either by map offerings, purple hook offering or hook sabotaging/breakdown, then you are absolutely getting slugged!
Had some idiot going off on PSN recently after a game like that, but bringing builds like that is practically asking for it!
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A hook takes anywhere from 5 seconds to 21 seconds. (3 second pickup, 2 second hooking, 0-16seconds of walking)
If the other 3 survivors are on gens, which in the early game is very likely means they can do between 3.33%-14% of completing all generators.
If you slug and chase right away you suddenly reduce the number of people on gens from 3 to 1 instantly, as one is on the ground, one is chased and one has to pick up who is on the ground. If you can down the other survivor before the first one is picked up you can safely hook without having to worry about losing a ton of gen progress
This is how you create pressure, and for the survivor it makes practically no difference. Hanging on a hook doing nothing or laying on the ground doing nothing is pretty much the same. Except you are not closer to being out of the game. So it's a win win for both sides if not taken to the extreme
It is the way for killers to still play to win without instantly getting someone out of the game. It's the least toxic effecient strat there is.
Ofcourse when you down all 4 and then don't hook them then that's bm cause it serves no purpose other then to waste time.
But as far as slugging to go for another chase goes it's the nice way to play to win
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I mean trying to slug all the survivors isn't usually that effective and that's why you don't see it all that often. If a killer wants to play that way though they have every right to do it, the survivors should have an easier game so long as they don't screw up and all go down.
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That's simple to create more SWF groups that take out their revenge on killer players that want to play a fun match.
AKA bully squads🙂😆
Just a endless cycle of BS to increase their egos.
But hey! That's what everyone wants? Right?
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You shouldn’t be questioning the killer if they slugged the whole team at 4-5 gens. You should be questioning how your team massively failed at the game to allow that to happen in the first place.
Don’t get mad at the killer for your teams misplay. They don’t know how good you are or how the game will play out. They took advantage of your mistakes and won. Next time, I’d this is happening often enough, bring in Unbreakable, Soul Guard or Boon: Exponential.
It’s really no different from when a killer fails to apply pressure and the gens get completed in 5 minutes.
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If I get slugged along with everyone else, I crawl away. 6/10 times I'm found anyways, 3/10 I bleed out, and 1/10 I find the hatch and live.
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It's a jerk thing to do yes.
Why you wanted confirmation of this from me is weird.
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Unbreakable base kit when all survivors are either in the dying state or on the hook
Also basekit when there are 2 survivors left in the game, regardless if the 2nd one is healthy or not
That would fix everything
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I think it be okay with it if there was a good trade off for the killer as well. I think everyone getting unbreakable even in that situation could be too much but I'd want something to slightly help the killer too (maybe get a noise notification when a player picks themselves up? Not too sure what exactly). I think there has to be something given to the killer if that's given to survivors (although I think something less strong for killer than unbreakable is to survivors)
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In the early game, survivors should be spread out working on separate gens. If the killer wants to down someone and then, instead of hooking them, trek all the way across the map to find/chase a 2nd survivor, leaving the downed one to be picked up by someone else (or, at best, losing track of their location), then great! Thank you!
As a survivor, if you're making that strategy successful, that's on you.
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In what situation it would be bad for the killer? Very curious
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It would be bad because having survivors be able to get back up base kit actively goes against the killers goal of killing survivors. Sure, the killer could get more hooks with this but a killer can already do that (either intentionally or unintentionally). It would get annoying as a killer to try to get a 4k (not that they should get one super consistently anyways) that as soon as you down a survivor with two on hook and one downed that another pops up and unhooks everyone. It could make games drag on pretty long since as soon as you down a survivor the other one immediately gets unbreakable and pops up. There needs to be something in place to not force a killer to just play wack a mole over and over between 2 (or even all 4) survivors
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It's a tactic, the killer downs all of you to assure where your at and what your're doing.
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But assuming 2 survivors are on hook, one dying and the other one running around, the killer should just hook the dying survivor. My suggestion is to literally stop slugging, and leaving the 3rd survivor in the dying state is slugging for 4k. Also, the dying survivor still needs to recover 100% before picking themselves up
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Not necessarily. There are situations where it does make sense to down the 2nd. Plus, the already downed survivor can recover up to ~97% while the other survivor is in chase so as soon as the other survivor gets downed the dying survivor would get up. This would lead to more drawn out games or the killer is just given less of a chance for a 4k than they already have. I know killers shouldn't be given 4ks every game but the hatch is already a counter to guaranteed 4ks and giving basekit unbreakable makes it so killers shouldn't even bother trying for a 4k since downing both survivors at the end is pointless. Killers would need to be compensated in some way
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Let's agree to disagree
But I disagree completely
In that situation the killer is already winning
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Oh that's a bit different. I do agree the killer still wins with a 3k but I don't like the idea of preventing a killer from being able to get an overwhelming win (just as survivors shouldn't be prevented from an overwhelming win such as all survivors live and/or no survivors being hooked). I don't like the idea preventing players from doing as well as they could on either side beyond the hatch existing. If a killer or survivors team does well they should be rewarded for it rather than punished.
