Made for This is getting a nerf soon
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This game is seven years old. By now most survivors have learned how looping works. Of course not everyone is completely immune to mind games but MFT still makes a big difference. Even just holding Shift + W and making your way over to the shack is a pretty safe option in most cases, thanks to MFT. And once you're there, its not all that difficult to loop with MFT either. Play like you normally would and MFT is still going to help you out with another loop around a pallet, the distance to make it to the window etc.
I doubt it was ping related. Everyone in that match had a good connection and that was more than a full second after they stepped into the snare. Even if the hindered status had ended right before the vault, they should not have gotten a fast vault (too little momentum).
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I would have to see it to be sure, as a fairly experienced DBD player, I'm sure you know that sometimes the game is just weird.
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How is 3% pitiful? Its not about the absolute value, its about the difference between the killer and survivor speed. Which on average is 15%. So... 3/15=1/5=20%. It might not increase chasetime by 20% in a literal sense, but mathematically speaking it does take 20% longer to reach you. Which is especially important on tight pallet loops where any non nurse/blight/spirit killer effectively plays as an m1 killer. Every killer except a select few has loops where their power is useless, and on those loops they play as an m1 killer. On your typical pallet loop, wesker cant dash, demo cant shred, billy cant saw the list goes on. and its not like the survivor needs to earn this effect, its guaranteed to happen during the second half of chase.
Thats true, the 20% number is really only perfectly accurate for m1 killers. But as I mentioned, all but the top 3 killers have certain loops where their power is just not usuable, therefore making that loop last 20% longer. I cant count the times I've been able to juice the killer out of 3 or even 4 more loops because of MFT giving me that extra time I needed. And thats at basic pallet loops where you just run in a circle, not the skilled kind of loops where theres actual mindgames and stuff involved. I simply equipped MFT and ran in a circle. Granted skilled players will dominated with MFT far more than unskilled ones, but that doesnt justify how just equpping the perk gives so much value.
List of things equpping mft gives to you for free:
- After being hit, the killer will take 7 more seconds to reach you with MFT, 18 as a 110% by walking. At least 30% of the roster is m1 killers, or killers with no method of gaining distance or enough range to ignore it. I.E. nemesis. A very strong anti loop power, but he will still need to just walk to catch up to you. meaning in those 7 seconds, you can cover and extra 28m (75m against 110%) of ground just because you equipped MFT. look at a survivor without MFT and where they went down. if theres a pallet or window within 32m, then mft would have saved them. This principle applies to anywhere and any situation where a survivor goes down. You can just take the distance between the killer and them at the start of the chase, divide it by movement speed, increase by 20%, and see if theres a tile in that distance. Just from equipping it.
- some of the strongest chase extension just from equipping it
- Causes every killer power to be far more punishing than intended
- safety on pickups on an already very powerful perk
- promotes bad play via hold W being very powerful with mft
thats all I can think of, theres probably more.
MFT isnt meant to help you break chase, it's about extending it. Really only lithe consistently breaks chase against the stronger killers. SB and BL both gain you about 6m of distance since the killer can just keep walking forward. Lithe forces them to go around an object, letting you gain massive distance. If you want that value from SB or BL you need to manage SB perfectly to trigger when they are stunned or need to walk around something, and for BL it needs to be a god pallet with a fall. MFT works the same way, its a chase extender not a chase breaker. And since its so good at extending chase a lot of killers will drop chase if they know you have mft, but since they arent told its just a guessing game.
in conclusion is not a skill issue when you can prove with math that just by equipping the perk as an average player you autmoatically get much longer chases, an improved on hit burst, extra punsihment on killer powers, and on certain loops 20% more go arounds.
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To be fair I would accept the alternative of keeping the Endurance, and swapping the haste values of MfT and Dark Theory.
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it will be useless after they rework it.
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I don't know why the released this perk without a limited time downside like Lucky Break.
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That doesn't really address the problematic aspects of the perk. I see MfT almost every game, and I can probably count the number of times I've seen endurance from it on one hand. That's not why people are running it.
