I Think DBD As A Casual Game Is Dead
Not much to this.
I don't think the game can be played at an average casual level anymore. I don't think you can really come home from a long day at work and play a couple of games on either role without the game being more trouble than it's worth.
Whether it's problematic Killer designs that are unfun to play against (Legion and Twins), overtuned characters (Blight and Nurse), Skull Merchant or even just the Killer being outright better than you, the casual Survivor experience is bad.
Whether it's teams that force you to play tactically and try hard, people who abuse certain bugs, people who just like to be frustrating (Boil Over) or just plain good teams; the causal Killer experience isn't much better.
I think that should change for both roles. I don't think you should need to sink 6 hours into a play session whilst being hyper-aware and uber competitive in order to have a chance to have fun.
Comments
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The root is just about camping, tunneling, gen rushing. As long as those still stay in game, there will be unfun matches.
And Im sure they're just gonna soften it somehow (as they did with extra 50sec Gen, basekit BT and the future self unhook), because people create discussions and increase interaction when they have something to complain, not when satisfied.
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Wouldn't jump off the deep end just yet. Lately I have seen causal players (or more accurately an newish person play causally while I watch and laugh at what they do) while myself can enjoy either role for the most part and im probably not super high on the totem pole. Honestly the only thing really hurting the game is how people tend to play. Sweating to fill a pool to being needlessly an ***, none of that is particularly the devs/game's fault.
We do agree though that it should change. Why try and be uber competitive in a party game? Its stupid.
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What boggles my mind is how they insist on sbmm that is a trainwreck.
How can I go against either inexperienced killers over and over and over or killers with 10k hours as just as much without any mix between two. It just goes on and on and on and on.
It is pure hell for everyone except maybe people who live this game 24/7.
Everyone else is just a fodder for them.
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I don't think they want the game to be what it was in the past. Sadly old dbd is gone and this current form seems to be what is staying. Thankfully TCM is what old dbd felt like so it's nice that it is coming out this month.
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The bottom line is that this is a community-driven problem.
Everyone wants an easy, chill game, but also want to win. How do you accomplish that in a PVP game?
Play against people severely under your skill level.
Meaning, if they put a ranked mode in nobody would use it because people don't actually want appropriate MMR based on how people complain they go against Tryhards every other game. So the people that sweat will always be mixed in with the casuals because they don't want to go against other sweats, so the casuals will continue to be punching bags for content.
Harder games means less 5-gen chases, less 4ks, less flex-able moments overall. The current community is way too competitive for it to ever work.
All the devs can do is either rework the game's objectives overall (sacrifices/gens being replaced.) Put a PVE mode in, or continue to put carrots on sticks everywhere to prevent people from playing efficiently (gen-rushing, tunneling, etc.)
I'd say we're a ways away from the current game-state tanking the population of players though.
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Not dead but certainly dying, though I'm not sure what they can do about this. It's easy enough to play casual if you don't care about losing, but too many people have high expectations and BHVR can't manage peoples expectations for them. For the health and longevity of the game, BHVR need to attract and retain new players, and I dont think they'll be as successful in doing so if it becomes too competitive. I've said before that certain competitive tactics or behaviour in general don't bother me personally, but I can recognize easily enough that it can be detrimental to the game as a whole.
Older players are important too of course, but the longer someone plays a game, the higher the likelihood of them getting bored or burned out and taking extended breaks. Or even outright quitting. And new players need to fill that void. I suppose maybe they can look again into matchmaking a bit better? Match the sweats with the sweats, match the new players with other new players, and make it harder to lobby shop for a start. Everyone feels the waves of the latter at some point, but newer players cop the brunt of it.
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I agree. Killer is nothing but sweat squads. Map design is awful and hold W strat is unbeatable. Gens are too easy and I honestly feel like survivor currently requires so little skill to play. I'm a killer main but have played both pretty equally over the last year or so. It's so easy to do gens and gen rush killers. I don't even go into games with the intention of gen rushing killers it's just so easy do.
I also hate the entitlement and toxicity of this community. I just played a game with Blight and got cooked and all I get is the "ggez, ur trash" and stuff like that. Like no one has any respect anymore.
I am a P100 Blight but I'm by no means a "God Tier" Blight. I just really like the killer and on a good day I can be decent with him. People just seem to forget that prestige level and skill level are not the same thing. Not everyone is trying to be an expert killer in this game. Some people just want to have some chill games. I honestly wish there was a way to hide your prestige level in the endgame screen. People will always judge you poorly if you're a high prestige killer and play awful.
