Dead by Daylight beat every other game in the genre

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Piruluk
Piruluk Member Posts: 995

VHS announced ("known as dbd killer lol") shutdown after 10 months since released as EA(playerbase didn't reach over 100 since months, as of yesterday only 32 players as peak player count), and changed peer to peer, completely shutting down in September.

F13 will get completely removed from all store, and at the end of 2024 completely shutdown, it was way popular even without support than VHS, yesterday (600 peak player count)

Last Year relaunch failed, after only few weeks the player count went from 1340 to 175 peak player count, probably will be shutdown soon.

Home Sweet Home Online got delayed for weeks, the interest seems to be very low, about 500 players or so and rapidly dropping due to delay.

Evil dead the game also failed on steam went from 500 players to 67 peak players count, and basically confirmed through reports that there won't be made any new content for the game.

Propnight is barely alive at max 500 players at any given day.

Basically dbd has no competition at all, it seems to be the only game in the genre which works longterm.

Any attempt to overtake is waste of time and money.

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Comments

  • Piruluk
    Piruluk Member Posts: 995
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    Old gen consoles won't get crossplay though, ps4 only can play with ps4 players, same for XB1 only vs XB1.

    Only new gen consoles and PC will have crossplay. Thats quite big blow since 66% of console users still on old gen. Only about 33% has ps5 or the new xbox.

    Also game locked to single license, while they can make originals it will limit them badly

  • BarnesFlam
    BarnesFlam Member Posts: 654
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    We got confimration that the Evil Dead game won't get any more content? What a shame, it was good.

  • fulltonon
    fulltonon Member Posts: 5,762
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    Is it something depressing or is it something feasible? I don't know.

  • SleepyLunatic
    SleepyLunatic Member Posts: 360
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    In all fairness, you cannot compare the devs there.

    BHVR atleast tries to deliver quality while Pokemon.. wel.

  • Piruluk
    Piruluk Member Posts: 995
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    They might release one demon, and one survivor, but those were already done on release day, but got cut out for unknown reasons.

    One thing is sure, no more new content is made from this point on, at best balance changes or fixes might happen but aren't guaranteed

  • MikaelaWantsYourBoon
    MikaelaWantsYourBoon Member Posts: 6,564
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    My hype was so high for TCM. But PS4 and Xbox One players are not included for cross-play which killed all my hype. Because 2 of my friends are PS4 players and i can't play with them. There is no point to buy this game for me anymore, it's sad because game was so fun on test.

  • GoodBoyKaru
    GoodBoyKaru Member Posts: 22,621
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  • tippy2k2
    tippy2k2 Member Posts: 5,049
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    The only one to truly be able to slay DBD is likely BHVR

    It's very unlikely a competitor would ever be able to dethrone it by itself with the huge advantages DBD has by being so established.

    That's not to say there can't be good games with a similar concept coexisting with DBD, they just need to come out the gate strong.

  • MrMori
    MrMori Member Posts: 1,217
    edited June 2023
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    I think DBD would be a better game if it had actual competition.

    As for the others, Propnight is still kicking it with a consistent 500ish playerbase, which is honestly not bad. It's a bit stale though, and they're just adding new maps every now and then, but I'm happy it exists. Fills a small niche.

    What happened to VHS is a travesty, it had glaring flaws since beta and they never improved the core gameplay past lame bandaid fixes. It was quite fun, but it both lacked depth, while also being unfriendly to new players, so it couldn't retain an actual playerbase.

    They had almost 5000 players at Steam launch, ALL gone in the span of a single year. It's such a shame because all they had to do was experiment with some huge gameplay changes, dare to shake their game around a bit. The presentation was already there.

    But they didn't even try. Healthbars instead of health states? New monster abilities that take skill to master? A more "shooter" like gameplay loop? Any major changes at all? Nope, why even try. Just shut it down, I guess. What an absolute waste.

    At least the Texas Chainsaw Massacre game looks fun. Made by the F13 devs too. I think it'll stick around.

    But these games aren't an attempt to "overtake" DBD. They're all vastly different gameplay wise and aesthetically, but all of them are assym slasher type games. These games died by their own hand. They just didn't have the staying power needed to thrive.

    Look at Identity V, that's a game you can more directly compare to DBD.

  • Nazzzak
    Nazzzak Member Posts: 4,731
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    I gotta say, the weirdest for me was playing against Sadako on Toba's Landing. Sadako on an alien planet. I was so amused.

  • Marc_go_solo
    Marc_go_solo Member Posts: 4,894
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    DBD will always be top in the genre. It's got the licences, diversity and it works well. It's a great game which - admittedly - has had some huge missteps at times. However, on the whole it's clearly a good game.

