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Singularity needs to be made easier to play
Singularity has quickly become one of the least played killers, which is bad considering he's the 2nd newest killer. On Nightlight, he's 5th least played killer. Though his real pick rate is probably lower since Nightlight mainly uses stats from PC players. Without any change, Singularity will probably reach Twins levels of obsecurity in the future.
The reason no one plays Singularity is that he's too hard. Otz, a player with 11k hours, is currently trying to win streak on him and only averages 3-4 wins before losing, which is extremely low compared to his other killers. This killer is also impossible to play on console due to the need to quickly aim pods. The main issue with Singularity is that it's hard to apply Slipstream while it's too easy for survivors to remove it.
Firstly, EMPs should only remove Slipstream on the survivor using it. Given how easy it is to acquire EMPs, it shouldn't be able to mass remove Slipstream. Slipstream is similar to Plague Infection, which is much harder for survivors to remove while also having a stronger effect.
Secondly, when switching to a pod, the camera should automatically face the nearest survivor. This is the only way to make Singularity playable on console.
Finally, they need to make it possible to place pods on all surfaces. There are too many situations where you try to place a pod on a perfectly flat surface and it doesn't work.
Comments
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None of these propositions are interesting or valid.
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Why does no one play Singularity and how would you fix that then?
The impact that would have on his pick rate would be... 0. If you've read any of the comments about him, no one plays him because of his high difficulty. Changing his addons, which I think are already strong, won't do much. The pod placement bug is annoying but isn't the main reason people don't play him.
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So you want to make him braindead to use because he has a low pick rate? That's not how it works. Some killers are easier to use than others and it's completely fine, just stick to wraith and move on.
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There's hard. Then there's too hard. There's obviously a problem if Otz, who has 11k hours and mastered most killers, can only average 3-4 wins on this killer. This killer will definitely get reworked in the future due to the low play rate, as most killers with a low pick have. Having a killer that virtually no one plays is a waste.
I'm not even bad with this killer. If you run Denied Requistion Form and Soma Family Photo, this killer is actually ez mode and 3-4ks most matches. Without these 2 addons though, he's very difficult.
Post edited by adsads123123123123 on0 -
Easier Singularity will born a new Skull Merchant level of annoying and frustration
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Too hard according to who? You? Lol. Win streaks aren't ground to built conversation, you're not supposed to get a 50 wins streak, whoever you are.
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The main difference between Otz and Cocolatte are the addons. Otz only uses yellow and brown addons for his streaks while Cocolatte used Denied Requistion Form and Soma Family Photo. This killer is ez mode if you run Denied Requistion Form and Soma Family Photo. I 3-4k most matches when I use these 2 addons. Don't use them and this killer is x5 harder.
Not really. The changes I suggest don't make him significantly stronger at 3 gening. As long as the EMPs are AOE and spawn as fast as they do currently, his 3 gen will be limited.
Most of the community, which is why no one plays him?
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You're never gonna get a perfectly even spread of killer picks, especially when killers tend to gravitate towards the easiest mechanics. Some killers are harder to manipulate than others, that's just how it is.
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People underestimate how strong the rancor-game afoot build on him
Slap on NWO and buffed remember me and you're going to win 9/10 times, even if they genrush, as long as you plan it right
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If I were you, I would give up on the Singularity. It has a (small) number of fans who like its current gameplay, even though it is quite frustrating for most of the public. This causes it to be seen as a niche killer, although I deeply disagree that it's at an adequate level. I don't believe that not even the best Singularity player would be able to beat a decent and minimally coordinated team, but it's like I said, as there are people who like to play with it, it's unlikely you'll see any changes.
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I don't think you understand how strong these 2 addons are and how to use them to their full potential.
DRF is extremely strong due to the syngergy with Soma Family Photo and Lethal Pursuer. Lethal Pursuer lets you fully utilize the 30-60 sec window where you have all survivors Slipstreamed and a full duration speed boost. You can start chase extremely fast, down the first survivor extremely fast and keep up high momentum throughout the entire game. Secondly, it's extremely good on maps where it's hard to Slipstream survivors, e.g. Lery's and Red Forest, since it saves a lot of time. Thirdly, it significantly delays survivors getting EMP due to the later EMP spawn and fact that they have to use their first EMP to clear the DRF Slipstream. Cocolatte rated DRF as A tier, but with the synergy I mentioned, I think it's S tier.