Something needs to change. I feel killer is so much harder now than it was a couple of years ago.
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The game has been so optimized at this point that its just how most people play.
Unless there is a split mode between comp and quickplay, i dont see it ever changing.
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"Everyone wants an easy, chill game, but also wants to win."
That's it. This is pretty much the answer to this post. That mentality is what drives a large amount of the player base.
I started playing over 2 years ago now and I didn't really feel like survivors were chilling while I was purely a killer main(until 6.1.0). For the first 6 months playing I know I never chilled. Then patch after patch both sides "good players" lost their tools and had to actually try hard to get their wins.
While I got over it long ago, I think killers from that time never did and use everything left that's strong to win, excluding actual killers although that does happen.
Tbf I have seen many more casual players since 6.1.0 and even more so as time has gone on.
So yeah, the community really has pushed this game into it's current state.
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There’s no one else to blame but this atrocious community. I’ve never seen so much people itching for ways to ruin someones’ experience. And it’s getting to a point to where it’s affecting the games health and reputation.
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My point was not that the game is dead or dying, but rather that the casual aspect of the game is gone, likely for good.
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Ya know Pulsar.. We disagree quite often, but you my friend have hit the nail directly on the head. DBD is certainly not a game you can just, as some devs have said in interviews of the past, "Jump in and have fun".. The new player experience is...I hate to say...abysmal.. New players are what the game should be shooting for and thriving off of. Overtime turning them into fans that come back not just because of another Chapter but day after day because of the fun experience they had. Yet everything just keeps getting more convoluted and degenerate.
I'm not sure how a brand new person is suppose to stick with an experience where such dirty and imbalanced things can happen on each side. Not to mention the amount of time you have to put in just to be a decent Survivor and not get stomped repeatedly seems to be too considerable for most. Even as Killer, beating those brand new Survivors a few times, you suddenly get tossed into a REAL DEAL group of even just a few decent Survivors and get rag dolled like you're nothing which completely turns the POWER ROLE idea on its head especially for newer people who just want to be immersed..
There are far too many strategies that Killers can use to make the new Survivor experience not pleasant even down to the way some of the Killers are designed at the very core of their power.. (Knight...Skull Merchant..and even Hag) Why can Killers tunnel off hook? Why can they even use their power right next to the hook? Leatherface has made many people I know actually stop playing due to that basement BS.. Seeing that through a new persons perspective would make more people understand those things don't make you want to come back especially if its your very first game..
Some of the basic principles that went into making DBD just don't work for casual people nowadays. Even on the Killer side.. Why does Trapper have to spend the whole first part of the game picking up his power...when Pig starts with hers by default? Just to be different? Hmm. There are many confusing questions that we will never know the answer to, but hearing you say that makes me realize that no matter how much the fan base might disagree with one another. This side. That side. Whatever. I think we can all agree. Some things. No. MANY things in this game don't feel "fun". They feel cheap or even underhanded. I don't think that is what the devs want, but here we are.. And where do we go from here. I have no idea. I just hope the game gets better someway..somehow..
Oh yeah..there are a few Killers that can't use their power next to hook are there not? O.o Twins can't and there might be a few more that I'm not thinking of.. That'd really put a damper on some degenerate strategies if Leatherface is next to the basement with a hooked Survivor and can't even click M2.. xD
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I mean casuals are needed to sustain the meat grinder, if the casual aspect is dead it will start a decline that is faster than what's natural.
Less casuals playing = more sweaty games = more sweaty people stop playing, to put it in simplified terms.
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No you should never be shooting for the new player experience in anything but an actual coop party game. DBD is not that and hasn't been since before I started playing. This game has a learning curve early on(especially for survivors) but if you go even a little out of your way to watch content and learn you can get up to a decent standard quick.
When a multiplayer pvp game doesn't have some catering towards players who know what they are doing, it dies. Simply.
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For as much crap the devs get, this is on the players. Too many players obsessed with winning and too many players obsessed with making their opponents experience miserable
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I beg to differ. I say if you had something in the DBD new Survivor experience as easy as Candy Crush that also progressed the game state toward the Survivors winning (something much easier than hitting Generator skill checks) I think the game would flourish even more. Due to it being simple AND addictive. What would they add to get this result you ask? Well that's what they are getting paid to figure out. An experience like PVP Candy Crush is what we are shooting for. DBD lacks that "something" that feels fun to do. Its obvious that Generators are not THAT THING for the newer people. Hell, they like hiding in corners more than doing Generators.
