What do you consider "Off Limits" for Perk Design?
There have been hundreds of perks added to the game post launch, and despite this, numerous mechanics have been kept consistent across each trial. Some things I can think of off the top of my head are:
-Gen counts (a killer has never been able to functionally add another generator to the count or regress a finished gen)
-Hook stages (A survivor has never been able to regress their hook count)
-Exit Gates (A killer can't close a gate under any circumstances)
-End Game Timer (A survivor cannot refill the timer under any circumstances)
My question to you is which of these kinds of mechanics do you think should be on the table for perk design, and which do you think should be kept firmly off limits from manipulation?
Personally, I think things like Gen counts should be unchangeable, though Hook stages on both the survivor and killers side could be manipulated with the right design imo.
Also, a killer perk that makes it so finishing a gate opens the one on the other side of the map would be funny.
Comments
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i would say that Bloodwarden counts as closing a gate. Sure it is temporary but it effectively serves the same purpose as closing it for real.
Monstrous shrine and Reassurance both already affect the hook timer, and therefore stages as a consequence. Unless you mean skipping or adding a stage completely, which would be really unbalanced for both sides without heavy conditions and restrictions attached.
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I am referring to these more extreme methods, what restrictions would you consider viable to skip or add Hook stages? Would you be fine with a perk that closed a gate in such a fashion that it would need to be reopened?
I'm not necessarily advocating for this so much as I am curious about where people stand.
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Reviving a survivor lol, but it would make for a good invocation now that I think about it.
Something like Invocation: Fourth chance: After wasting 120 seconds doing in the basement gain a hook state. The next time a survivor dies they instead resurrect in the basement and are afflicted with the broken status for the remainder of the trial.11 -
I don't really see a perk being able to close a gate as being very strong.
Most survivors leave the gates at 99% anyway, the only thing closing it would be useful at that point would be to trap them so they have to leave. If you are just going to close it to reset the time to open it, it only takes 20 seconds to open it again, and most killers can't defend both doors at once when there are multiple survivors.1 -
It could make for an interesting perk, if you could switch hook stages with another survivor. Of course both survivors would need to agree and maybe it should make the survivor that took the hook stage the obsession just so that the killer can have some idea of what actually happened when they hook the other survivor 2 more times and they don't die.
There would probably need to be some additional upsides for the perk to be good but it could be a pretty interesting anti tunnel perk.
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I'd laugh if that perk just resurrected a bot
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Devour Hope is technically a manipulation of hook stages as it can allow you to instantly kill a survivor who was never hooked to begin with.
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True, the same logic could apply to Rancor as well.
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I want to push back on a hook stage perk. I'd love a perk where I could remove a hook stage on a survivor, and in return, I gain a hook state.
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Sadly, survivors cant get overly strong perks ever. Because we have to remember the potential of four of these perks being in a trial at once. Made For This and Mettle Of Man are great examples of this happening to disastrous effect
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Any Mori effect is technically a hook skip, though very few of of them are available before a Survivor was ever hooked before (Myers with add-ons if they ignore him building up, Pig if they ignore the RBT, Sadako if they ignore Condemned, OG iri Mori offerings, etc.); all Moris are avoidable and/or breakable, aside from Rancor's pity kill. On the other side, adding hook stages to Survivors by any means would be awful, since many non-meta Killers already struggle to get all 12 hooks against a competent team.
Even if a Killer could add another gen via some perk effect, they would, at most, be adding 90 seconds to the match if only a single Survivor touched it without perks, toolkits, and/or skillchecks; realistically, the existing final 3 gens would all already have progress made anyways and Survivors would simply finish those.
As someone else mentioned, closing gates would do nothing 99% of the time due to the 99% gate meta; Survivors would also be able to simply open them again, because there are 2 of them and they take under 20 seconds to open even without perks that can reduce the time to single digits. We also already have a perk that slows down the opening time based on Obsession injuries, a perk that blocks the gate switches based on number of unique hooks, and a situational perk that blocks open gates if you hook during EGC to give SWF more time to bully your EGC build.
With all that said, BHVR seems to have fallen into a groove of each new perk batch offering some form of gen regression/blocking/slowdown, some form of aura read, and some random utility perk for Killers, with Survivors getting a gen speed booster, either a haste effect or healing boost, and then a really weird utility perk that nobody uses past their Adept.
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Same.
A perk where; If the other survivor is on death hook, and you have no hooks, while healing them you can take a hookstage from them.
So it works once per game, and between all four survivors only a potential 2 times. (A to B, and C to D)
However, it should come in conjunction with allowing killers to see hookstages for each survivor on the HUD.
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It doesn't necessarily need to be strong, does it? Blood Warden is generally one of the most situational perks in the game, yet it's still popular among a specific niche of the playerbase.
With the right design, a Perk designed to close the door on survivors can absolutely throw a whole team off guard, especially since this would presumably be the kind of perk you don't suspect due to it's rarity, and it would synergize great with other Endgame perks. There'd be more of a reason to bring Remember Me over other perks with this in the game, so there'd at least be that :3
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The only thing I can think of is
1. Anything fun
2. Anything balanced
These have seemed to be off limits for a while now.
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Maybe any perk that completely disables a killer’s power. Like not a counterplay perk but one that actually grays out the killer’s ability to even press the button to use their power.
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My off limits perk design is already in the game. I don't think perks should regress generators or make filling a progress bar take longer. Strictly speaking from a gameplay perspective, not a balance one. Obviously things would have to change in other areas if regression and slowdown went away. But DbD should speed up IMO. Trials can be a bit of a slog.
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I remember that suggestion, was a great post. Was it you who created that as a discussion, or was that a random drop in a other thread?
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that would be such a good use of invocation actually
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No stun mechanic for survivor
No Mind control mechanic for killer or survivor
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I don't think I've mde a thread about it but I have suggested it before. Sure I can't be the only one though.
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I loved the bite sized dbd gameplay of My Little Oni. Felt like the regular solo q experience but condensed
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They should not make a perk that causes the victim's computer to explode. Maybe.
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