You have it the wrong way around. MFT makes Soma weaker. Once MFT is nerfed, Soma will be even stronger. The reason it's so strong is the synergy with Rapid Brutality. You can get a 5-7 sec window where you have a 10% speed boost, which is often enough to get hits, especially when combined with Coup De Grace. Once MFT is nerfed, you will be able to get even more hits with this combo. Cocolatte rated Soma as S tier and described the addon as extremely powerful.
Anyway, if you only use yellow and brown addons, this killer is extremely hard. The reason Otz does this is that he wants to test killers in their "base form".
I disagree. All of the killers with an extremely low pick rate have a good reason for why no one plays them. If these reasons are addressed, people would play them. See the pick rates.
Singularity is the only hard killer that no one plays. Blight and Nurse are hard but popular due to their strength.
I think he will be reworked but probably 3-5 years from now after all the other killers are reworked. Once Twins are reworked, Singularity and Hag will be the 2 least played killers, and BHVR will eventually tweak him.
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Maybe no one plays him cause of his annoying voice lmao
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i think there is misunderstanding to why Singularity is hard to play. So summary is that when you infect a survivor with slipstream, you gain ability to instantly teleport but the teleport is around 11-12 meters away. Overclock by default lasts 4.7 seconds+1 second per survivor that is infected. Survivors running forward outrun overclock duration. In order for singularity use the buff in chase, you need have 3 survivors infected. anything less than 3 survivor at base-kit means that survivor can just run forward after teleporting and they will outlast the overclock duration. Infecting 3 survivors entire trial is really impractical because 1 EMP can remove all 3 infections. At base-kit, singularity is not a good killer.
The way to fix his kit so that he needs less survivors infected is a purple add-on called Soma Family Photo. this add-on grants 5% haste. It has negative that it reduces overclock duration however there is grey add-on called kid ball glove that reverses negative. when you use these two add-on together, you only need 1 survivor infected. Survivor can no longer outrun your overclock duration. you don't need run kid ball glove because you can just have two survivors infected which is what Cocolatte does. The reason why Singularity is unpopular is because his base-kit is not very good and he is entirely reliant on Soma photo to be effective chasing killer. The only way you can not play with Soma photo is to have 3/4 survivors infected which is impractical because you need to know where 75% of the team is at all times and you have surpress EMP'S and make survivor waste EMP's.
Otz, a player with 11k hours, is currently trying to win streak on him and only averages 3-4 wins before losing, which is extremely low compared to his other killers.
Otz is losing because he is playing a killer that highly add-on dependent but he is also refusing to use high rarity add-on's without understanding that some killer simply rely on higher rarity add-on to be viable at highest level. When your doing win-streaks, you need to bring your A-game. It is just that some add-on might be considered too much of gameplay change for doing win streaks. he needs to distinguish necessity add-on and game-changing add-on that he might consider inappropriate for win streaks.
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Too much ways for Survivors to counterplay Hux.
1) EMPs (There needs to be a hard cap on the amount of EMPs or make it only capable of disabling one infection and one pod maximum per use)
2) LOS blockers where even one pixel of foilage can block slipstream via his pods
3) Survivor getting a visual cue that they are being locked on so they can find cover behind one pixel (Why does this even exist?)
Either one of the above needs to be tuned down.
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Singularity has quickly become one of the least played killers, which is bad considering he's the 2nd newest killer. On Nightlight, he's 5th least played killer. Though his real pick rate is probably lower since Nightlight mainly uses stats from PC players. Without any change, Singularity will probably reach Twins levels of obsecurity in the future.
Within the context of a game with nearly 3 dozen killers, fundamentally they will have different skill floors and therefore different pick rates. Singularity has one of the highest skill floors we've seen so far, leading to an understandably low pick rate. And that's fine. Hux sits in the same place as the Artist - niche but ultimately fine, even if he could do with some QoL changes, which I will get into on your other points.
The reason no one plays Singularity is that he's too hard. Otz, a player with 11k hours, is currently trying to win streak on him and only averages 3-4 wins before losing, which is extremely low compared to his other killers. This killer is also impossible to play on console due to the need to quickly aim pods. The main issue with Singularity is that it's hard to apply Slipstream while it's too easy for survivors to remove it.
Last I heard him mention it, Otz placed Singularity in B or A tier - by his own admission, Singularity is in a fine spot strength-wise. As for Hux's worst issues, I'd argue they lie in issues with applying Slipstream, not survivor ease of removing it.