Maybe just make a separate mode called "HIDE AND SEEK" and new people would be all about it. The average new player to a video game doesn't look up and watch as much as we might assume they do. A lot of the time, people hear about the game, so they grab it once its at a low price and try it out without watching anything at all, yet still knowing the gist of the experience. Unfortunately, DBD at its core requires that you have someone literally 1 on 1 guiding you if you want the best results, which really shouldn't be the case if we want to be as popular as Candy Crush..
I'm not really saying DBD needs to be like Candy Crush.. I'm saying it needs SOMETHING in the experience that is even easier to do for new people than what is currently available to do and also has that addictive feel to it. Something you cannot put down if you wanted to.. I don't think learning how to do specific vaults, trying to get good skill checks (let alone greats), and having to figure out what perks, offerings, and killer powers even are is what is going to keep the new folks. The devs have to go in a different direction, while keeping the game true to its core. Like I said, how they figure that out is up to them.
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in my eyes, at the end of the game, it's the reward of a match that counts and there is a huge problem with the design of dead by daylight.
From a suvivor's point of view, if you don't play optimally, you are often punished four times in a single game for dying.
- The first punishment is you die. You are out of the game. No respawn, simply nothing. No way to comeback or do anything other than start a new game. frustrating if you thought it was a nice match.
- The second punishment is the amount of bloodpoints you get. If you die early, the amount is just ridiculously small. The current event shows again how ridiculously often the blood points are in relation to getting an invitation in the bloodweb. Have you ever looked for a purple flashlight?
- The third punishment is you may lose a PIP. The killer wants you out at the start of the game? You can run him for 5 gens and then die while die gates are open and you lose a PIP because you never healed someone or touched a gen. For the other players you are the match hero but the game punish you for it.
- The fourth punishment is your MMR goes down. That means your team member gets worse in the future, you will lose even more.
The same applies to the killer, albeit differently. killer mains may explain this better than me
So is it a community problem or a problem that BHVR brought us? I think it's a problem that the developer created and doesn't understand himself.
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So like any other pvp game without any working fork of ELO based matchmaking in casual queue?
The ever increasing optimization of efficiency by the player is a natural process that comes to most humans. Back in the day it was comparing strategies during school yard talk and in gaming magazines but nowadays with the huge exchange of information via internet and even moreso by YouTube, optimizing the living crap out of games is frighteningly fast.
DbDs biggest problem with this is that casual player get fee to the optimizing players due to the nearly non existent matchmaking that throws everything into a blender.
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I mean the devs make every decision at the end of the day. They have to do their best to know when to IGNORE the community..and when to listen. I agree that de-pipping shouldn't exist. It is extremely demoralizing especially if you did quite a bit of work to get those pips only to have them instantly gone just because of a few unlucky mishaps or what not. Higher MMR Killers that go against lower MMR groups also have it rough, because if they finish the Survivors off too quickly...the Killer de-pips for that.... W....T....F..?! O.o Extreme efficiency in that scenario equals you get punished... Makes no sense..
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Yes, you definitely have a far different opinion than me. Getting in to survivor is hard in terms of dbd, but not compared to other games. You don't need someone to 1 on 1 coach you, just watch a few youtube videos and figure it out. Then learn by trial and error. Watch 1 otz video, play 10 killer games and then start playing survivor. People just don't want to learn.
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This. A lot of games feel like a punishment for your efforts.
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Good post.
The devs can post their nice little “we gave you some data” threads all they want across social media to pretend there’s good communication between them and the player base. What people want once and for all is a definitive answer on matchmaking and our individual MMR ratings. This will never happen of course because it’s clearly a poopshow, but until this issue is resolved the casual experience will continue to be eroded in this game. Why? Because the matchmaking can’t be trusted to not force you to sweat.
I ran a meme build as doctor recently. I got a 1K. Post match one of the survivors messages me and says “dude if we’d known you were running that build, we would have chilled a bit”. And this is the problem- everyone goes into DBD matches preparing for and expecting the worst.
