No Repeat Perks

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CammyChameleon
CammyChameleon Member Posts: 205
edited January 17 in Feedback and Suggestions

I see this as the MOST common ruleset in competitive DBD and every match seems to be balanced around this. Obviously the killer can't repeat perks as there is only one.

However survivors can, across each of them.

Perhaps with a change to let us see our teammates perks, it prevents us from having duplicates. The game would be much easier to balance like this.

Comments

  • anarchy753
    anarchy753 Member Posts: 4,212
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    They've been talking about temporary alternative game modes, I think it would definitely be interesting to have one of them be "no duplicate characters or perks," though I feel like it would run into the problem other games have with long lobbies because people just leave if they can't have the thing they want.

  • pigslittlepet
    pigslittlepet Member Posts: 432
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    I know it's hard thing to grasp but dbd isn't a competitive game. Sure there are Lot of sweaty tryhards out there like me but it's still a party game. Of course there needs to be balancing and such but if they start balancing around competitive then this game is finished. The casual players won't be interested and solo que will get even worse.

  • Chaosrider
    Chaosrider Member Posts: 489
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    Comp is just about some people trying to force made up gameplay into dbd. Noone sane plays comp as it doesn't fit this game in the slightest.

  • Halloulle
    Halloulle Member Posts: 1,118
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    comp is a very different creature from pub games. The comp crowd basically just took the infrastructure dbd offers as a base to build their own game.

    It's kinda like MauMau and Durak. Both can be played with a standard deck of cards - and while both are often played with 36 cards they aren't palyed with the same cards (7-Ace in both - but in MauMau you get jokers and in Durak you get sixes), the general goal is to get rid of your cards - but that aside they're completely different games.

    That being said though, I generally like the idea of no duplicates - since a number of perks that are perfectly fine in pubs become somewhat frustrating if stacked (Adren, for example). As others have pointed out though: it's borderline impractical. Four solos arrive in a lobby just to see three have Adren. - Which two gonna drop Adren? What are they gonna take instead? One goes "ok, SB then" - just to see another one already has it. How long do you want to discuss perk choices? If your loadout is locked in when you Q up so matchmaking matches people with unique perks only: that ain't gonna happen at all, simply because overall only a fraction of the perks are used at all.

    --- And a short addendum from someone with a comp perspective that chimed in from the side: unique perks are not about balancing, they are about randomness-mitigation and information. The killer is supposed to be able to tell if they can realistically chase a survivor / if the deadzone is actually a deadzone for that surv, if it's the right play to slug that player or not (because they're the UB player) etc. pp. When it comes to balance it's the park bans that are supposed to balance. - Though that isn't possible for pubs either; with killer specific perk bans you'd have to reveal killers and with general perk bans ... well, that basically means just deleting the perk.

  • I_CAME
    I_CAME Member Posts: 1,147
    edited January 17
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    The game already massively favors the killer in pub matches. I've seen players from various comp teams including Team Eternal say any good killer who is playing to win should win 95% of their matches with all but the bottom five weakest killers. Why people want to make the game so hard for ordinary players is beyond me. Suggestions like this are exactly what would kill the game.

  • CammyChameleon
    CammyChameleon Member Posts: 205
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    A lot of people are saying Solo Queue would be ruined by this, but I had actually made a point that I think would equally not effect solo queue and still balance the game a lot more.

    Make it so you can't have any duplicates with players in your party. You load up with your builds all set, a solo queue teammate can have what ever they want, no restrictions needed since they are solo.

    This would help bridge the gap between Solo Q and SWF by reducing the strength of an Overpowered team otherwise.

    This would not make the game killer sided as seen in many TOP TIER Killer Vs. TOP TIER Surv showcases, where the team can have no duplicate perks and the survivors still heavily dominate the game.

  • UndeddJester
    UndeddJester Member Posts: 2,425
    edited January 18
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    SpookyLoopz made a video just today discussing things such as this. The whole video is worth a watch, but here is the timestamp that really gets into it.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHkthkwyuZE&t=370s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHkthkwyuZE&t=825s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHkthkwyuZE&t=1280s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JHkthkwyuZE&t=1740s

    The thing is competative DBD is a very different game to normal DBD. In normal DBD each survivor is primarily trying to save themselves, in comp DBD, it is purely about hook stages.

    I made a big post about it the other day, but DBD is not a true 4vs1, it is 4 players trying to survive against 1 killer. There are perks that work in standard DBD that do not work in competative DBD, and vice versa, and a lot of things about DBD would need a lot of changes to facilitate a lot of the things in comp... e.g.

    • Decisive Strike for example is considered pretty bad by most people, but in competative is still one of the best perks in the game.
    • Adrenaline is considered pretty balanced in standard DBD, but in comp DBD would be completely broken and is banned.
    • The AFC is banned in comp, because the game isn't about an individual survivor surviving, it is about hook stages.
    • Voice comms would be required as standard, but the whole game would need rebalancing because of how much of a strength comms are.

    However as you can see in SpookyLoopz video, 1 action by survivors being less optimal can snowball out of control and cause a huge swing of pressure. It's kinda unrealistic to expect this level of coordination of SoloQ, even with voice comms. Limiting SoloQ players on their perks like competative players would need to be tempered by voice comms, but I'm not sure that is where I would want the default game expereince to go.

    This would breed a culture similar to that of world of warcraft where if you're not playing seriously or haven't "read the guide on how to beat this dungeon" then you will be the recipient of a lot of toxicity.



    EDIT: This idea might be a decent idea for SWFs, I certainly wouldn't mind this change when I'm in a SWF... but you'll get the same old "punishing players for playing with friends would kill the game" argument. I think thats a reasonable trade off myself. You get voice comms and the chance to coordinate your builds, in exchange for not being able to take the same perks. Gives SWF a little more of a competative flair.

    Post edited by UndeddJester on