Firstly, EMPs should only remove Slipstream on the survivor using it. Given how easy it is to acquire EMPs, it shouldn't be able to mass remove Slipstream. Slipstream is similar to Plague Infection, which is much harder for survivors to remove while also having a stronger effect.
Absolutely not. Under no circumstances should EMPs be made weaker than they already are, with maybe the exception of weakening their removal in chase. Only being able to remove slipstream from yourself makes two survivors working on a gen together entirely unable to cleanse slipstream unless they both get up, visit different 3D Printers, and EMP seperately. I don't need to point out how much stronger this would make 3-gen Singularity, a playstyle I would very much like to stay garbage on my main.
Secondly, when switching to a pod, the camera should automatically face the nearest survivor. This is the only way to make Singularity playable on console. Finally, they need to make it possible to place pods on all surfaces. There are too many situations where you try to place a pod on a perfectly flat surface and it doesn't work.
Whilst I can't comment on changes to Hux that make him more feasible on console as a M&K player, I agree Pods need significant QoL work - many windows cannot be shot through for placing pods, their placement is awkward at the best of times (and yes, your view that they should place more consistently on surfaces is correct), and LoS is considered very strangely for Slipstream application.
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This killer will definitely get reworked in the future due to the low play rate, as most killers with a low pick have.
Of the bottom 10 killers by Pick Rate in DBD currently, one has an announced rework: Twins, who is being reworked to address the fact that their playstyle is unfun to play as and against.
In contrast, Trickster is currently seeing significant PTB buffs whilst keeping his core gameplay loop the same, and Nightmare was reworked without improvements in Pick Rate, and hasn't been reworked again since 3.1.0, over four years ago.
The assertion that unplayed killers are often reworked is blatantly untrue, and the implication that these reworks function to benefit the killer is equally untrue.
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As a big singu player on PC, here's my perspective:
The only modifications to make to Singu in my opinion:
- Be able to remove his biocapsules remotely.
- Fix the attachment of biocapsules. (BHVR PLZ)
- Remove survivor alerts in case of locking to allow the killer to surprise survivors.
That's it.
Let them keep their EMPs; the more they use them, the more I contaminate them, and the more I contaminate them, the more time they waste speeding up the printers.
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I don't think him being hard to play is really an issue, but he does need some changes so he's not so frustrating.
- Make it so a leaf doesn't block his cameras
- Let the amount of lock on progress linger for half a second so if something small does block it you aren't heavily punished
- Fix the placement logic
- Make it so the anti-camping mechanic doesn't activate if the survivor is dead and being sacrificed.
- Prioritise targeting a pod that was just placed for a few seconds so that you don't accidentally select the pod halfway across the map
That's all he needs really. These changes would make him less frustrating to play and a little bit easier while still keeping the skill level and not making him much stronger.
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I agree that survivors can remove Slipstream too fast due to the AOE Slipstream removal. The time it takes to Sliptream 3-4 survivors is high, but survivors can quickly stand together and remove it all once. It's far too efficient. This is the main thing holding Singularity back. As I mentioned in my post, only the survivor using the EMP should have their Slipstream removed. Slipstream is very similar to Plague infection and should be treated similarly.
As a PC player, I personally don't find it hard to apply Sliptream and the other issues with him are minor. The reason I think auto targeting is necessary for console players is that it's necessary to quickly aim pods in precise spots then quickly switch to the pod to apply Slipstream. The camera is often out of the place, so I usually quickly spin my camera and let the auto targeting find the survivor for me. This strategy seem too difficult to execute on console. Another reason is that the map is too dark. Nvidia Filters is 100% necessary to play this killer. I tried playing without Filters and it was x3 harder due to the dark map.
Singularity's play rate will fall further with time. He's still the 2nd newest killer, which is why he's being played. Due to the higher skill floor compared to Artist and fact it's hard to play him on console, his play rate will definitely fall below Arist and likely to Twins level of unpopularity, which is a big problem since no one plays Twins due her clunkiness and terrible design. Singularity having the same play rate as Twins indicates that people think Singularity is as bad to play as Twins, which is extremely bad.
Otz placed Singularity in B+ tier, but he rates killers based on their average strength, which includes strong addons. Without strong addons, Otz probably would have placed him in C tier. Imo, with strong addons Singularity is A or S tier. Without strong addons, he's C tier.
