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Why all the Ultimate Weapon hate?
I've seen alot of posts about this recently and I feel like people completely forget that similar tracking perks are already in the game. Spies from the shadows for example constantly gives info, doesn't alert the survivor their position is given away and has consistent range, no matter the killer's terror radius. It's ALSO countered by calm spirit, just like Ultimate Weapon is. Why is UW considered OP and broken on Nurse/Blight, while no one bats an eye at Spies? I'm just finding it weird at this point.
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Because Spies from the Shadow doesn't reveal your exact location like UW does...?
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Are you saying that cuz it only reveals the location of the bird right next to you rather than you? Is a killer going to miss YOU being a meter away from the bird?
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Spies triggers 36meters away and around the survivor so you have to use your brain and logic to figure out where the survivor is if they're not in the open. UW is more like I opened a locker so now I know exactly where you are LOL.
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UW reveals your exact position, interrupts any action and is the only tracking perk that isn't countered by lockers.
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Firstly, unless they fixed them, crow spawns are pretty garbage. Not gonna lie.
Secondly, Spies does a pretty terrible job of being an info perk. It almost never goes off on a Survivor you didn't already know was there.
UW on the other hand very much looks like it would enable Nurse or Blight to just buzz gens and instantly know if somebody's there because it's reliable in a way that Spies simply isn't.
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This is like saying MFT isn't a problem because Dark Theory exists. You know the answer why Spies isn't a problem and UW is, let's not act naive.
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You really wrong if you compare Spies from Shadow with Ultimate Weapon
- Spies From Shadow only active if survivor scare a crow, Ultimate Weapon active for 30s and range 32 meter (terror radius).
- The only thing killer need to do to activate Ultimate Weapon is open a locker and with Dredge update there a lot of locker added to the game.
- Crow usually spawn at corner map and survivor can counter it with crouch.
- Ultimate Weapon still active when survivor inside a locker
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If anything the last part is likely a bug, which should get fixed.
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30 seconds of blindness over and over again and constant screaming is not fun
but its a fair perk, i don't want it nerfed even if it screws with my baby - object of obsession
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The range thing is kinda wrong. You were right that UW is your TR, but that's not always 32 meters. You're gonna have iffy results with a stealth killer, or even just a killer like Huntress that has a small TR.
Those birds though... those go off a crap ton, lol. Try playing a game or 2 with Spies, the value is real. Yeah, your not gonna be notified of EVERY survivor around, but you can't chase in 4 separate directions anyways and the amount of notifications you'll get from Spies will be drastically more on any given match, even if you spam UW every minute.
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Those perks are in no way even similar, so that's just a horrible comparison. You've made no point.
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Are you really comparing Spies from Shadows which is dependent on crow spawns to a perk that detects all survivors in your TR for the next 30 seconds (so you can move around and find survivors)?
I think ultimate weapon having survivors scream in lockers should be changed even if the devs don't see it as a bug and it would at least have the bare min counterplay that all scream related perks have.
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No, it's been listed as "Not a Bug" on the forums.
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i know what is terror radius, most killer have 32 meter terror radius that why i use it as example.
Lol, for what reason a stealth killer use perk like Ultimate Weapon?
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Ultimate Weapon isn't a problem, well maybe the locker 'bug', but its users are the real problem. Nurse and Blight are what make UW busted, just like Starstruck before.
I don't understand why Doctor's blast (which is tied to TR) and every other scream perk is countered by lockers, but UW is designed to skip over lockers. That tells me that it is bugged, but BHVR seems to think differently.
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MFT and Dark Theory are both haste perks but there are variables that differentiate them.
Spies and UW are both info perks but there are variables that differentiate them.
Just because they're similar perks and "spies does a similar thing" doesn't mean people can't say UW is problematic. There's more to it. Your comparison was flawed and mine is flawed on purpose to show you what you sound like.
Point made.
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Yes... that's exactly what I'm saying. It's OK crowman, I'm not trying to get Spies nerfed. We can share the glory of the crows with everyone.
