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Gen Rush / Tunneling
I have an idea how gen rush and tunneling no longer exist.
How it would be more relaxed and fun again for both sides in the game.
Here my suggestion:
What would you think If survivor got a Gen repair nerf for every hook stage they have in total.
That means per hook = minus 3 % Gen repair speed for each survivor. Stackable.
Lets say two survivors hung twice that would be minus 12 %.
If all survivors hung twice that means minus 24 % repair speed.
But If the killer tunnel or one survivor died the other survivor would get 10 % repeair speed and also stackable.
Since it would be a massive buff for killer, at least I think so and killer like blight and nurse are already too strong. It shouldn't apply to these two killer.
Also perks like tanataphobie need then a rework to keep it balanced.
I think alot more player would give more attention to weak killer
Killer and survivor would have fun again. It would also require more teamwork from the survivors.
What do you think about this Idea??
Comments
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The rewards is too low for not tunnel.
People might keep tunnel to keep up the gen speed.
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I have few notes about your suggestion:
- We cant single out specific killers to a buff or a nerf. ( thats a whole topic on its own )
- We cant touch the gen progression speed. It is the boring part about the game ( by making it longer we will miss the goal you are trying to achieve which is having fun -chase is fun-)
- Simply adress BNP, toolboxes gen speed and prove thyself ( while keeping an eye on the meta dominating the game - cant nerf a side whithout balancing the other )
- Think of ways people will abuse any buff or nerf ( sadly you can make a good change intended for people with a good sense of sportmanship, but end up being a perfect tool for breaking another side of the game for others )
- Encouragement is better than punishement ( make survivor wanna be chased -example of ingame rewards like banners they mentioned or Bps...ect- currently survivors have no reason to favor having fun chases over just being efficient and surviving. same goes for killers trying to achieve multiple hook stages instead of just getting 4 kills)
In general, i love the direction your suggestion is headed. i just worry about the implementation.
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Hey that's my idea, I made like 4 posts on this forum about this. And about this: This is a good idea only if you make it work for every single survivior. I try to explain myself better:
Surv A is hooked one time: only surv A will have a penality of 10% in repairing and healing (healing becuase I made a whole concept on how I will rework base mechanics in the game). If surv A is hooked twice, the penality become 20%. This will only affect surv A, if the killer wants to give this effect to another surv, the killer must hook also surv B, C and D at least one time. Also, this mechanic is reduced while working with other survs, for example if you work with at least one other surv, this penalty is reduced by 5%.
This will counter tunneling because a killer will think "Oh, if I tunnel surv A out I get one kill, but all gens pop because all other survs are at 100% efficiency". At the same time, in mid game if a killer managed to get more than 2 hooks, he put himself in a good time, because survs are slower and need to cooperate to escape. At the same time, Devs can play around this mechanic, for example they can rework prove thyself in this way (I call this mechanic "Mood"):
"When you work with other survs, your Mood penalty is reduced by 3/5/8%". In my opinion, this will be balanced because survs can't get free gen speed out of nothing and, at the same time, they're rewarded for working together.
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Mh......
If that would be not enough for killer then and sorry to say that but I think then killer just use gen rush as an excuse for tunnel.
Maybe you just don't want that survivor have any fun.
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You are right.
Would of course have to be refined and perfected.
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I didnt know that you had this Idea already, sorry.
Your Idea sounds for me better, very good.
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The reward to go for 8 hooks before kill must be equal to tunnel a survivor early.
Your idea doesnt fix the problem of first chase can cost 2-3 Gens. And doesnt fix the problem that 4 survivors are too strong while 3 survivors are too weak.
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I was just kidding haha, no problem.
Thank you, I like to feel that my ideas are appreciated
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The idea fix the problem if you work around perks to play with the idea. Obviously the idea alone don't do much, but if you rework prove thyself, rework bnp, nerf toolboxes, well in that case the mechanic is healthy and useful.
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I can"t imagine having gens being 24% slower, (and obviously that's without any regression perk) being any kind of fun for survivors. I'm pretty sure in this scenario survivors would try to get tunneled lol.
You can't really punish gen rushing & tunneling, bc they're simply the most efficient strategy for each sides to win, it'd be weird to punish people because "oh no you're doing gens / killing survivors too fast, here's a penalty for winning too quickly". The only thing BHVR can do is make other strategies more viable (and good luck with that tbh), or make a big change, like implementing an other objective for survivors to do each time a new survivor is hooked, that way survivors need to leave their gens and killers will be rewarded for hooking different survivors.
Sitting on gens is already boring enough as it is, if you make them take longer when someone is hooked survivors are simply going to try and do them even more quickly and try to get them done before anyone is hooked.