  • brokedownpalace
    brokedownpalace Member Posts: 8,759
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    Dead by daylight is the champ

    That said, I'm super excited for TCM and will likely get it day 1

  • I_am_Negan
    I_am_Negan Member Posts: 3,756
    edited June 2023
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    Why does it always have to be competition?

    I mean it would be nice to have other games in the same genre to play then just one.

    F13 only fell because it got pulled into the lawsuit otherwise it would be neck and neck with DBD.

    Evil Dead , Resident Evil Resistance fell because the competitiveness took over pushing out the new, average, casual and players that wanted to play for fun.

    The only way TCM will survivor is if the DEVs think of all their players and not just the try-hards pushing it to be the next sweat-fest in gaming but, only time will tell.

    Post edited by I_am_Negan on
  • NotAnotherDoctor
    NotAnotherDoctor Member Posts: 288
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    To be honest I don't think a lot of these games are trying to compete with DBD. Games like Friday the 13th, Evil Dead and the upcoming Texas Chainsaw Massacre game are their own little thing.

    For VHS, I think they were just vibing and having fun making something goofy and entertaining and the dbd community labelled them "the dbd killer" and that's a lot of pressure for a new game with a small team and no liscencing agreements

  • CorvusCorax86
    CorvusCorax86 Member Posts: 1,060
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    I would compare it to World of Warcraft.

    The game is nearing 20 years of age and it is estimated that roughly 1 million people log in daily (!).

    Other games tried to dethrone it but never managed to do so. Those successful in the world of MMORPGs can mainly attribute their success to the lore they have (e.g. Knights of The Old Republic).

    As for OP: This is very said. I think healthy competition could only make DbD better. VHS I wanted to try (checked a couple of gameplay vids by Otz and it looked interesting) and Evil Dead I have on Epic but it is said to be very toxic...

  • SleepyLunatic
    SleepyLunatic Member Posts: 360
    edited June 2023
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    I think all of the named games would have had way better chances if there was a console port with crossplay. Would have made it way more accesible and would also have increased the playercount by ALOT.

  • edgarpoop
    edgarpoop Member Posts: 8,067
    edited June 2023
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    VHS leadership chose the wrong direction at just about every fork in the road. Hellbent Games was VHS's worst enemy, not DbD.

    Never listened to most players, only to toxic positive streamers who wanted to be Rewinders. After well over a year of Monster feedback, they introduced....M1'ing vending machines.

    Continued to roll out beta keys while doing nothing to address the LOUD Monster feedback because it wasn't coming from streamers. Completely ignored security to the point that their game was taken down for months by script kiddies. Then LAUNCHED EARLY ACCESS. All while releasing paid cosmetics and founders packs.

    Like...you could not pitch that in a script. The studio would say that level of stupidity isn't realistic and tell you to write a more realistic antagonist.

  • Krazzik
    Krazzik Member Posts: 2,303
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    They should but they wont because devoting even one chapter to instead focus on balancing and game health will cost em a bunch of money. QoL improvements isn't something they can sell. It may help bring some players back or retain some that would otherwise leave but a new chapter does that AND makes them money.

  • luvcraft
    luvcraft Member Posts: 1,230
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    You forgot "Secret Neighbor", the Hello Neighbor DBD.

  • Malkhrim
    Malkhrim Member Posts: 935
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    Isn't Identity V only as it is because it has been authorized by BHVR, tho? I tried it out years ago, and imitated DbD in almost every aspect.

  • HansLollos2
    HansLollos2 Member Posts: 145
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    DbD is the "Super Smash Bros" of Horror Franchises, that's why the game is by far the post popular one. Crossover Games that are not limited to one Franchise or one Company are always doing well. We got Franchises come together in Scenarios that would otherwise never happend without DbD.

    Michael Myers chasing Chris from Resident Evil while Silent Hills Cheryl Mason is working on a Gen together with Bill from Left 4 Dead. And suddenly Ash Williams sprints and takes a Hit to save Chris. And all of that takes place on a Alien Planet.

    And DbD manages to make it kinda come well together. Characters are portrayed like they are in their respective Franchises, tons of Details and Love for Fans and the Scenario/DbD-Lore how everyone ended up in these Scenarios makes sense and is interesting. And the Original non-licensed Content is great and interesting for the most Part.

    Also Character Customisation is always great and the Gameplay is solid and makes mostly fun of course ;)

  • nars
    nars Member Posts: 1,124
    edited June 2023
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    BRING BACK VHS THAT GAME WAS ACTUALLY FUN


    ...when the queues werent insane.

  • Smoe
    Smoe Member Posts: 2,527
    edited June 2023
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    Netease got permission from bhvr to borrow elements from dbd to use in Identity V, which Bhvr also helped them make, in fact i think that might have been what lead to their dbd mobile partnership later on.

