new Grim Embrace = old *incapacitating* Eruption
I can't believe you kept it the same as it was on the PTB. This is a new "jack of all trades" perk. I didn't even know about its vile combo with Dead Man's Switch. Why have you kept it like this? Survivors are gonna have at least 1 week of hell when this goes live. 6 months if you take as long you did with Made For This, to change it.
Grim Embrace blocks all gens 4 times per trial. That's very similar to old Eruption. If everyone's healthy, and 1 person goes for the unhook, at least 1 other person can't do anything for quite a while. Even if injured, unless they have a medkit or a self-healing perk, they will basically be rendered incapacitated . Remember this word? And how much the incapacitated status effect made the solo Q survivor matches miserable?
Why, why would you bring that back? Different form, but basically the same thing. The only change is that even SWFs can't counter this, unlike with the old Eruption, where they could call out going down in voice comms.
We already have Dead Man's Switch and Thrilling Tremors. These perks block gens, but survivors have a chance to play around them, depending on the skill, planning and luck. Against the new Grim Embrace, survivors can't do anything.
The current live servers Grim Embrace blocks the gens only once per trial, and only after you've hooked every survivor once. It's a good payoff, in my opinion. The new one is ridiculous though. Please don't make the solo q experience more miserable than it currently is.
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It'll be nerfed within a few weeks after we have fifty youtube videos showcasing how bad it is on live.
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True it will be nerfed soon!
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The developers gave Killers a new way of three gen. Block the gens you don't want Survivors touching for as long as possible to force them to work on gens outside of the three gen they're trying to break then kill them as they run around like chickens waiting for the Grim Embrace + Dead Man's Switch combo to end.
RIP Survivor queue.
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Apparently PTB, whose sole purpose is testing, isn't good enough for testing that we need to carry broken stuff over to live and test some more and make sure people hate the game.
And the fact that they basically announced "This might be a broken combo!" LOL. Yeah everybody will be running that now, thanks.
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This might be the worst Developer Update they've ever given us.
- Bizarre Onryō nerfs from the PTB that noone asked for.
- No mention of buffs to Alan's perks -- which are widely regarded as mediocre at best.
- Blight somehow being able to keep his infinite rush add-on (this one is truly baffling)
- And the cherry on the cake is the developers acknowledging that players found Grim Embrace + Dead Man's Switch to be problematic but have decided to do nothing about it.
Like ??? What is going on at BHVR ???
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I know, right. I really don't get how they're allowing all of this to come to live. 😭
And if we have to wait for months for the devs to change these things, it will really, really suck. :(
(reminder of how long we had to wait for the Made For This change, and the FTP + Buckle Up combo is still rampantly running loose.
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If they don't even touch Alan's perks slightly I'll be so disappointed. It just sucks. Just like Ripley's. Already forgotten.
Then they take months to years to come back to a perk for adjustments and when they do it's crappy like what they tryna do with Quick Gambit.
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From observation they're trying to slow gen progression as much as possible without directly nerfing gen repair speed. Otherwise that Grim Embrace and DMS combo would have never went live despite the obvious flaw.
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That's what I thought too. But they don't realize that the major problem is with the early gens. Many people have suggested implementing Corrupt Intervention as basekit, which would help a lot in preventing 2-3 gens popping during the 1st chase. Especially when you play Myers, Hag or Trapper.
My guess is that the new Grim Embrace is an attempt to fix that, but in my opinion, it is a very bad attempt. By the time you hook a survivor who was good in chase, 2-3 gens can pop anyway, and then Grim Embrace won't give you what you needed.
Grim Embrace however puts Thrilling Tremors and Dead Man's Switch (by itself or with Pain Res) into obscurity. Just like Buckle Up put WGLF and MFT into obscurity, because it does what they do, but better.
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I wish I had something positive to say I was very excited for this update. Everything for the most part was heading in the right direction.
There are definitely some changes they need to make to fix this update before it goes live, unfortunately I don’t believe that’s going to happen. It’ll be a few more weeks before the patch up stuff.
I believe they have good intentions, I just wish they listen to feedback a little bit more. I know they do pay attention to our feedback, but sometimes it feels like it’s overlooked.
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Just like a commenter above me, I think that the new Grim Embrace is an atempt to fix fast gens, but it is not just a bad attempt, but also a harming one, especially on solo q survivors.
The biggest problem have been early gens. 2-3 gens popping by the time your 1st chase is over. People have been suggesting basekit Corrupt Intervention to help with this, and I agree with them. It would be a very healthy change to the game.
