Flashlight saves take 0 skill these days

Yeah Ik they aren’t that hard but there are moments where I just get too greedy to get the save just for it to mistime like basically it renders a blind but doesn’t render a save

and I’m currently low on shards so I can’t buy the character who has the teachable and also I haven’t played in a long while but I might try out the buffed background player if it doesn’t get nerfed when I play again lol

Yeah ... with the change they did the Background Player, the saver can be litterally anywhere in the vicinity, not just around the corner. It made me consider taking Lightborn, maybe I will experiment with it for tonight. Getting downs and hooks in a timely manner already IS on a tight schedule and an uphill battle, getting flashlight saved just like this out of nowhere isn't exactly fair or fun for the killer.

No way yo detect lurkers anymore with the new background player. Survivors can literally (no joke!) cross half of an ENTIRE MAP in 5 seconds now (map dependant, of course).

I run lightborn every match. No exceptions.

I must be a god at killer then because I don’t get flashlight saved often. Maybe once every 10 killer games.

right so that why you use background player or SB to reduce risk factor of it. one thing to note is that because survivor has such overwhelming advantage in early game, as long you finish the gens closest to center/break 3 gens on the specific map, the large gen spread means that the killer cannot patrol gen effectively. as a result, when roughly 1-2 gens remain, you don't really need 3 people on generators anymore. you just need killer to not get hooks. yes it becomes slower to finish gens but if killer is not getting any hooks, your progressing generators while killer is accomplishing nothing. Maybe they're breaking few pallets but as long killer does not break the entire map than it really does not matter.

Same here, but I can't deny that the saves are easier than ever before.

All hail to our lord and saviour Lightborn 😎

The messiah to all us casual killers.

this is why i talked about tactically going down in open spaces allows SWF to use flashlights to save survivor easier because there is not as many walls. you want go down near walls so that person who is trying to go for save can "stealth" but the killer has to pick up survivor out in the open. Yes, you are correct that flashbang is far superior to flashlight for saves but this is because flashbang requires the survivor to work on generators compare to flashlight. It is inherent more limited in # of uses unless you bring like 4 flashbang perks or something but that a lot of perk to devote to this gameplay where as flashlight costs 0 perks.

not necessarily. if there 1 or 2 gens remaining and gen are spread out, the killer spends like 20-30 seconds of walking to go across map. Suppose he successful does interrupt gen, what exactly does he accomplish on 60% gen for example? The killer regression is 4x slower. for that gen to regress fully, it takes 240 seconds to regression. 240 second is 4 MINUTES. 4 minutes is eternity. you can finish 2 other gens before that gen regresses to 0. If he interrupts, you just start another gen across the map. if he camps gen, you just get free progression elsewhere. If he doesn't camp gen then you just finish it. The only caveat is that you need to NOT be in 3 gen setup to push gens like this. that is why it is important to do correct gens in early game so your late game is easy. Of course, if you face killer that just camps 3 gens from the start than that is inherently going to be different game.

it depends. flashlight saves save hook-states but when you have 3 hook-states, you can spend hook-states as resource. from hook 1 -> hook 2, you have safest flashlight save because if it works, you delay killer a lot but if it fails then the person goes to 2nd hook. from 2nd hook ->3rd hook, you lose 1 survivor which is very big. you should not suicide to save survivor but if you get flashlight save, then it is pretty big because killer will tunnel the person on hook and every second that is chasing is extra gen-time for your team. The thing is that when you flashlight save a killer, it is harder to do it again because killer is more attentive to try avoid it.

Soloq is not going use flashlight correctly because flashlights require coordination. They can use it correctly and if they bond or empathy, they're more likely to use it correctly but it is not guaranteed. It is same how soloq will not use bodyblocking correctly with adrenaline or unbreakable bodyblocking or acquiring healing or end game hook saves which is really simple. right? It is just take a hit, hold-w, unhook and bodyblock to exit gate but even if that simple teamwork action is difficult. with stbfl, it just two people take a hit but even that is too much.

so how well this stuff works is highly dependent on your MMR level and your teammates. Flashlight are not useless. it is how player uses them that matters.

