How do yall feel?
As a killer main, I personally feel like the gen repair speed is to little. One person on a gen is like 90 seconds I think. Plus you got perks like prove thyself and Deja vu to help lower that, and you got people bringing tool boxes. I hate it cause by the time I got 3 knocks all the gens are done and the gates are open. But I know people got their opinions so let me know yours.
Answers
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From the survivors' point of view, the generators take forever and from the killers' point of view, the generators are very fast and that's how it's been since dbd was created and I don't think it's something that can be resolved easily.
The truth is that at the beginning of the game most killers are at a disadvantage due to the lack of pressure/mobility and trying to create barriers to minimize this problem would make the few killers that are good at the beginning of the game more oppressive.
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Kill rates are currently astronomical, the game could probably not survive another gen speed nerf.
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Gens can definitely go quick, but there are strategies you can use. It’s worth mentioning that the repair time was actually increased by about 10 seconds fairly recently.
Are you new to the game? I’m only asking because with 12 posts, you’re new to the forum (and welcome!)
If you’re new, here’s my best advice:
- Don’t play to win, instead play to learn. Pick a killer you like and use the match time for practice. Personally, I’m having a blast with Hillbilly. He’s tough to learn, but oh so fun! If gens go really fast, oh well, just remember that they got stare at a circle and you got to practice chases. You’ve already won!
- Learn to spread pressure. If you’re chase goes by an active gen, sometimes there’s more value in letting the chase go so you can interrupt repairs. Getting around the map quickly to patrol gens is a huge plus (again, Hillbilly.)
- Focus more on quick downs. (Ahem, Hillbilly 😁) Get someone on a hook, and then do the hardest thing for any new player to do: leave the hook! Patrol gens and stop repairs. Someone has to get the save, so that’s already pressure while you’re out there starting new chases.
- If you’re learning a new killer, or trying to improve chasing skills, then the best thing is to be in chases often. If you have these perks, then here is my favorite “practicing” build: BBQ & Chili, Darkness Revealed, I’m All Ears, Nowhere to Hide. These are all aura perks. They help you to always be in a chase, but they don’t actually affect any game mechanics. That means anytime you win a chase, it was purely your skill! There are plenty of other information perks if you’re missing some of these. (Highly recommend Spies from the Shadows).
I hope this helps!
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Yo, actually I am relatively new. I just bought oni and have been merciless as any player should be. I haven't really got perks to make great builds so that's mainly why I'm complaining about the gen speeds. But thanks for the tips and hope your Billy game stays good.
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As someone who plays both, gen speeds are fine. Tbh? I could actually say balanced….apart from a powerful SWF team but that has always been a thing lol
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Overall, I think gens take way too long and they're absolutely the worst element of DbD gameplay. There's too much speed variance. Specifically, killers are capable of too much slowdown when 3 or 4 slowdowns are in play. I never thought gens needed to go to 90 seconds in the first place, and every slowdown should have seen a flat nerf to compensate at the time.
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It is and it isn't, most of time it isn't as fast as it feels, but there definitely is a time where entire team consists of gen jocky
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Solo queue survival rate was 38% last tie stats were released. That was before multiple killer buffs and map nerfs.
Yet its never enough for some people.
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I think gen speeds are fine for top tier killers but they can feel very fast for the lower tier killers who don't have strong chase ability so they aren't getting downs one after another. Its why I feel like stacking gen perks as Blight or Nurse feels very cheap, while I can understand it if you're playing Bubba or Trapper etc
The problem is that doing gens is the most boring part of DBD, so making them take any longer does not feel like a great solution for low tier killers.
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As a killer main
We could tell.
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Sounds like an ironic thread if anything, to be honest.
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I've played plenty of games where I lost 2 or 3 gens by the time I got my first hook and ended up winning, often without No Way Out ever activating, so I think gen speeds are fine tbh
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I reckon that's because the combination of different killer meta perks is stronger than it should be. When was the last time you saw a killer that ran no slowdown and how did that go? The difference between Pop + Pain Res and no slowdown is so big, that you basically have to use these perks. Other than that, your match can very well end in less than 5 minutes (with the use of an exploit, 4 minutes or less).
This might be manageable for a Nurse (though even that is debatable) but the average killer absolutely cannot keep up with this. Basically we are in a weird situation where we have Schroedinger's gens, that both go way too fast and way too slow.
The current slowdown meta has way too much synergy especially on killers that are already in a good spot. Compare the time Billy or Blight will need to activate and deliver their Pop + Pain Res and compare that to Freddy, Myers, Trapper, Legion etc.
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I'm a bit skeptical about how 'necessary' those perks are. IIRC, Hens and friends checked their winrate when they played 115% killers without using powers, perks or tactics, and they still won the majority of their matches.
It's possible that these perks, much like tunnelling, inflate MMR to a point where you're playing above your skill level, creating an illusion of necessity.