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Me as pig who keeps knocking people off my box with it: "yeah...what stealth killer would use that. Doesnt make sense"
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Whenever you open a Locker, Ultimate Weapon activates for 30 seconds:
Survivors entering your Terror Radius scream and reveal their location to you.
Those Survivors suffer from Blindness Status Effect for 30 seconds.
Ultimate Weapon has a cool-down of 40/35/30 seconds.
You can't be serious. This is what passes as OP nowadays?
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I'm not worried about that. Spies is a terrible perk. I just think comparing Spies to Ultimate Weapon shows a real out of touch with the actual strength of Ultimate Weapon.
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That's a very niche example you can make that's just about interrupting rather than tracking, although it does deserve a giggle.
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The only very strong thing about it ive seen is using it with dms/merciless storm for blocking gens. Maybe its good on movement killers but they could just use aura reveal. But most of the games with dms ultimate weapon merciless storm on doc still need to get the downs and stuff to make it work. Which can be difficult against some survivors.
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It's absolutely a busted perk lol
Travelling circle that makes you scream, interrupting any interactions and revealing exact locations within immediate terror radius is crazy. If a Survivor loses the Killer in a chase with clever movement, the Killer can slap open a locker and immediately relocate them, on top of stopping a gen from being completed if the Killer knows they're close to it.
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Not at all. If anything, I feel like most of the ppl trashing it haven't touched it since they've started the game, if ever. I'm saying this after using both perks.
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I guess Scene Partner is the new No Mither. 🤣
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I'll take an aura perk over a notification perk anyday everyday.
What you are describing is more likely a bug considering how Pain Resonance explosion was changed to not trigger DMS.
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Has been confirmed by the devs in the bug reporting section, that is not a bug, and is working as intended.
Basically the issues with UW are it is exceptionally easy to trigger, has no condition, and provides a lot of value for little effort with no counterplay outside if Calm Spirit: -
- It trivialises hex totem defence, so can make it obnoxiously hard to disable an important totem.
- It is extremely effective on fast mobile killers like Nurse, Blight, Wesker, etc, making it very easy to find and stick to players. They can proc it very easily with little effort, and these killers tend to be the ones that are pretty hard to lose already.
- Removes all possibilities of stealth from survivors, so allows easy control of objectives. A survivor has to go all the around your invisible bubble in an opposing direction to make it back to the gen you just kicked.
- Those same killers that are renowned for being exceptionally good in chase, now can completely remove the possibility of staying hidden as a means of avoiding these killers strong chase power.
Compare this to the other scream perks like Hex: Face the Darkness, or Infectious Fright. Can't be triggered on command, requires the killer to find a survivor and successfully land a hit/down, Hex has the possibility of being cleansed... UW is a far better scream perk.
How about against similar tracking perks? Whispers? Spies? Darkness Revealed? That's a no contest. The only advantage is Survivors know you've heard them scream, but because it's in your terror radius, you're able to capitalise anyway if you have a working pair eyes and a functioning brain.
UW is far more reliable and easy to capitalise on, and is basically a guaranteed method of forcing survivors to leave an area you want to control.
So it's similar to MFT really. No effort, has an effect that provides value in a lot of scenarios making is very versatile and useful over the course of the entire game, plenty of players leaping to its defence, and if it isn't OP it is still very annoying for the opposing side regardless.
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Bug reports about it have been closed because "not a bug" (see here: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/389872/ultimate-weapon-lets-survivors-scream-in-lockers#latest), so apparently it's an intended (and debatable) feature.