"M1 killers are terrible, so they won't have to worry about a good perk" is a terrible argument. I don't know what my MMR is, but I've run into four-man SWFs all running MfT who have gotten gens done in six minutes with no slowdown perks on my part, and they're very hard to deal with. (Not impossible, but hard. I can run the most broken builds in the game, and getting a 2K is a struggle against those guys.)
I think that BHVR is currently trying to encourage some kind of "speed meta" by giving survivors a broken perk and forcing killers to deal with it somehow, but nobody's running the intended killer counter perks, because they suck. They lose stacks when you swing, require you to give up bloodlust entirely for the entire game, only activate long enough to kick a few pallets after a gen pops and you're already losing, etc.
If anything, they'll drop it to 1-2% and keep the Endurance. I also wouldn't say no to keeping it as it is, but making it a Boon totem with map-wide effects. Then it could be stacked with Dark Theory, which would be interesting and powerful, but would also make it counterable.
At any rate, I don't hate MfT half as much as I hate For the People/Buckle Up. I can deal with MfT if I absolutely have to, but that combo is broken.
Yes, but it's telling that everyone was complaining about it on the forums this time before he made the video. Usually, it'll be me and like two other people here saying that a perk is good (Eruption), and everyone will disagree with us until Otz makes a video, and then suddenly the entire forum turns into a river of flame.
So you're one of the two others, then.
Because, no, when that perk came out, everyone here dismissed it as a joke and said it was terrible and nobody should ever run it, same as they did with CoB/Overcharge.
Also, you're dead on about Self-Care. That's another perk that's actually good (at least when it gets combined with Botany and Desperate) that gets dismissed out of hand around here.
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Hey if it makes w streaks even easier its always a good thing.
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Survivors have been complaining about killers being OP for the past year and we still haven't heard anything to do with solo survivor changes.
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I mean if you are going to include 6.1.0 changes, you should include
DS: No endgame, 3s stun from 5s
Self-Care: 35% from 50%
Iron Will: 75% while not exhausted (why even 75%, you can still be heard quite easy and I have hearing damage)
Calm Spirit: 30% slowdown for daring to not do gens.
DH: Free insta-win button in loops that first got nerfed to use Endurance (if the Killer isn't laggy), then got nerfed further to only work post-unhook.
CoH: Free Self-Care better than the old 50% self-care for the entire team. Dropped to We'll Make it only if a teammate is present.
Also I'd say Eruption at the fair 6% 16s Incap is only sidegraded and arguably better at 10% and 12s aura read. Everyone knows 25s Incap was ludicrous and should never have happened. Sadly the people who used that version think they are good at the game since they had "Eruption MMR Inflation", and now can't handle normal Survivors in chase, let alone MfT users.
The main problem with Survivor meta perks are pick your favorite exhaustion perk, then pick which design flaw you don't want to deal with.
Killer on the other hand has a variety of fun and usable meme builds for the most part. You can go 11 STBFL stack Clown by bringing Rapid Brutailty alongside STBFL as usual. You can bring a basic Pop/Eruption/Nowhere to Hide. You can bring Endgame pain with NOED/NWO/Remember Me and tunnel the Obsession out. You can bring facecamping Bubba with Deadlock and get a minimum 2k. You can bring the classic Enduring/Spirit Fury. You can also bring Mad Grit and your favorite combination of carry perks.
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When running a whole build around self care its straight on better than taking a medkit under every possible circumstance. The problem is it is often associated with newer players and usually one sees the average soloq member running it and making horrible use out of it and dismisses how strong being able to self heal actually is
Anyway...
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Finally! Jesus, if only you knew how unplayable Sadako feels at times because of this perk. I literally have to run PWYF + Nemesis or Game Afoot to get things done.
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I would also be okay with that
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Good. Hopefully it's a Kill All Survivors button for Killers. That almost has a chance to stop them from complaining.
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Hahahahahahaha spine chill hahahahaha
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It's more about how lunges work. Lunges work by increasing your movement speed to 6.9 m/s for 0.9 seconds. But doesn't allow for any bonus movement speeds. So a lunge max range is 6.21 meters. But, the survivors are also moving forward during that 0.9 seconds based on their movement speed, so if they are moving faster, they effectively decrease the killer's lunge range on top of also increasing the time it takes to catch up to them.
