Slugging for the 4k is simply a huge waste of time
I started playing again after taking a few month break. I’ve been playing both sides and it’s crazy how common the slugging got the 4k is still. Happens almost every single game when 2 survivors are left. I’ve done it a few times on killer I’ll admit in sweaty matches and I’ve concluded it’s not worth the extra time. In my experience, it’s no fun to be slugged on the floor for 3-4 minutes at least, and it’s not fun to look for a hiding survivors for that long either. Unless you have a 4k challenge of some sorts, set your ego aside and let the gamble happen. It’s just a game and some people don’t have all day to play. The time wasted doing this adds up fast.
I personally think a remedy to this issue would be giving the slugged survivors the option to die if they’re slugged for a certain amount of time.
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The problem in my opinion is the hatch, forcing a Rng-based situation.
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People wanting a 4K isn't an ego issue, as much as everyone seems to be clinging to that notion.
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how about the hiding survivor puts their ego aside and end the game by showing themselves? iT's NoT sUrVivOrS' jOb tO gEt KilLeD bla bla bla. yea so it is the killer's job to kill as many survivors as possible.
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Indeed.
I only do it when I want the adept achievement.
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So is outstealthing for hatch.
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The unpleasantness of being slugged comes from teammates leaving us in that position. In most cases the killer goes off to hunt and it only takes seconds to pickup, unfortunately both survivors tend to be waiting the other out for that free escape.
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Lots of times that 4th kill is needed to double pip. I have been screwed countless times by this and as long as de-pipping is still a thing people are going to want their doubles when possible. I personally think removing de-pipping would lower the amount of 4k slugs.
The 4th survivor is not going to give up so why should the killer. This is just more of the "play how I want you too" mentality that this community is in love with.
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So survivors job is to offer themself to be killed?
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Yeah you are allowed to find it a waste of time and not like it...
But to someone else the extra blood points may not be a waste of time so that reason only works for your personal view and, can be requested of, but not really applied to others.
I don't think you can chalk it all down to ego either, because people like to get the kills, you get extra points for getting kills and slugging for the 4k maximizes your chance of getting the kills without having to gamble for it, so it makes perfect sense to maximize your chances if you have the option.
The time aspect, well unfortunately your personal time management is not the prerogative of others, you need to make time to play games and if you don't have time, maybe you should get other things done before gaming. Its a harsh reality but it is a fact of life, personal time management counts.
Lastly a mechanism to end bleed out timer early could be a good thing... but only if all 4 survivors were slugged with no ability to pick themselves up.
That is the scenario where there is nothing anyone can do but bleed out. If you could end it prematurely on the ground outside of that scenario then you'd just end up with people using it as another way to quit while circumventing DC penalties.
Funnily enough the 4 min timer is the solution to being slugged simply because you eventually bleed out!
The alternative is you just lie there indefinitely.
Is the timer too long? That's a different discussion. I personally don't think so.
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agreed. Here's a crazy idea for a potential solution I posted a while ago:
...although looking at that suggestion now, based on experience from both sides I think the game still gets into this problem if there are 2 survivors left even if they only need one gen, so the "whenever there are twice as many unfinished gens as survivors" part wouldn't help.
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I won’t slug for the 4k outside of adepts. It’s a waste of time for everybody, and nobody likes being slugged, including me, so I won’t do it to anybody else.
Just hook the guy and go next. “bUt tHe bLoOdPoiNtS”… going next and immediately hopping into another game is much more consistent at blood point gains than the amount of time you waste playing the 4k slug game.
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No more than its the killers job to let the 4th one get hatch. They're two sides of the same coin.
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You make a very good point about moving on being a more efficient way to earn BP's. This has to account for queue times to though, longs cues can sometimes induce me to stay in game for longer as killer.
It doesn't completely invalidate the choice to go for the 4k though as simply wanting to catch all the survivors can be motivation enough.
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If the survivors don't enjoy their own death, the killer won't enjoy the survivors' escape either. The two are interrelated. You need to keep this in mind whenever you want to request something from someone.
And if a survivor has a complaint about the killer, they can choose to play the role of the ideal killer instead of hurling hate. Of course, if the killer gets fed up with the generation speed, there is an opportunity to play the role of a survivor who doesn't touch the generator.
Based on the above, I think there is no need for the survivors to give up the generator, and I believe that the killer has earned the right to camp and tunnel. In my country, there are many people who agree with this idea, but it seems that it is different internationally.