At this point the devs have to try SOMETHING. Whether it’s a ranked mode I don’t know. But right now something new is needed. And if after that the player base still sweats it’s behind off then so be it. People looking for a more chilled experience will jump ship. But the devs have to at least try something at this point. Nic Cage brought about a few days of memeing. And then it was back to normal DBD. Alien will be the same- it’ll sell big, for a week or so it’ll be fun and interesting. Then it will be a new character falling prey to the same old gameplay problems.
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Exactly this. People wanna rag on the devs so much and I agree sometimes the devs make questionable decisions but the community is terribad you're supposed to 3 hook everyone no camping no tunneling no meta killer ok you do that oh but you had the AUDACITY to actually win so you're gonna be called toxic etc etc but if you dont win? The survivors will wait out the entire egc just so you can watch them teabag this game's community is definitely half this game's problem and its partially the devs fault aswell for allowing and even encouraging this behaviour through streamers
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You're not completely wrong. The game has become way more competitive than it used to. But it's not quite so bad that you can't sit back and enjoy the game anymore. There are a lot of casual players out there and we're not going anywhere.
It would be nice though, if they introduced a different game mode for everyone, who doesn't feel like sweating in their games. Something chaotic, utterly unbalanced and completely ridiculous. Like for example a game mode where after every gen your perks switch randomly. Maybe even the killer switches.
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You can't play casually as killer. You have to work and sweat for wins, especially with B tier or below killers.
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It doesnt work. People who want to do everything possible to win can play "quickplay". People wants easy game to win, thats the problem.
MMR in theory is great, if you try hard to win, you should be matched against equal try hard opponent, or at least people who are better but not try hard. Its only MMR can go all over the place somehow that match you against far better or worse opponent.
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Not sure there's much you could realistically do to change it at this point. It's just a symptom of the game having been out for 7 years. The cat is out of the bag, y'know.
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I have over 2k hours behind me and have been playing since before day 1.
I used to love the game, in spite of the millions of bugs (some of which are still present...). I started as a killer to understand the mechanics and then switched to survivor as at the end of the day, I prefer to play with people than against.
I just logged in again to check Nicolas cage out and the game is even worth than it was a couple of months ago.
Bugs are bugs and balancing takes time, and I'm ok with that.
My issues are with the people.
I have played 3 games today. Not only do I play with total noobs, which is not super fun, but if the killer is half decent, they get crushed and give up, suicide or whatever toxic rage behaviour you can think of and I end up in 1v1 with 3 gens to go.
Worst game I had today was 2 suicides and 1 bot.
Bots are new to me and the only upside I could see is that they don't DC.
I don't care about winning, I just want to see my mates try to do gens or good chases or nice coop actions, playing with torchlights and lockers/pallets. A good game to me is where survs manage a bit of chases, some doing gens in the meantime, some helping during the gen. Killer gets 1-4 kills that they had to fight for and we actually had a sweat.
At high level, facecamp is not really an issue, tunnelling still is but can be fought against.
A lot of this could be solved with a better matchmaking.
I don't want to farm my way up from ash if I have been rank 1 for the last 3 years. It's just boring and kills the game for me. I don't have that kind of time anymore.
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that's just not true, of course you can have troubles while playing against team, 99% of time i can win with tunneling and camping
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1 sentence summary: SBMM = ranked, Rank/Grade based matchmaking = casual, and the swap deleted the casual gameplay to focus on sweating.
I think the largest problem is how we lost 'casual' mode when they implemented 'SBMM/MMR'. Now we only play in ranked mode. I could sit in Red Ranks as Killer before, and 2 hook tango (or hook each Survivor twice, then let them go for the 20k Survival BP at that time) without risk of changing my matchups. Sadly, now I am forced to kill any baby Surv I happen to run across because the matchmaking punishes both of us if I don't. The baby Surv gets higher MMR to a level they aren't ready for, and I would get punished with more baby Surv matches.
Also when the matchmaking was influenced by rank, people tried to balance their gameplay (they didn't always, but I've had all too many Killers in post-game chat say I did X to pip/kill). If I gen before healing, I don't get Benevolent points. If I 1 hook kill 3 people, I don't get Devout or Chaser points, due to the lack of chases and hook actions. Camping penalizes Chaser, so you can't pip. If a Survivor hides, they can't get Evader points (I mean technically you can, but you get 1 point a second hiding compared to 1-250 points a second in chase, since you need 880 points for Iridescent, that's nearly 15 minutes of hiding in TR). Every common complaint is addressed by the Emblem system. Now it isn't perfect, as you can be 'chased' by Wraith and Sadako, but you don't get Chaser points, among other flaws. That just means the exceptions to the rule should be ironed out, not simply throwing the baby out with the bathwater. Instead, when it is simplified down to the raw Kill/Escape, we lose all of that nuance, and get camping/tunneling/hiding/sweating across all too many matches.