Grim Embrace does not address this problem reliably - if your first chase is against a really good survivor, 2-3 gens will pop anyway by the time you manage to hook them. And not just that, people are now MUCH MORE inclined to run the broken FTP + Buckle Up combo, because survivors will now want to prevent the 1st hook from happening desperately. Flashlight saves? Nahhh. With the upcoming Alan's perk that hinders blinded killers, many more killers will most likely start bringing Lightborn. Flashlights will start becoming useless due to the increased Lightborn usage, so the FTP + Buckle Up combo will become even more rampant. ANYTHING to prevent that 1st hook that makes the survivors lose the game automatically.
And of course, not being able to do gens for a long time makes you useless. Unless you happen to have a teammate near you, and at least one of you 2 is injured and could use some heals.
How I would buff the current live servers Grim Embrace:
Keep it like it is, but once you hook 3 survivors for the 1st time, reveal the aura of the last survivor for 10-20 seconds, and make it ignore Distortion and lockers. That way you won't have a survivor just hide and ignore you, so you can get your Grim Embrace reliably. I have been running Grim Embrace for months now, and I absolutely LOVE it. It always catches survivors by surprise, it gives me neat pressure, and I can track down the obsession. It is not META, and it is fun. Perfect for me.
I don't think I'll be running the new Grim Embrace, because it's just awfully oppressive and unfair to survivors. It will also make Thrilling Tremors and Dead Man's Switch pale in comparison (unless you combine it with Dead Man's Switch, which will be another broken combo).
TL;DR
What I want:
- Corrupt Intervention basekit
- revert the Grim Embrace changes, and make it reveal the aura of the last survivor when 3 people are hooked - aura reveal ignores lockers and distortion
- rework Buckle Up so it doesn't pair with FTP unfairly, and so it doesn't make WGLF and MFT pale in comparison.
Thank you for reading <3
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I too was excited for this patch! Lots of good changes. However the STBFL is getting ruined, Grim Embrace is about to create another oppressive META, Buckle Up is getting untouched, and it seems like Sadako is getting the short end of the stick again. I agree, the devs seem to have good intentions, but they can be really stubborn in taking our feedback and implementing exactly what the majority wants. :/
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Sincerely, I don't understand how they artificially butchered some perk synergies that makes total sense to exist, but somehow something as logical as "Whatever triggers the gen block first is what stays" it's not in the game (yet, as if I have to bet that's what they are going to do to solve this).
Hoarder and Franklin's don't work with killer's items, Pain Resonance won't trigger in a gen blocked by another perk like Deadlock, but somehow triggering a gen block is able to trigger another gen block from a different perk. I mean, logic not found.
On the other hand, now that the gens have limited regressions having more slowdown perks that blocks the gen is something to be thankful of, and Buckle Up + FTP is still a thing without any signal of not being in the future, so...
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Weirdly enough I reported on the DMS/Grim Embrace combo and everyone told me it was inconsequential. Was I shocked to see it become a problem now.
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I agree with you.
And they also made Adrenaline Vial busted again.
They honestly need to just rework DMS. This perk is creating a lot issues.
Stacking with PR, issue.
Stacking with UW, issue.
Stacking with Friends Until End, issue.
Now Stacking with Grim Embrace, issue.
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Well, For the people + buckle up went live. So killers can have fun with Grim embrace now...
New 3-gen system is going to force gen blocking meta, so have fun about that.
It's really funny to say it is not supposed to affect general gameplay, when just it's existence will force different slowdown meta perks.
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Far as Dead Man's Switch goes, simplest solution that comes to mind, assuming it's feasible, is give Grim Embrace priority on activation.
If a Killer is using and activates both, Grim Embrace triggers first, THEN, after gens are blocked, Dead Man's Switch activates. That way GE kicking someone off a gen does not, in and of itself, trigger DMS.
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A rework of DMS seems overkill in my own opinion. Gen block is a pretty great tradeoff to buy some time without totally regressing generators.
I think the best idea is to make screams from UW not interrupt your actions. As for PR, I'm not entirely sure what to do since the explosion on the gen is what kicks you off and not DMS, and it has 4 tokens. Not to mention it only effects the gen with the most time, the other gens can still be finished if they were worked on.
Grim Embrace is an easy fix, just have GE be the priority block and negate any further block timers unless the survivors tap the gen to activate the last 10 or so seconds of DMS.
As for Friends Till' The End, probably the same idea behind UW.
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I don't know. Anytime we get new perk somehow makes survivor off the gen, DMS is stacking and creating issue.
Even it's not best counter, we have counter with PR. We are leaving gen until the survivor being hooked. But other perks removed all counters.
What you can do against UW? It will make all survivors scream and gens blocked. Now killer will chase one of them and other survivors can't do gens because they blocked.