Making EMPs only remove 1 Slipstream will improve his overall strength, which also improves his 3 gen, but I don't think it's enough to make the 3 gening good. As long as EMPs AOE disable pods, his 3 gen will be mediocre since he still can't defend gens well without tping. To 3 gen effectively, a killer must be able to either secure a down extremely fast or defend multiple gens at once, which Singularity cannot do. You need to compare Slipstream with Plague infection, which has a stronger effect and is easier to spread. Even though Plague has survivors permanently injured, she is mediocre at 3 gening.
As for why Singularity is hard to play, it's a combination of taking too long to apply Slipstream and survivors removing it too fast. I mostly apply Slipstream when I am in chase with them, so I apply Slipstream at a rate of 1 survivor per chase, but hooking the survivor removes the Slipstream. This makes it hard to spread Slipstream. On the other hand, survivors can remove Slipstream very fast due to the EMP abundancy and fact that 1 EMP can remove multiple Slipstreams. The only way to make Singularity spread Slipstream easier is reduce the effectivenes of EMPs on his pods, which cannot be done due to 3 gen problems. This means that it's instead necessary to reduce the ability of survivors to remove Slipstream.
List of full power reworks (when there was a massive change to their power):
- Doctor
- Cannibal
- Legion
- Nightmare
- Clown
- Twins
- Trickster
- Skull Merchant
- Onyro
Asides from Twins, every killer on this list was buffed from their rework. Asides from Skull Merchant and maybe Trickster, every killer on this list was reworked because they were considered terrible killers that no one wanted to play.
Nightmare's rework was a success. He was popular in the past and was considered A tier. What killed him off was the nerfs to slowdown in general. People used to run the Forever Freddy build on him. His addons got nerfed severely and all of the slowdown perks he used to run was nerfed (Thana and Ruin). He's also a very old killer and his power has become outdated as much stronger killers have been released.
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The tiniest leaf or other obstacle preventing shots from landing needs to be addressed, as does all the jank pod placements that get denied. This is universal no matter the platform he's played on.
To speak to the fun with him using a controller on console, there a few issues that drive up the frustration.
The camera turning movement feels slow and unnatural, even at max sensitivity. Add in the dead zones in the sticks & input delay and you often just cannot react fast enough to land anything with him. This is also not considering the unstable frame rates and lag spikes that commonly prevail on the consoles, particularly the older machines.
Current Trickster is the only killer I regard as completely unplayable on console, and he is being changed next big update. But Singularity is really really trying to join that list.
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@Huxy @just_one_player @kit_mason @TetroXyD
Disable Nvidia Filters and any other third party program that increases brightness. Don't use Soma Family Photo and Denied Requisition Form. Play on a dark map. Then report back to me how hard this killer is.
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- It's hard to believe, but I've never used the soma damily photo or DRF. (I don't like being dependent on rare addons)
- Too lazy to put on filters.
Sure, sometimes I spit blood, but... I love the killer :) (and i like ultrasonic sensor, bc if you dont see it, you can hear it :D )
My shtty loadout :
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Okay?
I'll give you that dark maps with immersed survivors is a problem worth discussing, but that's not specific to Hux in any regard, and is therefore irrelevant to our discussion entirely. And my go-to addons are Live Wires and Kid's Ball Glove - Hux remains to be fun and usable, with its main issues continuing to be fixable through QoL changes, rather than a full rework.
This killer isn't for everyone, and large-scale reworks torch the playerbase it already has in the hopes of fostering a new, entirely different one. Sometimes that's healthy for the game, like with Skull Merchant. But I don't think your proposed changes would put Hux in a healthier position- if anything, it'd validate playstyles that make it less healthy for the game on the whole.
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I hugely agree with your opinion on shot LoS and how easy it is to interupt, as well as pod placement logic. And it's welcoming to get your perspective on playing Hux on console- hopefully BHVR take notice and tune the experience to feel much better to use.
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I'm going to ignore specualtive statements on a world where Singularity's pick rate cuts by more than half of what it is now, because fundamentally the reason why Twins is unpopular is far more deeply rooted in their playstyle and bugs than Singularity is. They have entirely different issues and those issues are addressed in entirely different ways.
Otz's view of Singularity as B+ is fair, and I think that with Soma/Denied Requisition he does enter A tier, and without those addons he probably drops down to B, I think C tier is a little harsh. But again, this is speculation - specifically speculation on the opinions of a man I am not, so it's not really worth continuing to discuss.
