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Exhaustion perks are always going to be a problem
Regardless what your opinion is, exhaustion perks will and always will be a problem. It only becomes less of a problem if they get nerfed til survivors refuse to use those perks. Dead Hard is still used even after the nerfs thus they're not nerfing it hard enough. Killer regression perks are nerfed to obsolete so killers have to find replacement. Survivors? No, no, no, they get a slap to the wrist nerfs and call it a day. SWF are now abusing Boon: Circle of Healing instantly healing eachother to full health. Dead Hard is still prevalent since they are adapting to it. The perks hasn't changed at all for survivors... again, and they managed to make Circle of Healing stronger. Gg, wp.
Comments
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Somewhat agreed but I do actually see less of dead hard because of the nerf or maybe my rank hasn't settled yet not sure though.
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dude, dead hard is borderline trash now.
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yeah right, all survivor should start the trial on the hook and only the 4% gang wins a chance to fight against the killer.
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You mean killers will always complain about exhaustion perks. Just whatever causes them the most frustration in a game rather than if it's actually unbalanced or not.
Survs need something that helps in chase. And exhaustion perks are always going to be used. Wouldn't be much of a game otherwise.
If all exhaustion perks get nerfed into oblivion then killers would complain about genrush and stealth builds.
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Exhaustion perks are fine vs Nurse and Blight but they have always been quite punishing to the killers like Trapper and Wraith who are completely turned off when a survivor drops a pallet in chase.
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Any halfway functional perk is always going to be a "problem".
No one's complaining about Smash Hit and Background Player, are they? At least not outside of PTBs, where everything is called OP.
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Before exhaustion perks were really a mandatory thing killers did complain about stealth. As the game moved more toward chase & away from stealth and survivors began losing perks that helped with stealth via nerf & rebalancing, they of course had to adapt by using perks that helped in chase. But then killers began complaining about chase (as they do now). I think killer mains here don’t really want survivors to have any perks that make the game challenging for them.
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sounds like you want easy mode where you get perks but survivors dont? how about take bloodlust away and make all killers 2 percent faster then survivors
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Who said I want easy mode? I want to finally see survivors using different perks instead of using the same perks 24/7 such as Dead Hard and CoH. Shits getting really old.
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Um wraith literally almost counter's sprint burst if you don't uncloak completely.
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both perks were just nerfed. what more do you want done? do you want them to make them non usable? if thats the goal. just take away all perks and addons
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And the nerfs are nothing compared to the killer perks. The nerf to killer perks are unusable whilst survivors can use them without a hassle and CoH is better than ever before.
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You know what else is always going to be a problem camping🙂
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I've always had a problem with exhaustion perks giving you free distance, so sb, lithe, overcome, and only sometimes dh and balanced landing. I don't know why free distance is so ok while "free" health states that aren't free are the end of the world. That being said, this post becomes very ignorant very quickly lmao.
"Dead Hard is still used ever therefore it wasn't nerfed hard enough" why does it need to be nerfed until it's not used ever? We don't need to further add to the already massive list of useless perks.
"Killers have to find replacements" Ok, not really the end of the world since corrupt deadlock and no way out were already fantastic and still are.
"Survivors get a slap on the wrist" What are you talking about? Dead Hard COH and medkits all getting significant nerfs is a "slap on the wrist?"
"SWF are now abusing COH instantly healing each other to full health" Cry about it? It's altruism, but I guess you'd prefer if survivors could only heal themselves. And yeah, anything is abuse as long as it's swf ig lol.
"Dead Hard is still prevalent since they are adapting to it" Maybe you should try adapting to it too, that is a massive skill issue honestly
"They managed to make COH stronger" Lmao, simply
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this is so nonsense. what made coh op was the fact you could have basically a free med kit in any situation in which a totem was present. dh has so many requirements on it now and can only be used a handful of times per game tops at the most.
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Pretty sure I've seen you comment this on other posts. Stop with the over exaggeration lmao
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Are we seriously complaining about Lithe, Head-On, Smash Hit, Background Player, Balanced Landing, Overcome, DH and SB.
You cannot honestly think these perks are a problem.