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yes. I know. m/s for survivor is cross for lunge distance and lunge speed for m1 killers. vault speed for survivor and raw m/s is other cross. strangely enough, survivor have resilience but there is no perk for killer that increases base m/s by a very small amount. either way, they're strong chasing stats that should be little careful with those.
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Precisely why i think movement speeds should be kept pretty sacred and we should stop giving ways to increase or decrease it outside of killer powers that are designed to work in that way (I.E. clown bottles), and very limited things like exhaustion perks that give a quick burst of speed.
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I use Self-Care/Overcome/Windows of Opportunity/Botany Knowledge as my main build and do very good as a solo player.
Also a pretty good build for newer players as all the perks pretty much play the game for you/enable you.
SLEF-CARE 4 LIFE
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While I agree the Endurance is overkill and should be removed, removing that and doing nothing with the speedboost will not fix the perk. No perk on either side should give a permanent, untimed speedboost as unconditionally as MFT does. Simply being injured and not exhausted is not enough of an activation requirement for a speedboost that isn't on a time limit. Maps simply aren’t designed around that, even the good ones, and the worst part is it generally hurts the weaker killers the most.
I also think Haste stacking needs to go on both sides and instead only the highest available bonus should be applied. It's only going to become more of an issue with the more perks that get added to the game over time and it would also open the door for some of the weaker Haste perks to be buffed without fear of needing to worry about balance issues with stacking.
I think the main problem is if a perk gives a movement speed boost and doesn't have a strict condition to activate and/or it isn't on a time limit. Something like Blood Pact is ok because it's hard to maintain, Machine Learning is difficult to activate and only lasts for 30 seconds, Hope is only in endgame and does nothing the majority of the match. MFT lacks any of that.
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The haste needs to go. I'm so tired of BHVR making changes to the game that make weak killers even weaker and don't even affect the strong or broken killers. Seriously, nurse, blight, and skull merchant are a problem. Stop driving the m1 killers into the ground. If you're going to hurt killers, at least focus on those 3.
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sounds boring and restricts chase builds on both sides. maybe that is good thing. not sure.
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The real blessing to any adjustment to MFT is that it will make it that much easier to pick out the speed cheats. I played against a Mikaela running made for this, and anytime she would vault or turn a corner she would cover such distance. I had "I'm all ears" equipped and watched her sprint burst away after the vault (while injured so no exhaustion perks).
It's sad and having seen videos on Youtube of streamers running the cheats and knowing press all you have to do is press"x" and you get your bonus speed.
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Be real do you think anyone actually uses MFT for endurance value when buckle up ftp exists? They run it because it extends chases quite a bit.
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Yes.
The average player will not get much value from the speed boost and they certainly won't feel it. They will feel and use the Endurance more often to go for dumb plays and get away with it.
Unlike Buckle Up FTP, MFT doesn't really prevent or delay tunneling with its effect.
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Next we can nerf the blight's Add-ons and alien's tail strike
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FWOOSH - WISH GRANTED
Blight has been confirmed to be on the block and Alien's Tail is apparently bugged/also being looked at.
These are all most likely dropping/changing in the mid-chapter.
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And hopefully they will buff Dark Theory that only gives 2%.
They need to remove the endurance effect and add a timer to the speed.
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Running the perk is value you can greed with little punishment when you get extra loops out of filler pallets for getting injured in the first place. The endurance is just the cherry on top it.
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Why are people so obsessed with buffing Dark Theory? It could be 5% haste and the perk would still be bad. Find a totem, bless the totem, pray you get chased in the boon's radius, move the boon around as the match progresses.
It just isn't worth it. The time you take to find a totem, and then bless said totem, is time spent not on a generator. In the current state of the game, survivors can scarcely afford to be wasting time not doing generators.
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Something people in this thread seem to be forgetting is that if MFT loses the haste, the perk becomes useless. We then rotate back to SB/Lithe/DH. Then those get complained about ad nauseum.
Why are people running MFT+Resilience? Because healing feels bad, and pointless. CoH gutted. Self-care nerfed. Medkits nerfed. I won't argue that CoH needed to be nerfed, because it was just way too strong with the values it had at the time. To completely gut it the way they did, however, was completely unnecessary and lazy.