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It is more the community than anything else. Many players in the community claim that they want to chill and just have fun, but on the other hand they want to win every single game. I have seen Streamers get REALLY upset when they dont win a game, even if they win around 98% of their games.
And then the same people claim that they are "forced" to play a certain way to win or to have fun. Nope, they are not forced, they want to play that way. I mean, I play Wesker the same for a long time - Nowhere to Hide, Lethal Pursuer, Brutal Strength, Dissolution. And I have fun. Do I win every game? Hell, no. Would I win more games if I would play 4 Slowdowns? For sure. Would I have less fun? For sure as well.
But I cannot complain that I dont 4K every game if I run a build which is weaker than stacking 4 Slowdowns. And if I stack 4 Slowdowns, I should not say that the game forces me to do that.
And then you have stuff like Killers slugging for the 4K and Survivors trying to get everyone out. And both sides are upset when it does not work. I mean, if you play Killer and the Survivors barely get 1 Gen and you just downed the third guy, two already dead... Just hook them. You won. You dominated them. No need to waste time, no need to make it even more unfun for the guy on the ground. Same as Survivor - you got 3 people out, one person is camped. Just leave. You won this game. You dont need a 4 man escape. And IF you try to rescue, dont be upset if it does not work and the Killer gets more Kills. (e.g. yesterday, game against Deathslinger... He facecamps my SWF-Mate (1st Hook he got), then the two randoms trade... In the end, 1 random on the Hook, all Gens are done. second Random gets downed via NOED and the person on the Hook was REALLY upset with us leaving... Dont be that guy, really)
For some reason, this community is unable to accept that they cannot win every game. And on top of that, they are unable to accept that it might have been their fault that they did not win. Instead, everything is blamed on the other side. And it is just sickening.
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This was always going to be the outcome. Both sides cannot win and chill at the same time. Add to that the constant BM by both sides and that creates a natural deterrent to trying to play nice for most people so you then create an arms race for both sides to optimize their play as much as possible.
It has gotten to the point I am playing against SWFs using clock callouts and comp strats more and more often. Now this is perfectly okay with me as I'm competitive by nature and enjoy outsmarting good teams but for your average DBD player who only plays 2-3 games a day if that is even I imagine they feel they're in a war zone with a water gun.
Ultimately I don't see this as a problem as I feel if you really wanna chill then there's plenty of really really good PvE games for those people to play. I'm not saying that to be disrespectful mind you, some of my favorite games are PvE (Metroid Prime, Okami, Persona 4) so it's a serious suggestion. Because PvP games are always going to be competitive by their nature and that's okay.
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I think you are projecting a bit here
Playing a couple of games after work to have fun is exactly how i play for years now.
Are you sure it isn't you focussing so heavilly on the competitive side that you forgot what fun is?
DbD is as competitive as you want it to be.
If you need to sink 6 hyperfocussed hours to have fun doesn't that raise the question if you aren't trying to force something to be fun that just isn't to you anymore.
I feel that this is a personal problem. For how meme-y "play civ" is. I think you probably would benifit off playing something else for a while
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Make a casual mode.
- No SWF
- No Nurse/Blight
- Heavy protection against tunneling, slugging, and camping
- Only brown items and addons
- No exhaustion or regression perks
- No map offerings allowed
- Fully anonymous where you load into the game immediately. No post game chat either.
I think it would work if done correctly.
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I wouldn't say every game is super competetive.
But it is a shot in the dark if the few games you will have are going to be enjoyable.
Sometimes i can get a few games that are cool, but then something happens that lowers my mood and i just have to close the game.
I do feel like my patience to deal with those kinds of games is shorter, i am not sure if it is a me problem or the bad gaems are more common
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Totally agree with what was said.
The matchmaking need some serious changes as it seems it doesn't work properly.