Haven't seen a successful DH since the patch. CoH is kinda bad now, people may not have figured out how to use it.
PR is extremely good. But yes, Overbrine was rightfully annihilated.
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This. Its very clearly a 'this is frustrating for killers' rather than 'is this actually unbalanced'.
Temper tantrums, emotions & ego. There's only a handful of people on this forum I'd say that are actually able to take a neutral stance and analyze things from both sides.
Good players who main killer and were winning 90% or more of their matches aren't the ones flocking to the forums/reddit to cry or rant about a perk they deem OP. The not-so-good ones that have inflated egos do that.
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Imagine starting a discussion with "Regardless what your opinion is... "
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Just to chime in real quick, both the Killer perks and Survivor perks that we've toned down in the past few updates have seen a decline in usage rate, as intended. It's not just Killers who stop using a perk when it's nerfed, Survivors do the same. It might be harder to tell since you're the only Killer in your match, but there are still many who continue running those perks.
Beyond that, I will just say that you haven't explained why you consider them a problem (or why they will always be a problem), so it's very difficult to have any sort of constructive conversation about it.
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Talk ur talk peanits 🔥🗣️
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6.7.0 CoH < 6.6.0 CoH and its obvious
with new CoH 2+people need to group up and place a boon and then heal which means 2+ people are not on gens in the mean time. old CoH required only one person to get in the boon and heal for 6 seconds longer than a usual heal
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The main issue is that dead hard was supposed to have been nerfed in the 1st meta shakeup, and we had a few weeks where I didn't see it much at all, and then it went back to being the #1 exhaustion perk in my games, by a huge margin. And nothing was done about it, and everyone had to wait a year for the 2nd meta shakeup.
And now dead hard was nerfed again during the 2nd meta shakeup, but we aren't sure if this will be the same situation, where after a few weeks, the dead hard usage might rise again. And this is a major concern, because if the dead hard usage rises again, will anything be done about it, or will everyone need to wait a year for the 3rd meta shakeup?
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your comment should be pinned to the top
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Dead Hard was nerfed in the first meta shakeup.
Also, your evidence is completely anecdotal. We don't know how often DH was used post meta shakeup, I think.
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Dead Hard went from being the #1 exhaustion perk, to being the #1 exhaustion perk. That's hardly meaningful, and the perk just replaced one awful problem (invulnerable dash) with another awful problem (endurance that tanks a hit and gives a speed burst).
Which exhaustion perk do you think, a month ago, was more popular than dead hard? Are you really trying to tell us that maybe lithe was more popular, and there's just no way on earth to know because we don't have official stats?
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You think DH was buffed during 6.1.0? Really, are you sure that's what you want to go with?
I also didn't say that I didn't think you were correct. I said that you were basing your arguments of off completely anecdotal evidence.
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That a Perk is used much after a Nerf does not mean it was not nerfed, lol.
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1) I'm saying the DH nerf wasn't a meaningful nerf, if the perk goes from the #1 exhaustion perk, to the #1 exhaustion perk.
2) So you're basically saying DH was most likely the most popular exhaustion perk, but you're just arguing for the sake of arguing? Do you think truth only exists if people can prove it?
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I'm saying that if you are using a figure as the main backing point for your argument, you'd better be able to prove it.
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No. That isn't required. The original statement was said to a dev, and the devs have access to the data.
Besides, this isn't anything that people (besides you) even argue about. Dead hard was the most popular exhaustion perk in my games by a lot, and I'm sure that at the mid to high MMR range, it was definitively the most popular exhaustion perk. Unless you want to provide a counter argument, by claiming some other exhaustion perk was more popular, then you're not even attempting to make a good faith argument.
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Except DH, exhaustion is well designed with Exhaustion mechanic locked behind them, forcing a survivor can only use 1 perk in a match.
It should be the same to Gen slowdown. I dont mind if a Gen perk is strong (not old Eruption strong), but killers just putting 4 slowdown should not be a thing.
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You still aren't explaining why a perk being used is a bad thing. Asking for a perk to be nerfed just so you have an easier time is not a good reason. Does the nerfed DH substantially draw out chases still? No, it can't even be used on the first chase.
What is 'game breaking' about the current state of DH?
