Twins are going to be insanely overpowered after the update
Listen I'm a Twins main. I love the uniqueness of the playstyle and I'm really worried about these changes.
With the new update Viktor will no longer attach after injuring a survivor, only after downing them. There's a major problem with this. Viktor is extremely fast and unloopable. The counter to his high speed is that he stays attached after injuring a survivor, which gives them time to recuperate while Charlotte comes hunting them for the kill.
This update means the new strat is just to stay as Viktor 90% of the time and you can double tap survivors with ease, then you just switch to Charlotte to hook them. I enjoyed playing Twins because of the synergy of constantly switching between Viktor and Charlotte, and this change will remove any challenge. I have no clue what the devs are trying to achieve with this change.
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Let's put the theory to the test first shall we? before getting into a conclusion.
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I worry the devs will try to balance it by making Viktor slower and giving him a terror radius, but that would ruin the uniqueness and fun of the playstyle and make him just like any other killer.
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I get they were trying to solve the Victor hostage crisis and the slugging issue with this change and to give BHVR credit they're very close to doing that they just need to do one thing with these current changes.
- Make Victor latch on every hit down or injure
There now it'll be harder for Twins to snowball and slug and survivors are playing a very dangerous game taking Victor hostage because Charlotte will be zooming around the map if the don't get rid of him.
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Theoretical counter is being near wounded survivor. From my understanding Victor can injure multiple survivors now, but once he tries to down someone he will end up latching which means your control is restored to Charlotte afterwards and you get 10% haste unless you hit someone. The problem here is if there's another survivor, then Victor can be crushed while being latched on downed player and that player can be healed before Charlotte gets there.
I believe you can't just injure everyone with Victor and then switch to Charlotte without having Victor crushed afterwards, right? So basically you can have everyone injured like Legion, but when it comes to getting downs and hooks Twins are now weaker unless survivors are spread and don't try to help to each other, which can work in SoloQ match but probably do nothing against SWFs.
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Exactly if they wanted to change the slugging playstyle all they had to do was make Viktor also attach when both injuring and downing a survivor, and give Charlotte a little speed boost when a survivor is downed. Instead they took a sledgehammer to the problem and completely changed the playstyle into some kind Legion 2.0.
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Ok I found the devs addressed this on Twitter. They're answer for how to counter Viktor after the update is simply to dodge his attack. However any good Twins player almost never misses with Viktor.
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I mean, survivors are just not going to heal if you keep playing as Victor. They are going to heal if you play as Charlotte.
This is not overpowered at all. Victor cant use perks to find people. And while true, its annoying for him to constantly search the map. Survivors will hide if Victor is out, tap on gens, hide in lockers if Victor is about to hit them so he latches on.
I agree that on paper she sounds stronger, but she is significantly weaker. The fact that Victor no longer gives killer instinct is already a huge reduction in power0 -
Being near a wounded survivor with Viktor around is just going to get the other survivor injured as well. Then Viktor downs one of them and Charlotte comes running with a haste buff for the hook. Mark my words if this change goes live Twins will be the most overpowered killer this game has ever seen, even more so than SM rework. Then if they have to nerf Viktor's speed to compensate it will turn him into Legion 2.0 and ruin the fun playstyle of why us Twins mains play it in the first place.
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Viktor does not need perks or scratch marks to find people. He's so fast that he covers the whole map in seconds. When I play Twins I'm not using Charlotte to find people, I'm using Viktor zooming around the map.
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So the counter is just don’t get hit bro?
Well, at least they’re giving Victor a terror radius. That’s something.
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Fun Fact: You will probably be able to camp a pallet and kill Victor with it after he hits you
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I'm extremely unhappy about that too. Part of the whole fun of Viktor was sneaking up on survivors and then latching on to them out of nowhere while screaming. It's extremely funny. It's just going to be generic now like Legion 2.0.
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can’t Victor leap over pallets? I haven’t played twins in a few weeks but I believe he can actually jump over them.
