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Singularity is a failed Killer design
You ever see Hux anymore? If you ever did to begin with. The amount of effort to make him effective is off the charts, EMPs quickly undo all that effort, and don’t get me started on indoor maps.
Comments
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Hard disagree. Singu is one of the better designs they've done in the pass year.
Singu is fine outside of simply not working on some maps, It's ok for a killer to not have a large player base due to skill floor. He has an interesting, powerful ability that can be used in a few different ways. That is kept from being oppressive by being checked by EMPs.
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I think he's fine for the most part. He just needs some QoL fixes so that he doesn't feel so clunky and frustrating to play at times.
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I saw one, and he lost.
And we felt really bad for winning.
So, if the goal was to depress everyone via killer design, they nailed this one. Killer sad he lost. Survivors sad they picked on a handicapped individual
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I see him quite often, more than alot of the killer roster actually
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He's about as far from a failed killer design as you can get, unless the only marker for success you use is popularity.
He was never going to be a popular killer. Macro-heavy killers never are, let alone macro-heavy killers that are as hard to play as Singularity. Despite that, he has a strong and rewarding power that has a clear mechanical niche in terms of fun factor. He's pretty well designed, he's just very hard.
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He isn’t a failed killer design, he’s just ridiculously difficult for the average players. So while you wont see him much he is decently well designed.
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His power design is very unintuitive and easily misunderstood. But ultimately he has a high skill floor and ceiling, much like Nurse.
His survivor counter also has skill expression as well in timing and coordinating EMPs optimally. So it's easily matched across skill levels.
Apart from the fact that he's virtually unplayable on console, that's a really good design philosophy. Lower skilled Larry's won't do too well if survivors know what they're doing. Higher skilled Larry's will dominate, but higher skilled survivors will counter him more effectively.
He doesn't get played much because why put in that effort when you can just play Nurse instead?
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I have to ask... is there any killer you consider a resounding success?
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I wouldn't call it a failed concept. The idea isn't bad. But it's clear, that the power is worthless for your average player. So they will perform insanely bad and don't even know why. Because from their point of view they did everything right.
Set up a biopod, slipstream, EMP, set up biopod again, slipstream again and teleport until you get a hit. This is how I've seen many people play Singularity. And that doesn't work. Instead, you need to get rid of the EMPs outside of chase and constantly harass survivors everywhere, so that you can start a chase by teleporting. If you can do that, then you are pretty hard to play against.
But this goes beyond what you can expect from most players because it requires extremely good macro gameplay. It's just way too hard, considering that the absolute minimal effort on Blight and Nurse will already beat Singularity's performance.
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He is one of the better designed Killers in the whole Killer roaster. He is very unique and cool, his power is nothing like any other Killers.
The "problem" with him is that he is not easy, his counterplay is frustraiting to play as him and he reguires you to do lot of things fast. That means, its only problem if you are looking on popularity and selling skins for him.
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Exact issue with another game I play, the role can change games very quickly, but in the squeal the games move way to fast and the role just lost all its power. The same applies here singularity like trapper needs set up time and emps are just way to oppressive with them being infinite. The real issue with trapping killers nowadays is just how quick games go by, maybe back when the game was new and survivors tried to be stealthy they were viable, but they just aren’t anymore.
Now his power by default as some have mentioned before is actually pretty well designed and fun to use (usually)
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The amount of effort you put into him is nowhere close to the payoff you get, if I practice blight I can see my skill affecting the match, with singularity there is a cap to what you can do and that cap is mostly controlled by survivors.
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Blight is the second strongest killer in the entire game. That level of results is not required for a killer to be well designed, even in scenarios where you have to put in a lot of effort.
I disagree with that second part a lot more, too. Singularity's power is not controlled by the survivors in that way, it just has more straightforward counterplay than some other powers in the game. EMPs are good, they're not overtuned anymore.
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I was not only talking about EMPs, at its core overclock isnt the montrous power that people say warrants EMPs, I can just greed the pallet since the TP gives me a distance of separation between us. Or if I am somehow injured then MfT will make sure greeding against singularity conveys no risk at all. Overclock isnt really something to be scared of in chase its still an m1 killer just with a bit of flavour for some seconds.