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Stacking up to 24% debuff on a survivor (and 96% for the whole team) doesnt encourage enough for killer when getting 1 out make it 100% debuff. And 3 survivors without debuff is already too weak. At any case, the idea is only favor to killers.
Its simple that make 4 survivors that as weak as 3; but 3 survivors as strong as 4. Then it will be obvious that killer would not want to get 1 survivor out early when the other 3 still have 3 hook stages. But prefer to go 8 hooks before the first kill, so when 3 remaining survivors become stronger, they only have 1 hook stage left.
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So, let me see if I understand, your idea is to reduce 4 survs strenght and to buff 3 survs strenght right? So nothing change, because survs can still get infinite gen speed from toolboxes, bnp and prove thyself.
Adding a new mechanic like this would make the game a lot fresher, as finally both survivors and killers can focus on the fun thing about the game: the chase. If you're good in chase, you can keep the killer and you don't get penalized for playing bad, but at the same time if you're bad in chase, you get penalized in everything else.
The idea of my mechanic (I called it Mood) is made to punish errors in game for both sides: if a killer makes a mistake in chase he is already penalized, but now if he do a perfect chase, the killer don't get almost anything in bonus. Instead, with my mechanic (with also a lot of rework to perks and add ons), the killer can hook a survivor, leave the hook (camping fixed) and he already have his prize: 10% penality on repairing and healing for that surv. At the same time, the killer can search the next victim and, even if the surv on the hook gets saved, the killer would not choose to tunnel because he would prefer to have more survs penalized. Also, as I said in a previous comment, my idea of the "Mood" mechanic is that: survs penality after a hook is 10%, after 2 hooks is 20%, if he works with another surv the penality is reduced by 5% (10% if it's 20%).
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It won't work for most killers, at least not the crying ones
They talk about gen rushing because they lose their gens before hooking the first survivor
What I noticed recently is by the time the killer hooks one survivor it already lost 1~2 gens, so they rather keep by the hook camping to tunnel them.
It's not only a problem of design, but also a mentality problem: most killers don't bother playing the game anymore, it doesn't matter how many buffs you give them or how many Dead Hards they nerf, it won't change anything, there's always gonna be a problem.
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What I think is 4 survivors have 25% debuff (yes, more than to your 8 hooks stack debuff idea, without a single hook), which each of them have 75% Gen strength. But 3 survivors have 150%, and 2 have 300%.
So as long as you keep 4 survivors alive and go for 8 hooks, they always have 75% strength.
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It comes back to Gen efficiency...
15% is base if more then 1 Survivor is working on a Gen
Plus it sounds like Dying Light but without the Obsession getting 33% faster heals
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So you're idea is that a killer can get max two kill because buffing gen speed to 150% for every surv is pure madness. Buffing gen speed to 50% for every surv means that a surv can make a gen alone in 45 seconds, considering prove thyself and other things is madness. Maybe I'm missing something, so if I'm missing something correct me, but if I understand correctly you're idea is to double gen speed for every surv with every kill, so a killer can have max 2 kill because after the first kill gen will be too fast.
Instead, my idea is to start normally, and punishing survs for getting caught in chase, also considering that I'm imagining how to rework some perks for both killer and surv to fit with my idea.
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Thats the point, you have to aim for 8 hooks before kill so survivors cant take advantage of losing a survivor buff.
3 survivors remaining. 1 on hook, 1 go unhook, 1 inchase. In order to progress Gen at that time. The other 2 survivors can ignore healing to do Gen. Means they are easy down to their last hook.
I guess what youre thinking is 1 survivors death and other 3 still be healthy and have 3 hooks left? But isnt it tunneling?
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Ok so we are thinking the same thing, but with two different ideas. My idea is to give survs penalty for getting caught in chase, your idea is to buff gen speed as soon as someone dies. The real problem with your idea is that 150% is too much, because a surv alone can halve the time of a gen and considering that they're doing this already, considering a buff of this tipe without considering reworks for toolboxes, prove and bnp is madness. I made a post in the section "Feedback and suggestion" where I show how my idea should work and how I would rework some perks for both killer and surv to play around this mechanic.
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Uhh,i have to ask you,how often do you play killer?
Killer right now needs to tunnel to get a chance for winning.
A stackable debuff 3% per hook doing literally nothing.
Tunnel make a 25% debuff to the survivor team when killer got 3 hooks.
What does the stackable debuff did?9%?
And even we don't compare the debuff with tunnel,3% itself is already useless, people don't use drying light for a reason.
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"Dying Light" did this
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