When playing a killer, I would like them to somehow adjust the system so that if the survivor is not at fault, even if the killer is also not at fault, the killer has no chance of winning.
On the other hand, I feel that there is a need to somewhat reduce the system in which survivors are at an overwhelming disadvantage just by losing one person. I'm skeptical of BHVR's attitude of not starting in this area.
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If killers want to slug for the 4k, oh well. Stop telling killers how to play.
Do I like being slugged for a killer to get a 4k? No, not really..but guess what? It'll be over soon.
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Ungodly waste of time, but it's no surprise to come here and see cringe lords defending a mechanic that can add 4-5 minutes to a game that usually has matches lasting 5-10 or less
Game needs a bleed out faster button or basekit unbreakable
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"b-but my challenges!" yea im also sitting at the gate dropping ass because i have a challenge too bro trust.
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it's not the killer's job to give last survivor the chance to get hatch.
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Killers are totally entitled to slug for their 4K, even is the last survivor is nowhere in sight and it takes minutes to find them (and most often don't).
And I am entitled to my opinion that they're pathetic* for doing so, and expressing that opinion isn't telling anyone "how to play the game".
My attitude is that at 3K I've won, and the hatch is really nothing but a bone thrown to the last surv. No skill is required to get the hatch, and the surv doesn't have anything over you if they find it first (which is why teabagging on the hatch is even more pathetic).
Life's too short for that noise.
And to be fair, it should go without saying that survs who scum/immerse for hatch are the worst.
*except if you are doing a 4K/kill challenge and you need that last kill
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I wish to have a 1 month test without Hatch mechanic to see how much kill rate is increased. And the possibility that killers' nerf just by removing the hatch alone. There are alot more behind that one extra kill
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This is something that will 100% be patched out of the game once they figure out a good alternative. There's nobody who defends this outside of killers who are terrified of being teabagged at the hatch by some random. It's almost universally agreed upon that it's a waste of time.
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I genuinely don't care about slugging for 4k but if you remove hatch what stops the survivor from stalling forever? Maybe aura reading after 60 seconds?
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Oh well. If you're not playing killer, you can't tell killer how to play.
Killers don't like having their time wasted by Survivors who have to hang out at the gate, because you can't leave unless the killer sees you..but here we are.
Or Maybe, they're slugging you cause they wanna give you hatch.
Either way...if you don't like it, oh well..don't play. Or play and risk it.
Post edited by BoxGhost on7 -
Actually killers also demanded that in this same topic long time ago.
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Killers shouldn't tunnel, camp, slug, 3gen, commit to chases, play hit and run, play certain killers, use certain addons or try to get the best results in a match.
Can't we just let everyone play the game how they like?
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Demanded what? Hatch being removed or something to counter survivors hiding for 2 games worth of time?
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2 survivors alive hiding all the time doing nothing is also waste of time.
Don't deny both sides don't give up easily.
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I remember that killers demand to remove the hatch. As you said, survivors told that hatch doesnt solve the problem of 2 survivors hiding. Which killers demand aura.
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I dont mind the slug. Ill just hide of course until they bleed out. We can waste everyones time together.
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Overall, survivors say that slugging is waste of time, killers say that hiding is waste of time. Point is, for both the hiding survivor and killer, its not waste of time, they're still playing.
Its the slugged one that they dont play the game for 4min. These are the one that complain about the slugging part, not the hiding survivors
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improved afk crows, killers having the ability to open gate by themselves after a set time has passed (even when multiple survivors are alive), even some "sudden death" mechanic would be better than this hatch bs where both last survivor and killer are like in a 1v1 and if survivor lasts more than some amount of time they escape instantly and if get downed they get moried. dealing with situations hatch is "dealing" is so easy, they are almost non-issues.
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If you down a guy and the other survivor is right there and visible then it is more than worth it for the extra BP.
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I dont intend to remove hatch without a trade off. I just dislike the boring rng-based gameplay it provides. I prefer an action based ending to matches rather than the snooze fest we currently have.
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Tbh, I really like the feeling of stealthly finding the hatch, and stealthly to open a gate then escape.
I really miss the feeling of stealthing together with a random teammate finding the hatch with a key, especially reworked Lery when it was really dark.