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Overclock comes combined with a teleport. It makes greeding loops much riskier in short range, and makes chases start much faster if used at long range.
It's not as overwhelming as top tier powers but it is definitely a strong and useful power that warrants counterplay like the EMPs. If the EMPs didn't exist, Singularity would be monstrous.
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Clunky is an understatement. With a controller he is a nightmare to play. Pod placement is hard enough, but then looking though them with the too slow & unnatural feeling camera movement is way too rough. Then there's any leaf or branch or thin air blocking them as well. Now through in emps and frame drops, and he's just frustrating at to play.
Only Trickster is more unplayable on console.
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Unplayable on console, I regret purchasing him. Not enjoyable at all.
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Id disagree, as I said the distance the teleport gives you and the fact that overclock can just be runned around made it so the few times I have been in chase with him I have had no fear whatsoever as his power was not really a threat to me, im still in control of the chase. Different than things like xeno,nemesis, wesker, huntress and the like, where their power do have to make me pay attention in chase idk I seriously have never considered sigularity this hidden gem people talk about, he is just a glorified m1 killer that much like his peers is easy to dunk on. Mind you this comes from someone who plays him a lot, most of the as I get an overclock down I do not think "that was so skillfull from me" I think "man this survivors messed up HARD".
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when i first played hux i was in midwich and good lort after that i was extremely discouraged to use this killer. on larger outdoor maps like say, ormond or even mothers dwelling is slightly easier but yeah the fact that survivors can jsut emp all over the place and disrupt all your biopods is a little disheartening - hux buff anyone?
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Comparing him to Nurse is questionable at best.
Nurse can teleport right next a Survivor at will.
Singularity can teleport to a Survivor after marking them on camera, hoping they don’t EMP, having gain light of sight for a notable amount of time with or without the camera, at which point when you do teleport you end up in the crouched position taking time to get up and giving the Survivor significant distance.
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Imo, Singularity is one of the best designed killers in the game. All he needs is QoL changes (default to closer, fresh cameras in chase; make "camping" less punishing when using cameras; fix bad collisions eating a tag for no reason) but he's in a phenomenal spot.
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Singularity is amazing design. He is strong and very fun killer.
He is not that rare tho, i am seeing him time to time.
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I actually went against a couple meatballs yesterday. Unfortunately he suffers from survivors controlling when he gets his power, and recently every game against him has been a stomp by the survivors.
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I don't think it's a failed design at all. He can be quite fun. His power just doesn't scale well with survivor skill. You won't get very much out of the power against really skilled survivors. And some maps are pretty much unplayable.
I think the biggest reason for his lower pick rate is that there are killers who are just as difficult/more difficult that are far more rewarding against good players. At a certain point, I can just be playing Twins/Hag/Nurse/etc if I want to play a hard killer and get rewarded for playing a hard killer. Singularity is a difficult-ish killer, but you don't really get rewarded for it at all against good players. They just pre-drop or run out the Overclock duration. Why go through all the trouble to use Singu's power when I can play PH or Xeno and have a simple killer at a similar strength output?
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LMAO
😂
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Singularity is a pretty stellar design. The effort required to play Singularity well is only "off the charts" if you are a casual player that isn't looking to challenge themselves, and EMPs do not undo all of that effort. Not even indoor maps are as much of an issue for Singularity as people make them out to be.
It's obvious Singularity is not going to be a popular killer because it does require a fair bit of effort to play. Most players are casual and would rather play Legion where all you do is click M2, go fast and get free slashes, even if Singularity is much deadlier than Legion, with much more potential. Singularity requires fast, reasonably advanced decision-making and multi-tasking, as well as getting used to the mere mechanics of setting up pods, switching into and out of them, tagging survivors, teleporting to them. Even just keeping a sense for orientation with the constantly changing points of view can be challenging for people. But for players that actually look to have engaging playing experiences in their games, all of these things are a plus, and learning, getting better at and mastering a more complicated skill set is gratifying and rewarding. Once you get really good at these things, Singularity feels downright oppressive, and you will be engaging survivors so much that they won't be able to keep up with EMPs. Plus mid-chase EMPs really don't hurt much at all, re-tagging survivors is a matter of seconds for any competent Singularity. Which holds true on indoor maps as well, where you can also still use pods arounds gens.