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crows are inconsistently spaced. there could be two survivors in range and 0 crows going off. And on specific maps crows are almost nonexistant. Coldwind for example has almost no crows in the corn, indoor map crows are sparce. Also, when a survivor in your TR feels that moving around would result in them being seen or leave scratch marks etc etc, they'll place stealth when they feel threatened as you are nearby. its information is also not exact and doesnt show how many survivors triggered that crow or which ones etc. Thus, not triggering crows until your are out of range. Ultimate weapon has none of these weaknesses. it relies solely on your TR and nothing on the map, making it 100% reliable. if someone is in range, you are guaranteed to know (even in a locker). Which also negates the stealth that counters spies from the shadows, because it doesnt need them to move around or do anything to reveal them. ultimate weapon is 100% accurate in its information, showing you exact locations and number of survs. an experienced player can even differentiate the screams to know whos there. A tunneler can use this information to see if its their target, someone keeping track of skill and perks can use it to decide whether committing to that chase is a good idea. It also has that 30s uptime, so even if theres nobody you want to chase in range or nobody at all you can move a total of around 150m across the map to find people. it also applies blindness, which can hurt solos a lot. Even worse though is that since it applies blindness, when you find someone you want to commit to their WoO will be deactivated giving them a dead perk for the next 30s and you an edge. granted, it has its 30s cooldown, but since yu will be using it to find and chase survivors that 30s is effectively meaningless since it will go away while you are chasing them giving it a near 100% uptime. On a map like midwich, you can permanently apply blindness to all survivors by spamming UW. it also interrupts actions like totems and heals, so it can be very powerful for patrolling your totems and regressing healing massively with sloppy.
Sidenote: Since its tied to TR, a wesker can run UW and get some insane value. I've seen anti heal weskers use distressing, sloppy, caulrophobia and ultimate weapon to run around and prevent healing for the whole game.
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Does Scene Partner interupt actions? If not, then this is another example of the Devs saying a bug is not a bug but fix it later under the patch note's bug section.
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Nah I thought screams have always interrupted a action making you let go? Fufilling the requirement to have dms and merciless block it? Because pr was changed to interrupt you with the scream again. Blocking it with dms. So they just nerfed dms to 30 seconds from 45.
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I will just have to test it out.
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I honestly don't see this perk anywhere near problematic. Blindness isn't very strong and knowing the location of survivors is something that other perks do better in my opinion. Yes Bbq and the like have better counters like distortion or otr but still. I prefer Bbq or floods over this one. For ultimate weapon to activate, you need to open a locker. Believe it or not but that takes me out of the game flow. That why I also don't kick gens when I can chase a survivor instead. Also, I honestly know where survivors are already most of the time. I learned that by playing Pig with Stbfl only for like 20 games in a row. How do you know where survivors are? Two options : right in your face or at gens. There is rarely any exception. The only killers I could see this perk being very strong on are Pinhead and Pig to interrupt the Lament configuration or Jigsaw boxes. With the exception of nurse and blight but..... like...... you know the drill.....
Again. I dont know why this perk is seemed as problematic.
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while I agree with all your points I'd like to note that nurse has the worst map mobility in the game on outdoor maps, and thus shouldnt be factored into this debate. She benefits from ultimate weapon as much as a regular m1 killer when it comes to patrolling.. When you do the math with her fatigue, post blink window, blink duration, blink charge, and blink cooldown it rounds out to about 4.1m/s in effect. UW also doesnt really help her start a chase as well as people think. Since its a scream and not an aura, its not exact and so theres a lot of guesswork to do when blinking over and a good survivor can force the second blink there. Shes exceptionally good at covering short range distances, but long range is where she really struggles which is why playing for distance is so strong vs her.
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You scream from inside a locker
absolute joke
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UW doesn't either. You get a scream notification that goes away in a flash and gives you no info as to distance or what they're doing.
Run it with Darkness Revealed and you can see how inaccurate the scream is compared to an aura. UW just gives you a direction to run.
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honestly... gonna play a bit with spies today. just to see how good or bad it actually is
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It's for sure a power crept perk. If it was a typical BHVR perk it would only reveal on locker open, have no blindness,without a consistent TR follow effect and have a 180 second cooldown(aka trash, but most of the perks for both sides are).
It's power crept in the same nature that MFT is clearly a superior option in almost all scenarios. Yes there are specific ones we can draw up where they aren't consistently the best but in the majority of cases it's always going to be a top pick.
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I’ve personally barely seen this perk. Maybe once or twice?
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calm spirit i just beat you both
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Get Dead Man's Switch on top of that, and you have survivors having a really rough time, lol.
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