Most of the time, in my solo queue game experience, it's either stomp or be stomped on both side (like most of the time, it's 4 k at 5 or 4 gens for the killer, or he gets two hooks the entire game... and sometimes DC). I really don't care if i win or lose, i just want fair and tense matches. Or fun matches if it's possible. Those are so rare that i only play for the rift now. I really like the game but i don't want to sweat each time i log in. That"s why i don't play killer anymore. As a survivor, I want to use meme perks and still have a chance to not be out of the match in the first minutes. I want to see more different killers too. The lack of variety of the killer I face despite the roster is mind blowing.
However, I don't think two separate queue will help, it will divide the playerbase and try hards from both sides will queue in the casual to stomp the non competitive killer or survivor.
PS : sorry if my english is bad.
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The game certainly feels more sweaty than what it has used to be in the past, but you're the problem by having such a mindset, if you ask me. Now, I don't mean to complain about your take or to call you out for it, but how do you expect yourself having fun, if you're already subconsciously having thoughts along the lines of „I have to sweat if I start to feel like I'm no longer winning“, or „If others sweat, so will I.“, because that's just you projecting your thoughts and forcing others to adapt to that, you know?
Sure, you do barely see survivors running without items and using all sorts of perk varieties within your matches as a veteran, but that doesn't really mean anything. I do consider myself to be a casual-competitive player, leaning heavily towards the casual side because I do know what being competitive is, and how unfun that is when it comes to gaming.. Unless I'm already better than over ~80% of the entire playerbase to guarantee myself the dopamine boost and satisfaction from winning every single match.. With ease.. And, so I treat the game casually, while the younger audience with tons of energy left because they're not going outside (mostly applying to students and people without a job) still has tons of energy and can easily dominate me by playing better than me, because I'm past my prime gaming years already.
You shouldn't be like that. You should have thoughts along the lines, like „Why shall I sweat? Go ahead, I'll play my own game!“, and even though this kind of attitude more or less guarantees you losing your matches, that's not really gonna be a problematic thing for you, until you get used to losing. You can't win without losing beforehand, but you do have to learn „how to lose“ to know how to learn from losing and not having it get to your ego.
Be yourself, play your own game at your own pace. Don't care about what others think, but don't have the mindset of wanting to be the same as them.. Because that only results in you encountering such players more and more frequently due to having nearly the same attitude and playstyle as a result, and never ever making it any better for yourself. Do know your limits, and do know how to get into the MMR you do wanna be in.. With other casual players - That's not gonna happen until you start playing like them, though, and that means many times putting yourself at a disadvantage, because the result will be all the more satisfying and worth it.. Or, at least, shall.
I'm still having fun playing the game.. But if I feel powerless as a killer, I just dedicate myself to that one chase or area to guard, and see what they can do about it. If I lose four generators per a single hook, that's fine by me.. I mean, I've caught a really difficult prey to catch, so I've won in my book despite losing by the game's mechanics. Silly me, but it works. I am satisfied, and it works in my favour.
In order to proceed, you do have to start with yourself, see your own faults and acknowledge them. It doesn't matter how silly or absurd it sounds to you. It's not like we can peek into your mind and know your thoughts, so whether it's embarrassing from your own point of view or not is irrelevant, and it shouldn't matter because it's all in your own head. Nobody's gonna make fun out of you and your thoughts, you do have peace and all the time in the world that you dedicate to it to know what to do and how to enjoy videogames like back in the day.. Or so I'd say.
If you do disagree with any of my takes, that's fine by me. I don't expect myself to know everyone the best, and I don't expect you to agree with everything I'm claiming just because .. Of whatever reason you can think of. I'm wrong about something, that's for sure, but I'm not wrong about everything.
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The only way casual mode would work is if you losing or winning didn't count towards anything other than getting bloodpoints.
Because of the fact that now if you lose too many games in a row you get stuck in mmr-hell and get teammates that are all Blendettes or Dwights who hide in lockers. This forces you to try-hard and win, so that you get matched with people that are actually on your level as much as that's possible what with how sbmm works 😅
Either that or the "winning" objectives of this game need to change as a whole.
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I don't think it's true I was watching a 10k hours killer main on twitch yesterday this guy has 100+ wins 2 lose atm, another has a 500+ winstreak apparently, another guy is doing perkless winstreaks with all killers.. take godlike players in any other game and they don't win 100% of the time more like 60%. Even I reach iri 1 killer without trying and I'm stuck iri 4 as survivor
I sympathize with players getting bullied by "sweat squads" but it doesn't happen very often most games are pretty chill as killer, for me solo Q is by far the main problem it's the most unbalanced thing i've ever played in any game, really miserable.