I thoroughly think EMPs are in a fine state outside of chase. Making them only cleanse yourself would make doubling gens when one survivor is Slipstreamed entirely unsolvable, one person has to drop the gen or both survivors are now Slipstreamed, with a very out-of-the-way solution of two different EMPs. I think any further changes to EMPs, if deemed necessary, should solely focus on their use in chase. As for reworks (that I can comment on, sorry Doctor and Cannibal):
Nightmare is a non-point. Sure, the rework may have functioned short-term, but as we see it now, it didn't pan out well. Freddy is regarded as a bottom-3 killer, for good reason that you yourself identified. In a similar vein, Trickster currently is at risk of ending up going the same way, given his PTB changes are widely regarded as making him too strong, especially with use of Death Throes Compilation.
Skull Merchant is in an objectively weaker position thanks to the removal of 3-Gen Merchant so arguing that she was buffed is blatantly untrue, even if she still is strong. Legion had to be reworked twice and is weaker than their release iteration, albeit their second rework did seem to get their power and strength levels about right.
Sadako is stronger than before but failed to address that her best playstyle is unfun to play against and uninteractive to play as - you toss on Iridescent Video Tape and have a notably easy time winning, as evidenced by her kill rate placing her as the second strongest killer in the game, only beaten by Skull Merchant.
Twins' rework is still in early stages, so we can't possibly speculate on what it will do to them as a killer.
So fundamentally, reworks don't always put the killer in a better spot - often, they miss the mark on putting the killer in a healthier and more balanced state simultaneously. The only reworks that seemed to work out fully in this regard were Skull Merchant, Clown, Legion and potentially Doctor and Bubba. And I'm not particularly interested in a 50/50 shot that my killer survives the rework it recieves.
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It isn't dark maps with immersed survivors that's the problem. It's dark maps, which are half of the maps, that's the problem. It's critical to be able to identify good spots to place pods and quickly find survivors after switching to a pod. When the map is dark, this becomes x3 harder to do.
"I'm going to ignore specualtive statements on a world where Singularity's pick rate cuts by more than half of what it is now, because fundamentally the reason why Twins is unpopular is far more deeply rooted in their playstyle and bugs than Singularity is. They have entirely different issues and those issues are addressed in entirely different ways."
Firstly, we don't know Singularity's current play rate. It has already been proven that Nightlight's stats significantly differ from the actual stats. He could already be at Twins play rate. We will have to wait until BHVR releases stats again to know for certain. You also seem to be forgeting that with every new killer released and reworked, the play rates of all other killers drop as people change mains. Singularity is a new a killer that hasn't gone through this process yet and will drop in play rates as more killers are released.
"I thoroughly think EMPs are in a fine state outside of chase. Making them only cleanse yourself would make doubling gens when one survivor is Slipstreamed entirely unsolvable, one person has to drop the gen or both survivors are now Slipstreamed, with a very out-of-the-way solution of two different EMPs. I think any further changes to EMPs, if deemed necessary, should solely focus on their use in chase. As for reworks (that I can comment on, sorry Doctor and Cannibal):"
Slipstream spreading easier isn't a problem. It's what Singularity needs. Currently, Slipstream can be removed at a much faster rate than it can be applied. As I've already said, Plague's Infection spreads much easier than Slipstream and already infects multiple survivors working on the same gen.
"Nightmare is a non-point. Sure, the rework may have functioned short-term, but as we see it now, it didn't pan out well. Freddy is regarded as a bottom-3 killer, for good reason that you yourself identified."
Freddy was popular for years. The rework success wasn't "short-term". As I've said, it wasn't the rework that was unsuccessful. It was the nerfs afterwards that caused his current state. I also don't really blame BHVR since that the rework was done in the very early stage of the game when BHVR had limited experience designing and balancing the game. If they reworked him again today, it would be very different.
"In a similar vein, Trickster currently is at risk of ending up going the same way, given his PTB changes are widely regarded as making him too strong, especially with use of Death Throes Compilation."
He won't be any worse than he is already.
I think you are completely missing the reason for why certain killers may be weaker after their rework. The killers that became weaker after their rework were the ones that were completely unfun to play against. From that list, the only 2 killers that have supposedly gotten weaker were Skull Merchant and Legion. Both of these killers were extremely unfun to play against before their rework. Singularity doesn't fall into this category.
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I think Singularity is already a very good killer. It just needs some adjustments to its to kit to make it more fun to play as.
I would do some things like:
- Whenever a survivor is hooked, it remains infected. This way would force people to farm EMPs to do save and Sing would not lose infection pressure because it played well (downed a survivor then hooked).
