Deathslinger...
Keeping it simple.
Hillbilly overheat mechanic re-worked in the PTB 7.5.0 and the live release. Deathslinger ADS rework/ removal? Can we get a PTB where he has no ADS time and see how the community approaches it?
Sounds bad and unbalanced on paper but give it a second chance in game.
Comments
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We used to have no ads time but it just ended up being the most effective way to use power was to tap m2 all the time to zone instead of go for cool shots with less time to dodge and it was just lame, I think they could reduce all the numbers on missing a bit to give him more wiggle room to play creatively, like reduce reload to 2.4s and miss penalty to 1s instead of 2.55s and 1.5s to give them more room to play in an interesting way
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If you mean bringing instascope back, then nah, that deserved to be removed and has no place in this game. Imagine if Huntress could just hold a hatchet up and throw it at any time while still moving at 4.4m/s. That's basically what old Slinger was, only difference being he needed to reel you in afterwards.
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@bjorksnas I remember the old days of Slinger. If we could bring him back though like he was but increase the penalty of tapping m2 significantly do you think that could work?
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old deathslinger was practically uncounterable in certain situations
quickscoping was stupid especially old slinger with monitor and abuse
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Never truly understood why they changed that.
I don't think Deathslinger really needed a nerf.
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huntress has bigger hitboxes on hatchets and has more ammo. deathslinger is too weak and needs Insta-scope back to be an attractive ranged killer selection. Saying that it has no place in the game is agreeing that deathslinger should be deleted from the game.
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Currently it takes 0.4s to ads and 0.6s to stop ads, I think for arguments sake 0.3s is probably the hard limit so people have an ok window to react to it and make it 0.7s to stop ads to keep it consistent like it currently is, idk about tapping to instantly have ads but id like to see them play with it a bit like this
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@bjorksnas I have posted another thread where I proposed the idea of re-working the Redeemer's hit box to something similar to the Nemesis' tentacle where you have little movement to drag the hit. I have had players run through the spear after I missed, I feel like they should get speared instead and I should have limited movement similar to the Nemesis' tentacle mechanic. What do you think though?
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I think spearing them might be a bit much considering you suposidly missed but I don't think they should get away scott free, maybe they get pulled ~4m in your direction for running through the reeling chain to offset distance lost or bring someone in for a hit even with a miss
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Old Slinger's problem was people abused his TR. He was only ranged killer with no lullaby. And his TR was 24m if i am not wrong. And people made it even smaller with M&A.
All of nerfs outside of that was just over-nerf.
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His TR was 24m an oversight when his range is 18m and monitor reduced it to 16m, but still being able to shoot immediately was also rightfully changed, you can't react to it and you could abuse the threat of zoning with no speed lost instead because there was no time between starting and stopping ads near instant to start and end.
just the first few seconds of this video is enough, look at that complete lack of delay of winding up the weapon and shooting, imagine in 0.2s you go from being fine to instantly being attached to a 40m/s projectile you couldn't react to or even try to dodge with no windup
I think the windup up is 100% justified but he should just be buffed a bit in other ways more than just remove the delay (I think the delay could be reduced from 0.4s to 0.3s but no lower and not removed at most)
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xeno has tail attack has 0.2 wind-up. I miss 0.2 wind-up slinger. Stealth ranged and lower wind-up is what made deathslinger a fun killer to play. if there was an add-on to reduce deathslinger base m/s to 105% but decrease wind-up to 0.2, I would use the add-on. I would care more about killer being fun to play then the killer being good at winning matches.
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I agree.
I never actually thought Deathslinger was a problem before. The change has always confused me.
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og DS was pretty bad 1v4 but was extremely oppressive 1v1 to the point where it sometimes made up for his poor 1v4.
Here are my two cents about DS.
Most players who say "Just dodge the bullet" don't get how FAST of a reaction a survivor must have to dodge a bullet because dodging a bullet means a survivor knew exactly at that very millisecond that the DS was going to pull the trigger which requires so much luck since he's zoning a survivor by simply existing.
Dodge? But he doesn't shoot? Easy M1. Don't Dodge? Easy shot.
Sure he was still vulnerable to being gen-rushed due to a lack of mobility or map control, but his chase potential offered very little counterplay unless you were in an indoor map and could hug the hell out of the corners.
Edit: I'd also like to point out how in some scenarios, the survivor would have to rely on the killer missing which means that some of his counterplay at the time was reliant on the killer's mistakes not necessarily the survivor outplaying the killer.
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I don't feel like the ADS delay really helps all that much anyway. Unless you're a pro survivor you're still just as vulnerable, so it makes Deathslinger less viable at the top but still a noob stomper everywhere else.
I'd happily give him back his quickscoping if he got an increase to his terror radius, or a significant lullaby. He shouldn't be able to reel you in from a point where you have no idea he's even in the vicinity. Trickster has a massive lullaby, as does Huntress.