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The actual effect of DH is exactly the same as it used to be. It can draw out chases exactly the same as it could before, whenever a survivor has a DH activation available.
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I mean gen speeds are already bad enough and exhaustion is a contributing factor to that,
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Exhaustion perks are definitely not a problem, they serve to give survivors some distance when chased... to help the survivor... like any perk in the game... Any perk and every perk is to help out the side you're playing, whether to make up for your mistake or help to reach your objective. Exhaustion perks are here to stay, they aren't a problem, and never will be a problem. Dead hard itself was a problem when you could dead hard for distance which they then nerfed.
You also didn't mention at all how or why they are a problem. Probably because they aren't and you just don't like them for whatever reason.
If you don't like exhaustion, there are perks for that, addons on certain killers for that, or you can put up with the mechanic that has been in the game for years that I see no one else complain about since y'know... its not a problem.
Killers have their strong perks, and survivors have their strong perks, it be like that.
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We always love the logic of "perks are supposed to help therefore this is fine" lmaoo
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Let me put it like this: If all exhaustion perks got nerfed to only have 0.5 seconds of speed increase and you had 3 games where that was enough to extend the chase to another loop, you'd be here complaining about how overpowered that was and how problematic that is for the game.
It's not. It's 0.5 seconds of speed. Just because the perks can find success in the moments they're meant to shine doesn't mean they're problematic. It just means you got frustrated because you thought you had it but the enemy team had tools you didn't account for.
0.5 seconds DH was already at the brink of being unusable, that's why they had to nerf it in some other way. It's not because it's OP, because for every one successful DH, there's a 10 minute compilation video of failed dead hards. It's entirely because of player frustration, because it obviously feels bad thinking you won the chase only to see it extended for a bit longer.
If they were to entirely remove exhaustion perks, I can guarantee you something else would take its place, most likely anything that increases gen speeds, and you'd be back here complaining about how problematic it is that, regardless of survivors lasting 15 seconds on a chase, generators taking 15, 20 seconds less is the most toxic, problematic thing in this game and that you miss the chase meta.
Balancing a multiplayer game is a neverending nightmare.
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Your use of dogmatism isn't a good faith argument.
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I have always thought that SB should have a longer than 40s exhaustion just because it is braindead free for doing braindead gens, this has always been my thoughts on the perk though, long before the DH nerf was ever even originally considered.
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So you can say whatever you want and paint it as undisputable fact whilst never offering any proof?
I'll have to try that out.
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I mean realistically the average game was 2dh, 1lithe and 1 sprint burst in solos. You went and watched any streamer on either side and you could easily see how prevalent the perk was. If it was a swf 4 dh wasn't that uncommon either. There are no stats to back up these statements but no one has real access to stats in this game outside of nitelight. At the end of the day though we all know blight and nurse are the two best killers and we all knew dh was the most used exhaustion perk. The given stats about kill rates would indicate blight and nurse are not the best killers, but common sense and experience would tell you that's wrong.
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I'll never complain about any of the current exaustion perks after the dh nerf i am finally satisfied.
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Are official stats the only proof you would accept?
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Do you have any other ideas in mind?
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Which exhaustion perk do you think was the most popular last month?
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That's not my contention.
My contention is about you offering no proof of what actually is and then BASING an entire argument around it.
It'd be one thing if you had just said, "Well, I don't like how DH was reworked, so I would like it to be looked at again."
Instead, you disputed the fact that it was nerfed in the first place and when pressed on it, you tried to use completely anecdotal data to back it up. You can't just say, "Well, you know, I saw it a lot so it's true."
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My contention is you demand proof, but the only proof you would accept is something only the devs can provide.
Arguing with you is just so …..boring.
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This is the issue. Most players on here are so tribal for one side or other. I play both rolls and try to be objective. I suggest things that I feel would be truly balanced for both roles.
I often wonder how many DH hating killer mains have actually tried to use dead hard in game as a survivor. I always see the "guaranteed 3rd health state" line thrown around a lot and DH is not that, not by a long shot.
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For solo survivors, boon of healing became useless, so it did very much changed for them. Thus, at least parts of your statements are wrong.
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