- Lower the cooldowns between infecting and teleporting with the cam.
- Also, give every survivor infected a separated cooldown for pods. If there is two survivors in the camera range, let the camera infect them both; if you survivor is infected and then another survivor runs through your pod's vision, make it possible infecting him/her with no downtime
- Make it possible to scan if at least 60% of a survivor body is being seen (i hate when small rocks and leaves block the pod vision)
- Other quality of life improvements (bugfixes, better cam move, etc.)
One thing i would suggest, but i don't know yet if its a good suggestion is to whenever the Pod infects someone with an EMP, the EMP breaks. This would prevent those dumb situation where you infect someone, but he/she is holding an EMP and just cleanse the infection in seconds (and also break your pod).
Its a very fun killer that deserve some love!!
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In the interest of avoiding making longer and longer response essays, I'm going to only focus on major issues I have.
Currently, Slipstream can be removed at a much faster rate than it can be applied.
This is untrue unless you're playing on a map with very high levels of sight line blocking like Hawkins or RPD (which is an issue with any LoS-requiring killer, like Huntress, Deathslinger, or even arguably killers like Billy). Reapplying Slipstream is as quick, if not quicker than removing it, and that's ignoring that if the survivor you're chasing is the one removing it then they are slowed, often causing them to take a hit.
[Freddy's] rework success wasn't "short-term". As I've said, it wasn't the rework that was unsuccessful. It was the nerfs afterwards that caused his current state.
It, by the very definition of the term, was only successful short-term. A successful rework would not have necessitated the nerfs that have placed him in the sorry state he is in now.
The killers that became weaker after their rework were the ones that were completely unfun to play against.
You missed the word "healthier" in my post. Many of the killers, whilst stronger, are not in a healthier place than they were - especially in cases like Sadako and the proposed Trickster changes (i.e. some of the most recent reworks we've had). Given Singularity's strength is fine - B is average, after all - the issue is health, which as I have now said what seems to be an endless number of times, are addressed with QoL changes, not reworks.
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Singularity is in a fine spot, the biggest issue is as you said; he is hard to play with no huge reward to compensate like say blight. I think bigger still though is his map dependency; if he gets an indoor map of any kind (or one with clutter but less so) then he basically has no power, imagine trying to pod people on Lery's for example, you basically cant and that just sucks.
Your proposed second idea would help an ok amount for console players sure.
Your first idea though has some problems, and you misunderstand the counter play to the killer and why EMPs and teamwork are so important against him. If that change was to go through and you could only EMP yourself, then if he chases you, you have absolutely 0 counter play since a teammate cannot run in and save you so you will have a pod stuck to you for the entire chase unless you grab an EMP before hand. In fact even if you EMPed the first one off by having one at the start of a chase, he could just pod you again and since you used your EMP you would again just have nothing you could do. A big part of this killer is helping your team by coming in with EMPs etc.
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"I'm going to ignore specualtive statements on a world where Singularity's pick rate cuts by more than half of what it is now, because fundamentally the reason why Twins is unpopular is far more deeply rooted in their playstyle and bugs than Singularity is. They have entirely different issues and those issues are addressed in entirely different ways."
singularity does share something in common with twins. There is some slugging component to Singularity because when you hook a survivor, the survivor loses infection. If you leave survivor slugged on the floor, they keep their infection and when an uninfected survivor pick-up that survivor. that survivor becomes infected. The more survivor that are infected, the longer your overclock duration lasts. The base-kit encourages you to perform that gameplay. That is why Cocolatte is using a perk called Knock out. Knock out is slugging perk that removes aura of survivors on the floor. Cocolatte is using slugging to spread infection. He is putting camera on the Slugged survivor then chasing another survivor, infecting another survivor and attempting to down a second survivor. If survivor on floor is pick-up, he goes back to his camera and teleport's back to the slug. By doing that, he has 3 survivors infected. It replicates Singularity's iri add-on Denial Requeistion Form which begins trial with 4 infected survivors.
this is another reason why singularity is difficult to play killer at base-kit. you need game-sense and understanding how to slug to keep entire team infected. Infecting people, hooking people and balanced your slugging with infection is very complex gameplay at base-kit. Soma Family Photo add-on greatly simplifies singlurarity gameplay because like I said, you only need 1 survivor infected so it becomes as simple as fire pod, shoot, keeping teleport till you down survivor, hook rinse repeat. At base-kit, you have to do all these other steps involving slugging to keep entire team infected to have a good enough overclock for the entire game.