My tip for anyone learning Singularity is to first only concentrate on chases. Don't worry about placing pods around gens and keeping tabs on them throughout the match. While that is objectively optimal gameplay, most players will just be overwhelmed with the multi-tasking aspect of keeping track of pods around the map, tagging multiple survivors, deciding who to pursue and when. It will also be much more frustrating to have pods disabled by EMPs, and if you are not yet good at these things, it will be detrimental to your performance as you will be wasting a lot of time setting up and checking on pods without it getting you much of anywhere. So for a very simple playstyle, simply commit to any chase you get until you down that survivor, only setting up pods mid-chase to tag that survivor or teleport to them if they are already tagged (if you can't teleport by simply shooting them, obviously). This will make you much better at using your ability in chase both mechanically and in terms of deciding when and where to set up pods, teach you what your ability can do, which hits you can get, giving you a sense for which chases to commit to. You will then also be much more comfortable in the future to do other things mid-chase because the chase gameplay will be much more honed in. STBFL is good for this, but Enduring plus Hubris is also a pretty good chase combo for Singularity. Zubat has played a lot of that, you might learn a thing or two if you go into his twitch VoDs.
To get more familiar and comfortable with some of the macrogame aspects of using the ability well, I would advise 3-genning. Set up your pods around 3 gens, this makes it very easy to know when to check on them, to cycle through them, to get tags and teleports, to convert them into hits, to replace pods should they get EMP'd, and just to get a lot of pressure going on the survivors without having to keep up with things across the map. A good build for this would be something like Sloppy, Eruption, Nowhere To Hide, and then either Jolt or STBFL.
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The amount of effort someone has to put into Singularity to make it work, stands in no comparison to the results.
Time is better spent mastering Nurse or Blight.
Unsurprisingly, the only ones that seem to like Singularity are Survivor mains.
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Singularity only has an initial step to take and the rest flows easily
Also if were talking about getting the most bang for your buck in terms of results, you could say the same for quite literally any killer as no one even comes close to Nurse or Blight
Sincerely, a killer main
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So i get that you are maining Singularity, yes?
Hows your kill rate compared to other killers?
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I do not main Singularity but as with every killer that releases I play them almost exclusively to get an understanding of them.
As for killrate, its nothing I keep track of since I dont see a point, but the large majority of my games I still 4k with only using Broken Security Key and Ultrasonic Sensor 99% of the time. Build is nothing crazy either, being Surge, NWY, STBFL and BBQ
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Cool
Nice to see someone else than a survivor main enjoy Singu (can i call him singu?)
I had no pleasure playing him. Tried for some time, mainly because of the archives challenge. But ended up playing him like a m1 killer that doesn´t use his power. At that point i just let it go, as its pointless to play a killer without power.
General pickrate of Singu seems extremely low. At least i have only faced 2 or 3 during the whole last chapter. It also seemed that those were players trying to finish the archives mission.
Maybe i expressed myself wrong, there probably are some people enjoying Singu. Just like there are 4 people still enjoying playing as Twins. The majority of players don´t seem to like playing as him, but like playing against him.
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Only the best people in the world can survive the Singularity. If not, don't ask killer that.
And those people are more expert against other killers and more powerful when using other killers.
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Hard to master, but if you face a Singularity, you know pretty soon if this player is experienced with Hux or not. if the player is experienced, well, have fun dealing with this.
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Larry is definitely an acquired taste, but his difficulty isn't anything crazy. Once you get over that initial step of figuring out the proper flow the only real challenge after that is managing Slipstream on Survivors.
His pickrate also seems pretty average in my experience. He's definitely no Wesker or Xeno but he's no Twins or Hag either.
I think all its going to take is 1 or a few content creators to truly show his potential and just point the playerbase in the right direction with him. I've only gone against one person that was playing Larry in the proper way and actually taught me a few things, but they weren't anything crazy, just some neat little tricks to catch people off guard.