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I don't think Deathslinger really needed a nerf.
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The way I see it, Deathslinger was an interesting character because loops were still effective against him, you just had to be more careful. He wasn't what I would call overpowered.
What truly impact's Deathslinger's strength are the maps, because when he first released the maps hadn't yet been ruined, so there were tiles and structures you could use against him. If he was to return exactly as he was, and we keep our maps as bad as they currently are, then he might indeed feel oppressive.
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I just want the character to be balanced, but yes it was fun when the windup was non existent and you could go for funny shots, also no slinger was never a 0.2s windup it was just no wind up you could instantly shoot, but id like to see them try 0.3s for a while to see if that makes him more fun to play
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No ADS time, but a longer reload time / heavier movespeed penalty when reloading?
With a more penalizing reload, the Deathslinger could also be allowed to move at 115% movespeed instead of 110% while his weapon is empty.
I enjoy playing Deathslinger, but if I get tired of missing shots or being denied reels and hits and just want to play him as an M1 killer, I'm out of luck (since he's too slow) and may as well camp the exit gate in defeat.
Trickster got a movespeed buff... (and he doesn't need to be out of knives either).
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Bring back qs
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Im gonna say something that idk if many people knew, but you can a 100% dodge slingers shots and be effective with distance.
As a diehard slinger player like 99% of the survivors I face are awfull and let me get snipes or dodge without me aiming at them.
When there is literally and audio cue when slinger aim directly at you, and yes it plays before he is able to shoot, meaning you only have to dodge when you hear the cue. On top of that the cue is perfectly hearable with the chase music playing.
The fact that do little people say this and keep parroting that slinger is a lose-lose situation when you dodge is literally impressive.
On topic of the the discussion, yes old slinger was better but current slinger is ok, is he a weak killer? Yes, if survivors are good, and since most players still die to meme killers slinger is more than good against them.
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The problem with no ADS time was that you could just spam m2 which would make it so survivor's lose a lot of distance. For some reason they chose to increase the pick up time for Deathslinger instead of the time to put down the gun or even just making deathslinger really slow while aiming.
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i do not think the shot was ever instant. The ADS time is same time as current xeno tail of 0.2. When his ADS was 0.2, you could still react to the shot because of the travel distance of the gun. It is just that survivors reacting to his gun took survivor skill and a bit of prediction. slinger needs easy access stealth and quick ADS time to have an identity. His current iteration has little reason to exist as a killer.
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I see people say the slinger nerf was justified because of insta scope. But in reality the situation is still very much there. Now its just hold M2 as the survivor looks back and zones themselves or you get the shot for a slighlty quicker down time.
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Right but it used to be tap m2 over and over and lose no speed while zoning them
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at mean at best yeah it was 0.1~0.2s but there is a difference between "predict" latency and be able to react to it if paying attention easy access to stealth was its own problem but id be fine if he had a 24m terror radius that couldn't be adjusted by monitor only undetectable
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Hey all,
With the new PTB coming out and the Billy buffs, the strange Blight buffs. It seems the devs are making more bold moves. Look at the Hillbilly's chainsaw overdrive mechanic now, insanely fast, or the built in J-flick for the dredge with some add ons or the infinite bumps until hitting a survivor. I believe the Dev's may rework the Deathslinger for the better or worse, depending on your POV.
I really hope the Dev's try it maybe even make the whistle audible when the slinger is looking at you from anywhere in the map, whether it is right behind you, or at the edge of the map.
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Also, isn't it weird that there has never been a Deathslinger challenge in any of the available tomes?
It's like the devs have forgotten he exists or they are aware of his disadvantage, making it impossible for them to provide a challenge that is not too difficult by default.
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We'll have to agree to disagree on this topic.
I used to play DS when he first came out and even though I didn't play him a lot compared to players like you, he was very oppressive even against competent survivors and I played on console. I would say I mained him until the Twins came out.
Dodging a DS shot will result in distance loss unless the DS is trying to be Widowmaker and snipe across the world or if the DS doesn't know how to shoot. He was such a good zoner that despite being a range killer, the closer he was to you, the deadlier he was. About to yeet the window? shoot. About to go through the pallet? shoot. Faking it was not as simple compared to a huntress with a much longer wind-up. It doesn't matter if there is an audio cue or not when the player can just spam the ADS and make the survivor paranoid as hell. Even if you manage to screw him up in a few chases, the deathslinger will probably know your mind games later on (speaking from experience). I've had my fair share of wins and losses with good deathslingers so I know how oppressive he is. His only weakness was a lack of mobility and map control which allowed for gen-rushing but his chases were not fun.
Deathslinger chases were almost if not always a lose-lose situation. It was Pyramid Head when he first came out until the devs had to address him too.
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