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just make it so the pods instant targets the survivor (so you just have to press m1 to teleport / mark someone) if they are within LOS at 10 meters, so people on console can actually be at the same level of a PC player on chase or while swaping pods.
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I like to play Singularity because he is a complex killer and you always have to use your power. In my opinion, he is overall a good and strong killer and does not need any strong changes. However, he could get some tweaks:
- The Addon Ultrasonic Sensor should be basekit because this add-on is too weak on it's own and it feels not fair that Xenomorph can hear the generators in her tunnels but also see footsteps around her. Why does Singularity need an add-on what another killer has basekit?
- The EMP should get a slighty nerf: Firstly, survivors should not get free EMPs from the Sluppy Cases. Either they must finish the last 10% to open it; need a bigger low down when they use it; survivors lose their EMPs when they get hit (like tabes from Onryo); or the Sluppy Cases produce new EMPs once their first one are used. It feels not fair that his infection is so easy to remove when its not that oppressive as the infection from Wesker/Mastermind. Next, Singularity should get a better notification, when a survivor uses an EMP. I mean, why get Wesker/Mastermind killerinstinct when a survivor uses the spray or why gets Plague a global notification when someones gets rid of her infection - additionally, she can also see where the survivor is based on the new aura of her spring. It feels so unfair that Singularity only gets a sounds notification when he is nearby. Otherwise the EMPs are mostly fine. I like the teamworkpart that survivors have against this killer.
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"This is untrue unless you're playing on a map with very high levels of sight line blocking like Hawkins or RPD (which is an issue with any LoS-requiring killer, like Huntress, Deathslinger, or even arguably killers like Billy). Reapplying Slipstream is as quick, if not quicker than removing it, and that's ignoring that if the survivor you're chasing is the one removing it then they are slowed, often causing them to take a hit."
I checked cocolatte_'s recent matches. Throughout most his matches, he only has 1 survivor Slipstreamed (the one he is chasing) and occassionally a 2nd survivor. The reason for this is that there's no point of trying to spread Slipstream when survivors can remove it so easily.
"It, by the very definition of the term, was only successful short-term. A successful rework would not have necessitated the nerfs that have placed him in the sorry state he is in now."
So you're telling me if a killer was successful for 100 years but becomes outdated at 101 years, the rework was a failure? Years is a very long time for a video game. The rework was a success. Never heard of the term "long-term"? I also don't see the point of this argument. Freddy was the first rework they did in the very early stages of the game when BHVR had limited experience. That rework doesn't reflect what BHVR would do today.
"You missed the word "healthier" in my post. Many of the killers, whilst stronger, are not in a healthier place than they were - especially in cases like Sadako and the proposed Trickster changes (i.e. some of the most recent reworks we've had). Given Singularity's strength is fine - B is average, after all - the issue is health, which as I have now said what seems to be an endless number of times, are addressed with QoL changes, not reworks."
Nope. The only killer that isn't healthier is Sadako. It isn't "many" like you said. Trickster isn't out yet, so can't be used as an argument.
The changes I suggested aren't reworks. They're mostly QOL changes. Auto camera targeting is QOL. Better pod placement logic is QOL. Nerfing Slipstream removal is partially QOL.
I disagree. It's as you said, he can just quickly Slipstream you again if you are in chase with him. Having a teammate come in for an EMP won't change much. It's better if that teammate just sat on a gen, which would have more impact.
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the quote you used was originally mine, so I'll respond to it:
Whilst I agree there is a slugging component that can be utilised in singularity that you went into with excellent depth, Twins' issues lie far beyond just slugging (although that is a part of it) they suffer from some absolutely awful bugs - easiest example is victor randomly dying on stairs as part of an anti-stuck measure.
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As someone that uses Live Wires, it's nice to have that feedback when a cleanse goes out- basekit killer instinct on cleanse might not be a horrid idea. Other than that, I think EMPs are mostly okay? They felt oppressive on launch but learning to play around them in their now-weakened state is mostly fine- especially since lots of survivors fail to remember the hinder on use at all.
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You're now moving the goalposts, so I'm going to make this my last response on the subject.
Your Freddy response is reducing my argument to the absurd. Freddy's rework didn't benefit him long-term within the context of the game's life cycle. The point of pointing this out is that you are advocating for reworks as an often-successful means of improving killers, a fact I refute as they're not as surefire, and haven't been throughout the game's life cycle, as they're still not getting it right if we look at Sadako.