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This is also dependent on the killer played
A killer like Oni or Dredge benefit A LOT more from slugging since they can get more value out of their power
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You don't always know how the game will go.
Sometimes as killer you apply the same tactic as ever and the survivor answer with such a streak of bad plays they end up on the ground in a couple of minutes with 4 gens left.
It happens once in a blue moon but it happens.
If it happens to you often, there may be an issue with your team (or you are playing solo and being badly matched)
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5 gens can become 2 gens within seconds pretty quickly, thats how BS are gens speeds without the killer making preassure and if survivors are playing smarter instead of wasting time searching on a chest and placing boons.
+ flashlights and looping are the only things fun as survivors (and some other meme perks) , if the killer doesnt want to chase me , them am gonna repair instead of being useless for my team and thats when gens starts flying because the killer didnt slug when they have to or they didnt tunnel when they should.
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Some killers just focus on winning.
If they down you they go on as quickly as possible. And if they down all they are probably to good for your team. Gen count doesn´t matter there.
In principle the MMR or the matchmaking should prevent such one sided overpowered matches... but well... we know how it is.
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Hooking takes a lotta time. There are lot of perks and items, offerings to mess with hooking. Sometimes its just not worth it.
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Depends.
I've had SWFs that didn't seem to have any intention of doing gens, just wanted to troll me as the killer. I slugged all of them and let them bleed out.
I've had gen rushers loaded down with progression perks and fat toolboxes w/BNPs do three gens before I got my first down. None of them seemed geared for healing, so I wound up slugging all of them before the doors were opened. They split up and tried to crawl to the far corners of the map so I let them, and waited for them to bleed out.
I've had survivor groups try to unhook in my face or when I've taken ~five steps from the hook, and wind up with either all four on the ground or one on the hook and three on the ground. Depending on the map and RNG there are frequent times where there aren't any other hooks within easy travel range (coughMidwichcough), so I just AFK and watch something online while they bleed out.
I assure you, there are reasons for slugging/bleeding out a full survivor team. At minimum, half the time it's on the survivor(s) themselves.
Skip the Boil Over/wiggle if you don't want to be left on the ground. If the hatch is closed, the killer is staring at you, and it's your first hook of the trial, skip the Deliverance (all it does is net the killer more chase/hit/down/hook points). Stay where you got dropped and wait to be picked up. If it's the end of the trial or obviously no way to win, instead of running to a map corner or crawling off to wait for bleed out, run/crawl to a hook or wait for the AFK crows to alert the killer so you can jump in another trial asap. If it's a loss and you went down in an area without hooks, don't wiggle while the killer is carrying you to a place with a hook (in my trials if that's the case and the survivor wiggles more than the initial auto wiggle, I just drop them and wait out the timer).
Or just DC. It doesn't make a big difference at that point, anyway.
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lol, no. Devs don't need to hold your hands anymore. The only "fixing" slugging needs is to reduce the bleed out timer when all survivors are slugged and no one was willing to equip perks that counter it. In the meantime, don't bunch up and give the killer an easy win.
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Read the second half of the sentence.
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lol no
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Well then, keep being bad and let killers slug your team.
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Yeah, this. If I get slugged (ie downed and left for an extended period of time at the beginning of the game, not just for the killer to chase someone close by) early in the game it pretty much always works against the killer. If the killer camps the slug, he'll need to camp a lot longer than he would a hook. If he leaves, maybe it takes slightly longer to get back up than an unhook would, but usually not, and I still have all my hook states.
A possible compromise:
I would like to speed up the game when it is down to two survivors and one is already down, such as with an accelerated bleed out timer. This would probably result in more hatch escapes.
I'd also like to speed up the game when all the gens are done, the killer has one survivor on hook, and the other three survivors are trying for the 4k. I'd like EGC to start with the last gen finished so we don't get in a draw out of - survivors rush in, unhook, killer gets one down, killer hooks, survivors retreat and reset and go again. That would make the the overwhelming victory (4e) for the survivor harder.
I think that putting in both at the same time would be a good idea. It would make total victories less likely on either side, but also speed up the game for everyone.
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I did, but the perk is literally designed to be for slugging, and then you complain about slugging. This would be like complaining that survivors using sprint burst is griefing because it lets them get away faster.
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I think overall i like that compromise but I do see that certain perks would need to change (like blood warden).
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Oh yes. With Oni I almost always slug.
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