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If the problem was they wanted to fix the slugging playstyle all they had to do was make Viktor also attach when downing a survivor, and then give Charlotte a small speed buff when a survivor is downed to compensate. Instead they're taking a sledgehammer to the whole playstyle and turning Twins into something completely different.
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Yes, Viktor can jumpe over pallets and hit a survivor at the same time.
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He can leap over pallets, yes.
I mean you stand near an undropped pallet, he hits you, he's stuck in cooldown in the pallet stun zone, you drop it on his face and turn him to mush. You can't kick him but you can probably still stun him (which kills him anyway).
Probably a decent way to stop Twins from following up on an injure as a last resort.
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That's what I mean, everyone will be wounded at best but when it comes to downing you can now down only one person as Victor no matter what as opposed to old one where you could down only wounded people, but that could be entire survivor team.
The only question is will this 10% speed buff be enough to get there in time to have the downed target hooked afterwards.
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I don't see how this solves the slugging issue if that's what they wanted to solve, it just flips it around. Before Viktor could down multiple people while injured, but he could only injure 1. Now he can injure the whole team with no downtime, and then Charlotte goes around slugging the rest with a 10% haste buff.
If they wanted to solve the chain slugging all they had to do was make it so Viktor stays attached after both injuring and slugging, that's it.
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Not sure if it’s a glitch but IIRC he can also hit/injure even if the pallet ‘blocks’ him. It happens simultaneously.
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I mean during his post-hit cooldown, not his pounce.
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Charlotte won't be getting 10% movement speed buff unless Victor downs someone and latches on, isn't that so? So everyone is wounded but nobody is down and they can still try to crush Victor. You need to down a person, then you get switched to Charlotte and gain 10% Haste so long as you don't hit anyone.
Basically Victor's job now is to get injured as many people as possible. Then Victor should down someone and it's up to Charlotte with her perks and 10% haste boost to decide - go for another wounded target or pick up the downed one and get them hooked.
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Yeah, but Victor will have a sort of terror radius now, so survivors will be informed he's coming.
The problem with Victor was that you didnt know he was coming, and by the time you did, you were too late to get somewhere safe. That gives plenty of time to hop in a locker or run away (no scratchmarks seen by Victor). So if you dont have vision on survivors within 5 seconds of them hearing your TR, they can go somewhere safe.
Again, you're thinking too much of old mechanics with just the injuries/downs being flipped. Thats not the case. Victor is significantly weaker. Unless they add an addon that makes him undetectable for prolonged times.0 -
i suspect that will be main gameplay. twins might less fun to play because camping pallet will be new play-style to kill victor. The loss of ability to muti-slug survivor with victor for small reward of 10% haste for 20 second to be m1 Charlotte seems low reward for high loss.
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It's possible they will adjust victor's speed. We'll have to see in the PTB.
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Very true, killers that can injure a ton of survivors really fast are very strong. Legion has been a force to be reckoned with for such a long time.
Also I did play a lot of twins for like a year after they released, and I am genuinly curious what is interesting about using charlotte? She is just an m1 killer with tbf boring animations, she has no unique aspect. The whole point of the twins is victor, charlotte is just there to keep the standar killer gameplay.
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It's not just about being strong or kill rate, it's about fun. I believe these changes are going to make Viktor both less fun to play and play against. Since many survivors don't have much experience playing against Twins they have no clue what's coming if Viktor can double tap them.
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Devs wan't killers to win most of the time. 60% kill rate target minimum. You can guarantee the twins will be overpowered.
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I am like 99% sure this is whats going to happen either he will have a lunge cooldown and be slower or like op said its going to be extremely over powered but I think they want to go extreme and then go from there.
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Yeah, but the thing is, with Old Twins, you would go around, injuring everyone ASAP, and then use Victor to zoom around the map. Survivors cannot hide, since they are injured and thus give away sound. Not only that, wherever they run or walk, they leave a bloodpool.
With New Twins, Victor cannot find them as easily, and since survivors can pretty much run away and hide without being found, that gives them a lot more counter play. Sure, Victor could also injure them faster, but as long as they re-add the ability to crush Victor on succesful pounces, then Victor cant be relied on too heavily.0