The regression example fails because you don't twiddle your thumbs waiting for the gen to regress. You actively play the game. You chase Survivors, you hook Survivors, you kill Survivors. Especially if you have perks such as Pop/Eruption/Pain Res. In my example I was assuming 3 Survivors are free, and 1 is in chase with 1 gen remaining. Personally I think a trio gen in ~43s doesn't save enough time compared to the versatility of a ~53s and a backup 90s gen, and losing a Survivor to attempt saves doesn't provide as much value as the 37s of gen time the duo offers, but that's just my assessment of low odds saves.

You keep conflating a flashlight save attempt and a flashlight save success, so I'm curious, how often do you think flashlight saves actually work? In a normal match, with roughly equal Survivor and Killer skill, I'd give it 25% odds in the best case scenario. Do you think it is vastly different? I run plenty of intel perks, for example Iri Cam on Ghosty is a god-send. That basically reduces pickup saves by any means down to less than 1% success rates. Clown Cigar Box similarly hard counters save attempts. Infectious Fright and/or Forced Hesitation seen not too uncommonly on Oni/Blight/Bubba also significantly reduces the efficacy of saves. Not to even mention if you have had a Flashlight Surv pestering you like a fly, you know to expect them there, and can easily prevent the save with an unmelted brain. Other Killers have various basekit intel features like Plague vomiting, or even Freddy's glowing dream Survs. So again, at what rate do you realistically expect saves to occur at compared to attempts?

Soloq isn't going to use flashlights correctly, well just a heads up, soloq is 60% of the game. So even if somehow they could always succeed in SWF, it would sit at an adjusted 40% save rate. I don't think soloq v SWF is nearly as black and white as this, but that is because I would say the saves are down to near nothing for both sides. The other night I just had a tunneling Legion and a duo continually doing pallet (Flip-Flop/Power Struggle) and flashy saves. The problem, was it forced 2 people on gens the entire time, and if they had simply not done stupid acts in the first place (rescuing 12m from the Legion), they wouldn't be in that situation to force the non-duo to pump gens. Eventually the tunneled Survivor died, and we finished the gens. I opened one gate, but the flashlight Survivor duo member still alive refused to unhook, refused to open the other gate while I went for the rescue (I pointed at the other gate and ran to hook). Sadly the other Surv thought she opened it, reached it closed, and died. Luckily (although technically planned) I was able to Deliverance to safety and the flashy Surv hard left. They justified their negligent homicide of the other Surv because she (gen Surv) interacted with the event for her tome... That is how Flashlights melt people's brains, and give Killers (2 in my example) free kills for no good reason.

In your example, you said that killer interrupts the gen. ok who cares? if he interrupts gen, the gen takes forever regress, you just work on another gen. If killer leaves gen, you finish it.

25%? if 1 person is in dying state and two people are going for flashlight save, it is not 25%. it is easily 90-100% especially if survivor purposely out in the open when he gets hit. 2 players that have 99% SB/Background player will almost consistently flashlight save. the last person is on a gen somewhere.

your talking about counters to flashlight and using high-tier killers to showcase that flashlight saves can be risky because of chance of getting slugged. i do not think it is so clear cut because flashlight have considerable range. you don't need stand right next to the survivor to perform flashlight save. by default flashlight have 10 meter distance. with like purple add-on, high end sapphire len's, it becomes 12.5 meters. this is not global or anything but you can flashlight save for a considerable distance if you know pick-up animation perfectly. Getting angle is biggest challenge for flashlight saves. The angle is given for 2 people going for saves but not so much for 1 player. 1 player is 50/50 depending on angle of survivor pick-up. you need flashbang to get ~ near 100% saves as solo but that costs a perk slot and is a lot more limiting.

I am talking about blight and Oni in demon fury in which you mention as infectious fright as some sort of counter to flashlights. you can still get flashlight saves vs stronger killer but you have to be more careful around some killers.

you missed key sentence in my previous post. When there are 1 or 2 generators remaining, flashlight saves become more detrimental to the killer because killer is not progressing the game while survivor can use their 4vs1 advantage to keep progressing the game while preventing killer from getting hooks. so no it does not take 7:20 minutes. It takes somewhere between 90 seconds and 180 seconds to finish the game. This number can go up and down because you can sometimes have 2 people on 2 separate generators.