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It might be fun for the survivor role, i definitely can argee on that, but for the killer role, i find it to be boring and uninteractive. But that maybe comes from the fact that end game is the first time the killer cna realistically calm down. Therefore this moment of silence seems off most of the time.
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The amount of gamers defending slugging for the 4k for no reason other than “play how you want” is wild. Y’all must never play survivor. 😂
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something of a necessary evil that just encourages eviler play.
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But slugging for the 4K isn’t about the 4th survivor; it’s the 3rd survivor who suffers, so to speak. And if a killer is slugging for a 4K they aren’t ‘letting’ a survivor have hatch.
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I don't know I don't need 4K so badly that I slug for it just wastes incredibly among of time. I kill second last and go find hatch and close it and get the 4K anyway much faster 80% of the time. Now in this situation the survivor has chance to escape it's slim but they have reason to not hide and risk killer spotting them.
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No, there are challenges where killers need X ammount of hooks, im against this for that reason alone.
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Maybe not but killer who is not entitled probably don't want to drag the game forever for what 10% better chance to 4K and end the game naturally. Now it would be much better to have in game mechanic for 2vs1 maybe hatch spawning after some time when killer is slugging for 4K so there is risk both survivors escaping.
Tcm is far superior in that regard and even when you are last victim you have still chance to escape. Being last 2 it's pretty good chance one of you make it out at least.
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Killers have the right try get a 4k just like survivors have the right 4 man out
slugging for the 4k or 99% the exit gate for last save there no difference.
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That wasn't my point. Saying the killer is being selfish but ignoring the 4th survivor hiding for 4 minutes is hypocritical. Both parties are being selfish in drawing things out, and neither side is entitled to anything over the other.
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When the killers is slugging for the 4K, he is trying to complete his objective, he is searching for the remaining survivor and patrolling the generators. There is no hatch at that point, so the survivor hidding is just refusing to progress on his current objectives, which are complete the generators and rescue his slugged teammate.
It doesn't matter that it's a lose-lose situation. So is when the killer has both gates perfectly under control, and that's why a time limit was introduced so they don't waste everyone's time.
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I think the changes to hatch really messed with this setup. Noone likes being slugged for the 4k and because unbreakable is a 1 time use there is limited things that the survivor can do since they cant kill themselves faster like they could previously. I personally agree with the idea that hatch needs to be changed to only spawn after 5 gens are complete in addition to its other requirements and end game collapse starts in the 1v1 scenario. In that same right I think when the trigger condition for low profile occurs survivors should be able to pick themselves up. I don't mind slugging for the 4k if the 4th survivor is in the killers sight BUT if they are trying to track down a 4th survivor that can be anywhere I don't see the point outside a challenge (ie adept).
The main issue see between saying its the killers objective to kill the 4th and the survivors objective to survive is that win conditions are subjective. Many people say a 3k is a win for the killer, some people consider 9 hook stages a win for the killer, some people dont consider bleed outs kills for the killer, some people consider the survivors a team and as long as 3 get out they win. Some consider survivors completely independent and as long as they personally escape they win, which means both a killer and survivor can win, some people base it solely on BP focusing on doing the most they can in the game. Its a competitive game but without a victory or loss screen. But the thing is I don't know anyone who considers an escape through hatch with a 3k a loss for killer. This is why a lot of people say its a pride thing for killer but not survivor. The survivor is still trying to escape, where the killer wins either way. And the person who has to deal with this is the person on the ground.
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Being slugged for the 4K isn't the worst thing in the world. Now, being slugged so the killer can find and close the hatch, that's petty. So is letting me bleed out for the entirety of the EGC timer.
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I mean if the endgame wasn't heavily luck based and then killer and perk dependent then yeah but I mean some killers just can't so its just begging to get a 25% chance to win in a match you should get a 4k from as a reward for good play
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I personally agree and don't do it as I'd rather just go next and get back to having actual gameplay and earn points, but don't really care if people do it.
As long as they don't do The Thing. Aka just hovering in a 10 meter radius of the slug, then getting turbo mad when the non-slugged survivor uses their brain to decide they should just stay away and they end up getting away. Slugging to buy time to look for the 4th makes sense, just sniffing a tree near the afk guy on the ground and then getting angry the other survivor didn't serve themselves up for free is just weird. If they're willing to slug for the 4th it's just straight up hypocritical to not consider the 4th might just decide to play for hatch/gates.
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