Imo SWF shouldn't even exist, it should be solo or duo queue MAX and then balance the game around that, if you balance for killer against 4 man swf then it's miserable for everyone else, OP is right it has become a sweat fest
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What did you expect from a game where skill is a very important part of the gameplay? People (player base) are getting better on both sides, I notice that too.
Gens of 70 seconds were not even close to as fast as today's 90 sec gens. And that's why I've only been playing for chases lately, I'm tired of sweating every game.
And it is absolutely normal that new players need to spend time and effort to be a good player and enjoy the game.
Imagine you spent 10k hours and you go against a player with 100 hours and you have about the same chances of winning, simply because the game is hard balanced for casual players. Who wants to spend more than 200-300 hours in such a game if there is nothing to strive for and the skill does not matter? The meaning of PVP mode is in its competitiveness. And it's strange to me that many people try to pretend that this is not the case and this game is just about pressing buttons. M1 simulator vs W simulator. Nah it's not, and i glad for it.
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I don't think the game can be played at an average casual level anymore. I don't think you can really come home from a long day at work and play a couple of games on either role without the game being more trouble than it's worth.
I can.
I think this says more about your attitude than the state of the game.
If you only gain satisfaction from winning, then you're not always going to enjoy yourself, and frankly you can't claim you're looking to play casually.
My only issues are excessive lobby dodging and players who DC during loading because they didn't like the offerings. These mean it takes longer to get into a game than it does to play it.
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That's the entire point.
A 10K hour player shouldn't ever be playing against a 100 hour player and yet, that's the DBD experience.
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There are many games where if you aren't on your A-game, you will NOT have fun.
This goes for Killer and Survivor. Killer figures out you're not a crazy good looper, instantly decides they need you out of the match. Idfyou aren't on your A-game, you're gonna be out of that match in 2 minutes. If a Survivor team comes in and spawns split on 4 gens, you're gonna need to play extremely smart and sweat if you want that match to last.
Getting stomped isn't fun. One-sided matches aren't fun. That's the casual mindset.
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There's not enough new players to be casual as a game. If you measure your hours in the hundreds, much less thousands, any game will change. While I wasn't around for the 'casual' days, I think people confuse casual with new. You can't replicate that 'new' feel. Both sides, especially at anything above low MMR, know the loops, where the gens are, and basic strategy. Even if you are playing 'chill' you are going to be more optimized than when the game was anywhere close to new.
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I am still waiting for Ranked and Casual modes separation. I am competitive player and tryhard unless trying new build or new Killer (so I can tryhard them aswell). Queue time is already enough to make this step.
And there is a still option to change Matchmaking so players can search for more lobbies simultaniously (Ranked, Casual, Killer, Survivor). Could look like this:
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Mostly agree with op. - But I suppose there is no way back. DBD is fun for as long as both sides make a bunch of mistakes. Making mistakes is what makes the game fun. Playing suboptimally is what creates enough room for fun. The trajectory, however, is to optimise. And it seems that's not gonna stop anytime soon. ---- That being said, I do think there are still opportunities for both sides to bring fun into an otherwise unfun match. It's a mix of mindset and loadout. And it's imperative that you don't care the slightest bit about the objective.
Post edited by Halloulle on1 -
No. Developers raise the community. Developers choose boundaries. They choose what exactly the player is rewarded or punished for. You are blaming child instead of parents.
For example. The longer you are in trial, the more BP you get. Also there is no real danger when you are at exit gates or standing on a hatch. So waiting for Killer to come and teabag him only rewards the survivors. Whos fault is that?
EDIT: blaming person for what he/she didn't say because I read it wrong.
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Thats literally what I said read the rest of it
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But Pulsar has a point. Because of the way the MMR system is designed and how the meta forced both sides over the last year to play as efficient as posible, OR ELSE, we optimised the fun out of this game in one year faster and more thoroughly then ever before. The MMR system was the beginning, adaptation to needed changed like 6.1 and regression nerfs the current conclusion. Without any systems in place to allow the losing side to catch up, the more efficient side will always win, and after losing a couple of times in a row, both sides chill players omight turn sweat lords. I know that I did.
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Sorry, you are right. My bad
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