  • Dreamnomad
    Dreamnomad Member Posts: 3,667
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    I disagree with the statement that Friday the 13th would be neck and neck with DBD if it wasn't for the lawsuit. I played the game. It was fun and different but it had real issues in terms of balance, replayability and fun. The thing I thought that was particularly cool about it was the environmental kills. I wish DBD would take a page out of their book and introduce environmental kills to DBD.

    Picture the following: map is Lery's Memorial Institute. Killer has a survivor on death hook and the survivor is in the dying state. If that survivor is hooked then they are dead. Why not have a location like the center of the map where the killer can carry the survivor and instead of hooking them the killer gets to do some special kill where they hook the survivor up to a chair and the survivor is simultaneously electrocuted and injected with chemicals. Map specific kills would be so cool.

  • Malkhrim
    Malkhrim Member Posts: 935
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    Honestly, I enjoyed Friday the 13th for some time, but I think it was the most overrated of all asymetric games. Both sides had broken stuff with no real counter that were extremely frustrating to the other side. If a counselor was alone, Jason could suddenly just appear behind them by phasing and instantly kill them. If at least two or three counselors were together, they could just stun-lock him over and over, and the stun times were painfully long. If they got the mask and the sweater, there was absolutely no reason to keep playing as Jason, as there was no way of approaching a group of them without getting killed, unless they messed up big time.

    When it came to fun, the map was so big it often took a long time until you interacted with someone else as counselor. You could spend a whole game without meeting Jason sometimes. Stealth was almost non-existent: Jason could see anyone's aura. If they were inside a house, hiding under a bed or inside a wardrobe was a death sentence, so people rarely did it and instead just chose to stun Jason and run. Jason himself was too slow to sneak up on anyone even with his stealth ability active, so he would just phase in people's faces instead. The mechanics for fighting were clunky as hell, as it depended on shifting to a "combat state" to even be able to block, but it also locked your camera on a target and made you unable to do other actions, like grabing as Jason.

    Beside all of that, the game was a buggy mess back then. I've seen counselors walking high in the air, Jason becoming completely unable to attack, counselor's combat mode locking on other counselors instead of Jason, commands not working properly and making you do things you wasn't trying to do (like jumping through a closed window when you were trying to open it) and many other stuff that would get in the way of your fun.

    Also, it was more expensive than DbD (unless you bought every chapter DLC, of course. Still, the price to just get the game was higher).

    However, I agree that environmental kills were cool. I also liked that counselors had voice lines that made them look like characters on an horror movie, like when they found someone else's corpse. I'm glad that this intention to build a movie-like atmosphere carried over to Texas Chainsaw Massacre. It's being made by the same devs, but it's better than F13th in every way.

  • BlightedDolphin
    BlightedDolphin Member Posts: 1,676
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    I feel like one major reason these games fail and Dead By Daylight didn’t is the that, as fair as I can tell, all those games allow the survivor role to fight back. And usually this led to the killer role being miserable to play while the survivors felt more powerful than the killer which lead to the killer being having to hide more than the survivors to avoid being stun locked for ages. The player base dies because queue times are skewed in an already small player base.

    Then they either completely ignore this and let the game die or go overboard on killer buffs and make them overpowered, making the survivor role miserable and then the game dies.

    F13 might have lived had it not been for the lawsuit, but even they followed this formula.

    DBD was very survivor sided when it released, but the lack of ability to fight back and stun locks didn’t make you feel so completely powerless and all the overpowered stuff did eventually get nerfed without them making killers broken. Sure it’s not a balanced game, but they didn’t flip-flop between balancing and are actually making some effort to balance it and keep it fun.

    Texas Chainsaw Massacre has potential to be really good, but people have already figured out a way to stun lock the killer for like 30 seconds.

  • Blinckx
    Blinckx Member Posts: 426
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    Exactly, in the end Friday the 13th turned out in "Let's Kill Jason" , people were loggin in just to hunt down Jason instead of..well..trying to escape and survive

  • GentlemanFridge
    GentlemanFridge Member Posts: 5,371
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    I think people are vastly underestimating how DbD pulls off replayability and… playabity in itself. Or to be more precise, how others didn’t. Whether it be by luck or design genius, DbD simply has the best gameplay loop.

    DbD has randomised maps. No single map is the exact same every match. Pallets and windows in different locations, entire buildings are turned to a different angle, totems being random, etc.. Only RPD is largely static, and even then there’s two variations.

    VHS in particular had completely static maps. Stations in the same place, windows in the same place, etc. Once you learn it, there’s nothing to surprise you. The chases play out the same way every time. That gets dull.

    I haven’t really paid attention to how F13 does it, but I believe its maps are fairly static as well. Loot is randomised, which helps, but the layout is the same.