The devs have made it quite clear they want to avoid stale metas, but that's what you get if you keep nerfing every strong perk into the ground. This is true for both survivors and killers.
Did Xeno really need to release with (yet another) aura reading perk? Was Rapid Brutality really the right call? Why couldn't we have seen a perk that inflicts Exhausted on a basic attack, like Sloppy does with Mangled and Hemmorhage?
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That is quite possibly the worst idea I ever heard lol just bring it down to 2% and don't make it stack with hope
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You realize that would make made for this buckle up but worst right
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That was supposed to quote something lmao
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That would literally make MFT buckle up but way worse
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I can clearly see you are a killer main
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it literally makes no sense for perks to permanentely buff survivors because they got injured... mft doesn't need to "lose the haste" it just needs to lose the permanent effect.
Give both Resi and MFT a 45s durating after being injured and they would be properly balanced perks, want the effects for next chase? you better heal up.
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Crazy thing, I propose buffs for all bad perks (that I have an idea for, Killer and Survivor) as seen here:
https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/discussion/comment/3538276#Comment_3538276
In particular I would also convert Medium vaults into Fast Vaults regardless of angle/speed with Dark Theory.
I would make it so that niche perks are stronger than generalist perks, and all other perks are brought up to roughly the level of our current Meta perks. A good example of current niche design being stronger than generalist is We'll Make It/We're Gunna Live Forever compared to Botany. One only works after hook for a time frame, another only works on slugs, then the generalist version is half the strength. Those perks, relative to each other, are excellent design.
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Us vs them, classic
Everyone who doesn't agree with you is the *other side* main
Keep it up
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No one is running it purely for the Endurance. If the average player was wanting to go for those plays they would use Buckle Up.
The only times I ever see the Endurance part activate is when it’s a good player who is playing aggressive. The “average player” never does. They are too scared to go for risky plays like that.
If the average player does use MfT, it’s probably because every content creator is spamming it and they go “oh look Ayrun says this is OP so I should use it!”
And if the average player doesn’t get value from it, what’s wrong with nerfing it then? Most players won’t notice it and the people who do don’t need it.
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But only a bad survivor would run in a straight line, and these aren't an issue at all.
When you take into account the size difference between killers and survivors on a loop, the chase time increases quite a lot.
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You haven't watched a lot of competitive matches have you?
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None where the survivors where not looping. Usually after a few hours of gameplay beginners start to do it.
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Because it encourages players to run something different, try something new.
I cannot speak for eveeyone, but I thought we DIDN'T like the stagnated meta with the same perks being meta for 7 years.
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The meta being stale isn't great, but changing the meta by introducing overpowered perks is the wrong way to change the meta.
Usually, this game's perk meta only changes when either the devs nerf the meta like they did in 6.1.0 or in 6.7.0 (Overbrine/CoH/DH nerfs), or when a new perk gets introduced that is strong enough to change the meta. Every time a new perk gets introduced that is strong enough to change the meta, more often than not that perk is overpowered. Circle of Healing did it, MFT did it, Ultimate Weapon is doing it right now.
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This is exactly it; they'll start crying about Adrenaline/Windows of Opportunity next just like when Dead Hard was nerfed and the crying switched to Lithe/Sprint Burst/Overcome.
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Let's be honest here, both sides do that. I see survivors crying over meta-killer perks just as much as killers crying over survivor perks. Then they do Nerf killer perks Survivors just move on to the next killer perk that is most used. At the end of the day both sides are not that different lol and these us vs them arguments are really getting old at this point.
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Misery Squad rising up in here, too :(
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Yet killers forget you get bloodlust literally for free. Doesn't even require a perk slot. 30s in chase without a hit have another 5%. and then 15s later here's another 5%. all the way up to the point you're 130% but survivors nope you can't have that 3% for that perk slot you've used.
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Replacing overpowered perks with other overpowered perks isn’t the way to change up the meta though.
The meta already shifted when Dead Hard was nerfed and it was fine, now it’s back to having an overpowered perk run almost every game. And Dead Hard is back in the meta again thanks to MfT so the meta feels samey again.
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