The argument for reworks was also why both Twins and Trickster were brought into this discussion in the first place, but now it's being asserted that I can't discuss Trickster but you can discuss Twins?
I've explained why nerfing slipstream removal in the way you have described is not QoL. It's worsening the survivor experience and validating less engaging strategies on the side of the killer. Auto camera targeting removes hiding within a pod's range entirely and makes placing a pod and entering it a surefire way to find a survivor you have lost, every single time, whilst also creating a power that might as well go off automatically (which would both then also lead to less engaging strategies on the Killer's side.)
And we're both advocating for better pod placement logic. In short, if you want a killer with a lower skill floor, they already exist. I wish you the best of luck in that endeavour.
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I don't even know why we are discussing reworks in the first place. The changes I suggested are no where close to a rework. They are on the scale of buffs and nerfs and quality of life changes. Why are we even discussing reworks?
"The point of pointing this out is that you are advocating for reworks as an often-successful means of improving killers, a fact I refute as they're not as surefire"
False. Improvement is defined as becoming better than before. Freddy's rework is an improvement to his prior form. Even though Freddy is terrible currently, Freddy before his rework would be x3 worse. Sadako was also improved. In the past, everyone considered Sadako to be one of the worst killers, which could only use the slug strat. Sadako was improved in that she is much stronger and can play without slugging (even if the strat is still strong). Sadako is also somewhat of an outlier. Originally BHVR had it right where tapes were only removed after hooking (making slugging unviable) but the community cried about it, which resulted in Sadako's current state.
"The argument for reworks was also why both Twins and Trickster were brought into this discussion in the first place, but now it's being asserted that I can't discuss Trickster but you can discuss Twins?"
Completely different reasons for why they were mentioned. I mentioned Twins as a killer that they will rework. This is confirmed. You mentioned Trickster as an unhealthy killer. This is unconfirmed since killers usually get changed after PTB and Trickster hasn't been tested on live servers yet.
"I've explained why nerfing slipstream removal in the way you have described is not QoL. It's worsening the survivor experience and validating less engaging strategies on the side of the killer."
That's why I said it's partially QOL. It's obviously a buff. You fail to understand that players can simply ignore the Slipstream and keep working gens. As long as the Pods are EMPed, they will break the 3 gen. You also still can't explain why it's fine for Plague to have her Infection spread easily and why she can't hold a 3 gen well compared to Singularity.
"Auto camera targeting removes hiding within a pod's range entirely and makes placing a pod and entering it a surefire way to find a survivor you have lost, every single time,
Well, just make it so it only auto moves the camera if the survivor is scannable when swapping to the pad.
"whilst also creating a power that might as well go off automatically (which would both then also lead to less engaging strategies on the Killer's side.)"
Strongly disagree. 90% of what determines whether a Slipstream is successful is pod placement. Placing a pod in a good location guarantees the survivor is Slipstreamed while placing it in a poor position results in failure. As a PC player, the auto camera movement makes almost no difference for me, as I locate survivors within 0.5 seconds of switching to a pod. This change is mainly for console players.
Honestly, I can't be bothered arguing with you either. I think you have no understanding of Singularity and all your arguments are terrible.
Post edited by adsads123123123123 on0 -
My take on Singularity is he's a bit like Hillbilly crossed with Dredge.
Hes both Map dependant (on certain maps he is really hard to use...), and he is also mechanically demanding to play, requiring strong execution to be viable. When played by someone who has that mechanical skill in a good map, is a powerful, omnipresent menace and a tough killer to face. On a less favourable map, the same mechanically skilled player can certainly do work, but it does become more of a challenge. This balances out to Singularity generally being quite well balanced.
Sadly if you're new to him and/or lack the mechanical skill, you're in for a really tough time. This unfortunately means that, like Hillbilly, he is a really, REALLY rough choice to play on console. I had the same debate with @ReverseVelocity a ways back, and after really thinking about his power, you CAN make it work... but it is tough on console even on his preferred maps, and on unfavourable maps it feels downright awful.
A dedicated console player could indeed get good enough to compensate, but that initial learning curve is damned harsh.
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The only thing i want is to EMP getting destroyed if holder get infected. I have seen too many people just hold them and essentially wasting your time.
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Someone recently made a post about Singularity and it has many comments on why no one plays him. The main reasons were:
- pod lock on being blocked by small leafs
- being unable to place pods on some surfaces
- EMPs too strong
- too much effort for too little reward
- too hard
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