And the sad part, this perk almost does nothing for weak killers but on killers like Wesker, Blight, Nurse... Yeah, it's not fun for sure
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At the very least, if UW removes the ability to make screams interrupt actions, the counterplay would be to split more on gens instead of focusing just one. Plus, you'd know pretty fast if the killer has UW.
I use DMS a lot in my VCR/DMS Sadako as a mindgame tool. By itself, it's not a huge problem if the killer has a weak chase power. Problem is in fact the synergies with other perks that pop up now and again. I think a better approach is to quell the harsher synergies.
That's even if DMS and GE are as oppressive in live as we all think. I remember making a post in the PTB about it when I came across it and most just kinda waved it off as a novelty because blocking a gen =/= regressing it, plus it only would work 4 times a match and be overshadowed by a 4 stack of GE and then rely on itself the rest of the game, and even if the killer runs PR that's out of tokens by the time GE gets it's full effect.
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I really don't want to suffer against the new Grim Embrace for the next 6 months 😢
I'm sure killers will proxy camp even more now.... Hook someone, then step away just far enough for Grim Embrace to Activate. Then Dead man's Switch activates as well. And when someone comes in for a save, down them and hook them. And then you get the broken combo once again. So *camping* is going to be very much rewarded now. I smell the return of camping Bubbas.... 😞
Very funny.... You hook and don't even need to go patrol any gen at all, because you know all of them are blocked. Pair that with Deadlock, and you're all set.
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The dev update is a huge confession that devs lack the understanding on how to handle feedback.You cannot explain this otherwise. People started telling that this combination is totally impossible to go live as soon as ptb patchnotes hit the board. Its shocking how devs handle feedback.
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Oh that's definitely gonna happen no doubt. So for now, I honestly recommend reassurance to be run more tbh. That will at least punish them for proxy camping. Or put in kindred to see what ur teammates are doing and if the killer s proxy camping
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look on bright side, at least they can't use excuse soloq excuse. Now they have an actual overpowered perk to nerf unlike weakening something silly like ultimate weapon.
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Yeah honestly, what will actually get rid of 3 genning isn't the regression event limits but the fact that GE+DMS+Camping will make it unnecessary to even kick gens. Hook cycle meta incoming.
Edit to add:
What's confusing to me is that you only have to look on social media, as well as the increase in survivors letting go on hook or DCing to see that enthusiasm/caring is severely lacking among alot of the survivor base currently. Survivor mains I follow on Twitch will play for a bit and consistently let go on hook because they're so miserable, until they just decide to play a different game. Survivors make up 4 out of 5 of the players in every game and it's confusing that the devs can look at something like this and think 'we'll just wait and see how miserable this update makes 80% of the players in the match' like alot of survivor mains aren't already holding onto the game by a thread.
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tunneling + deadlock was annoyning as hell last weeks. Thanks for giving killers an even easier way to more or less guarantee a 3k.
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I'm sure this will cure my survivor burnout.
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I really hope the devs undo the Grim Embrace changes, that would fix so many things. But again.... if we have to wait for *6 months* for them to change it, my survivor days might be seriously over. And I just got a P 100 survivor, so this is really sad 😢
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Okay, I get the criticism but I do not think that Grim Embrace will be as bad as bad as old Eruption. Eruption left you in a state where you could no do anything: No healing, no totems, no chests, no nothing. And it did that for a whole 25 seconds.
Now Grim Embrace only blocks the gen up to 4 times per trial for 12 seconds. You would need to hook 4 different survivors to end up somewhere near the value of 2 old eruptions (not even counting that old Eruption also did damage to the generator and 25 seconds of free regression to follow).
I am quit happy with the new Grim Embrace, however it should not combo off with DMS or allow the Killer to spot where the anti-facecamp is kicking in. This needs a tweak.
But overall I did not get the feeling of misery that some of you are talking about. If anything I like another perk that rewards the Killer for hooking different survivors.
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The perk does way too much. Blocking every gen up to 4 times, and there is nothing you can do about it. Eruption you could play around (although in solo q it was hard). You can play around Thrilling Tremors and Dead Man's Switch. You can't play around this, at all. Unless you're a cracked SWF that can keep stalling that first hook with sabo plays and/or FTP + Buckle Up.
I'm assuming you're a killer main who keeps having troubles with SWFs, and that's why you're so happy about this perk coming to live. You probably don't play solo q survivor, so you won't even feel the pain of the disaster that's about to come to the live servers.
I'll probably try a few survivor games, but after a few matches of not being able to touch gens for 80% of the match, I'll just ALT-F4. Blocking survivors from doing objectives is the worst thing you can do to them. Yes, you can still heal, but if no-one's injured, or you don't have an injured teammate nearby, you'll just be doing nothing. What a terrible, terrible design.
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