    VHS had immense accessibility issues. Both in the physical accessibility sense, as well as just getting into it. Thanks to the excessively long closed beta, people got too good at the game, which put off new players who just didn’t stand the slightest chance. Granted, DbD has this too, but VHS became inaccessible before it even hit EA, whereas DbD allowed itself to establish a healthy playerbase post-release before it became harder to get into.

    F13 also had the issue of counselors just being eliminated on the spot, out of nowhere. Thematically cool, but it does get dull rather quickly, imo. Kill animations can only go so far in making it less annoying that you don’t even get to play 3/4th of the match. I’m concerned TCM is going to suffer from this too.

    Evil Dead also has static maps, and massive ones at that. But the objectives are randomised. Being an Epic Games exclusive and having very little in the way of word-of-mouth marketing greatly stunted its early growth, though.

    As did the fact that, ultimately, it’s limited to a niche license. F13 had this issue as well, and I reckon TCM will too. TCM is creating their own characters, at least.

  • DrDucky
    DrDucky Member Posts: 675
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    "Any attempt to overtake is a waste of time and money" Not true, people have to try and something will eventually take off we just dont know what yet or how long it will be.

  • Phyrqc
    Phyrqc Member Posts: 77
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    Licenses alone never carried a game in the long term and never will.

  • I_am_Negan
    I_am_Negan Member Posts: 3,756
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    Not only environmental kills, but four different type of moris they can choose from.

    True the game did have problems, but if it didn't get pulled into the lawsuit there could of been a lot of improvements 2018 to 2023 there was a lot that could of been done in that time.

    Plus there was talk of another game mode too.

  • egg_
    egg_ Member Posts: 1,933
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    Remember when events would unlock areas to explore and a little lore that lead to legendaries, instead of handing you the pokemon itself with zero effort? </3

  • AetherBytes
    AetherBytes Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 2,994
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    I wouldnt say its because DbD is good. It's because game companies no longer really give a ######### and just ride whatever the current bandwagon is. They hype to get sales, then dump the game immedietly (except VHS, who, and i can attest to this, has been plagued with hacklers attacking the company and game relentlessly. Not cheaters, actual hackers attempting to damage the game, company, and image.)

    DbD just happens to come from an era where this didn't happen, meaning the base is actually pretty good. As you can see tho, new releases have been following the "Hype, get sales, ignore" trend.

  • thrawn3054
    thrawn3054 Member Posts: 5,897
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    Me and a couple of friends did that for a while. I'd say we racked up kills into the triple digits. That said a competent Jason could easily defeat most kill squads.

  • VoidOfMe
    VoidOfMe Member Posts: 416
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    that game is expensive as hell here in Brazil at least here I don't think it will succeed.

    Here DBD costs R$ 49,99 (19,99 this week)

    TCSM will cost: R$ 107,99

    The situation is even worse in the PStore: R$ 199,50

    An unimaginable price.

  • Smoe
    Smoe Member Posts: 2,527
    edited June 2023
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    I doubt F13 would have been neck to neck with DBD considering that even without the lawsuit, it's player count never really came close to be near or even match dbd's own regular numbers throughout the game's entire lifetime.

  • I_am_Negan
    I_am_Negan Member Posts: 3,756
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    There was other players playing then just PC. On PlayStation it was very much alive.

    Plus DBD only increased in players because of the lawsuit I'm one of them. I had no intentions on playing DBD back then.

  • Smoe
    Smoe Member Posts: 2,527
    edited June 2023
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    We don't really know the console numbers, so those don't really matter since they're unavailable to us, however if they're anything similar to the numbers seen for pc, then it wouldn't make any difference.

    Also i'm fairly certain that even without the lawsuit, dbd's numbers would have risen regardless judging by the numbers some of the past chapters pulled in.

  • I_am_Negan
    I_am_Negan Member Posts: 3,756
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    Again if the lawsuit never happened the game would of improved.

    Console players do matter I'm not getting sucked into an arguing with a DBD white knight.

    Later

  • edgarpoop
    edgarpoop Member Posts: 8,067
    edited June 2023
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    I don't know that survivors fighting back is necessarily the issue.

    VHS's glaring issue was that Monster was spectacularly boring and pigeon-holed into an overly passive and defensive playstyle. It caused matches to drag on forever. DbD has the same issue with 3 gen killers. The genre should never cater to defensive playstyles IMO. Monster abilities were almost entirely passive and cut and paste with each other. The gameplay revolved around waiting at cover and cycling cooldowns for a single M1. Almost no mechanical skill expression on the Monster side. I thought it was cool that survivors had weapons. I just wished Monster amounted to more than kiting someone around a pillar until I could press E to activate armor.

  • Hexonthebeach
    Hexonthebeach Member Posts: 354
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    Here is the next on the list:

    Level Zero Beta release is this year, maybe. 2 killer vs 4 survivor in space.