You should really give him another shot. He's actually a really fun killer once you get the hang of him
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Low pickrate does not necessarily equal bad design. Especially when the yardstick is the DBD playerbase.
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Totally. It's like Hillbilly, you need to be extremely dedicated to the killer to do something, otherwise you won't get a single hit with your power. But with the difference that you are constantly limited by the actions of the survivors. As long as EMPs are part of this killer's power, he will never be popular.
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When did I say pick rate was the issue?
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...In the post? Your first two sentences are about how frequently you see Singularity in games.
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The Singularity has appeared a few times recently. As someone earlier mentioned here, you can quickly tell if the player is learning or has decent experience with HUX-A7-13. It's a harder killer to get used to (and certainly it does not have the ease of learning that a killer like Trapper has), but it's worth the pay-off. It depends on how much patience someone will have to learn it.
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I said the issue was his complexity which likely results in the Killer having a low pick rate.
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Right, so it's relevant to point out that having a low pickrate isn't necessarily a bad thing or indicative of poor design.
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Killer powers that are in the survivors hands completely to turn off/take away are always miserable to play against. I'm not sure why BHVR keeps treading this path when we have examples of it in the past
* plague starting off with no corrupt fountains
* twins letting survivors steal victor with no way to pull him back
Emps are one of the worst feeling things in the game to play against.
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I'd argue that having low floor high ceiling killers (wesker) as well as high floor astronomical ceiling killers (meatball Larry) both help to compliment each other in terms of design and if every killer was piss easy to pick up while also being strong enough to reliably and consistently 4k the game would be very boring indeed.
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both of these examples are not true.
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I would just change about EMP affect only the person using it and i would main it.When u play vs SWF they mop the floor with you as they emp its friend in chase losing progress and all fun.
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They specifically introduced changes for the above scenarios due to complaints from the playerbase over time though. Or do you think the changes should not have been made/were non-issues?
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If I'm asked to recapitulate in one word what is wrong with the Singularity, it would be overwhelming.
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Oh, I misread your post. I thought you were claiming that was still the case, my bad.
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Not to sound like a contrarian, but I'm of the opinion that Singularity is the best designed killer we have ever had, for one simple reason, he's the only killer we have that perfectly balances Micro gameplay and Macro gameplay
A lot of killers only focus on chases and getting around the map, which is the Micro part of the game, the only killers we have that focus on Macro are Trapper, Hag, and Skull Merchant, they focus on setting up a web then luring people into the web, the strategy isn't "I'm going to kill you in chase as quickly as possible", the strategy is "I'm going to force you into my web and snowball from there"
In contrast, Singularity can do both, Slipstream and Overclock are some of the most powerful powers for chasing, it completely ignores Exhaustion perks like Sprint Burst and Lithe, ignores the speed boost from injuring survivors, deletes pallets, shuts down windows, and lets you teleport across the goddamn map, however, it also requires a lot of micro-managing and setting up in order to get value from it, if you only play Singularity as a set up killer, you'll lose because you're not taking advantage of how quickly you can set up Biopods and how strong Overclock is, if you play him as only a aggressive chaser, you'll probably still lose because you're not taking advantage of the fact that Biopods are cameras that also work as in-built slowdown, their mere presence often forces survivors off of gens in order to get EMPs, and those few seconds can add up a lot
A match against a good Singularity feels like a match against Nurse if she was actually balanced, Biopods make Singularity practically omnipresent, he can ignore map resources while still having to chase normally, can teleport across the map in seconds, and ignore speed boosts, but he has to set that up beforehand AND it can be countered by EMPs
Singularity's well designed, he's oppressive, but oppressive in a way that feels fair and earned, he constantly forces survivors to be doing something, and whenever he wins, it's almost always because the Singularity pulled off the perfect balance of running you down in chase while also using the Biopods to keep you off of gens
Shame nobody plays him other then like 10 people, me included
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In terms of uniqueness, no.
Considering how uncomfortable it is to play him, popularity, hard difficulty, yes.
It doesn’t take long to realize majority of people feel disappointed when playing him first and never consider playing him anymore.
BHVR leaving him untouched just proves this killer is another Twins situation.
Of course it’s not easier than Twins even.
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