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Gens are too slow if survivors don’t have any clue what they are doing. But if they all have some common sense gens are pretty fast. All survivors need is one good runner and the other three stick to separate gens. And as long as it’s not nurse or blight you can comfortably have three gens done by the first hook. It honestly blows my mind that survivors lose as much as they do. Every once in a while I get a really efficient team and I’ll have three hooks by the time all the gens were done, I actually had a team do all gens in 5 minutes and 30 seconds and I only had one minute and a half long chase at the start. I still killed them all because they couldn’t stand the thought of me getting a single kill and kept trying to rescue each other. But that match put into perspective if survivors actually stuck to gens and played smart they could easily win the majority of their matches when going against A tier or lower killers. Besides ones that prevent heals like plague.
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First off, these players are considered to be among the absolute best of the best. So comparing them to a normal player is about as accurate as comparing an average group of survivors to Team Eternal.
Second, I remember Hens' video. Did you watch that? I don't mean to shame anyone but many of these survivors were bad. There were cases in which these survivors screwed up the most basic things. Like getting mindgamed around a tile where they could see the killer at all times.
The only video (that I know of) where Otz did something similar, was the one with 30s afk and no perks. And that started this whole controversy about streamers secretly deranking (which I don't believe). But it was obvious that many of his opponents again played on a level that was way below average. I consider myself to be a fairly average player but I consistently play against people that are better than this. So does Otz on his streams.
This was also before the 6.1.0 update in which killers were buffed to a 60% kill rate overall. Otz at the time had an average of 3.65 kills (91.25% kill rate). There is no way that this painted an accurate picture.
Lastly, my own MMR can't be boosted by slowdown perks. Because I don't use them (usually). But I also know that I lose by default when survivors reach a certain level of efficiency. There is simply not much I can do when the gens are done in less than 5 minutes. Even with survivors, that really aren't incredibly there is simply no realistic chance for a killer to consistently reach that level of efficiency (which is good!).
The difference between a meta build on a now high tier killer like Billy and a good but not amazing build on a lower tier killer is night and day. No matter how good you are, there is a limit which you absolutely cannot surpass by skill alone. And because a survivor usually is the one that has to react in chase, their counterplay is built around that. So most killers can't force hits in a timely manner because then, there would be no counterplay for the survivor. This also means, that your chases cannot be infinitely fast.
30 seconds is a really quick chase. But when you factor in the time for hooking, traversing the map and starting the next chase, then it becomes clear, that 12 chases total cannot go as fast as the gens can go even if you could somehow manage to keep your chases that short, which isn't realistic to begin with.
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With pain res and pop right now, gen speeds are definitely not too little
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How long you want a match to be? 40 minutes? 2 hours??
(This is a joke please don't take this seriously😅)
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How good Hens and Otz are matters less when you consider that in a normal game, you aren't perkless, powerless, or starting 30 seconds late.
Also, if MMR works as intended, you should be more likely than them to face that caliber of survivor. So I'm still not convinced that these perks are the sole reason killers are doing really well right now.
Also, that raw numbercrunching has never held up before, and it won't start holding up now. Game's too complex to just take base gen time and compare it to gen speeds. Killers are doing fine, they don't need yet more help.
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How good Hens and Otz are matters less when you consider that in a normal game, you aren't perkless, powerless, or starting 30 seconds late.
The comparison doesn't work. That's my point. Even with meta perks you don't get the same results. BHVR would heavily nerf killers as a response, if that happened. But they don't.
Also, if MMR works as intended, you should be more likely than them to face that caliber of survivor. So I'm still not convinced that these perks are the sole reason killers are doing really well right now.
Yeah. Without meta builds you get to a certain point but that's where you cap. With meta perks you can climb a lot higher. That's why the kill rates don't climb infinitely even if a killer is buffed or killer perk.
Game's too complex to just take base gen time and compare it to gen speeds.
Not really. You cannot take basic numbers to say much about balancing, that's right. But you can definitely draw a conclusion on what is and isn't possible. And 5 minutes matches are very well possible. The shortest full match I had ever played ended in just under 4 minutes. This is the absolute maximum that survivors can realistically achieve in terms of efficiency. You do not get anywhere that level as a killer. That simply isn't how the game works.
Killers are doing fine, they don't need yet more help.
That was not my point. My point was that killer meta perks have too big of an impact on the match especially when they're stacked. With a full meta build you are so much stronger, that you demolish a team you otherwise couldn't do much against. 2 things can be true at once. Without meta perks, many killers aren't in the best spot. With meta perks however, some of them become absolutely horrible to play against and most survivor groups lose by default.
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(Anyone got any idea how to make that > function work on mobile?)
"Without meta builds you get to a certain point but that's where you cap."
Is it? Because if Hens and the others can push past that cap, why can't anyone else? They're not bionically gifted, are they?
"This is the absolute maximum that survivors can realistically achieve in terms of efficiency. You do not get anywhere that level as a killer. That simply isn't how the game works."
Not really. Killers can theoretically close matches out faster than that, and sometimes do. Not to mention they can 'condemn' a match early too. If a survivor's out the game fast enough, survivors likely won't win.
"My point was that killer meta perks have too big of an impact on the match especially when they're stacked. With a full meta build you are so much stronger, that you demolish a team you otherwise couldn't do much against."
As evidenced by what, though? By what percentage does the killrate drop between meta builds and off-meta builds?
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(Anyone got any idea how to make that > function work on mobile?)
I think you're referring to the quote feature to highlight a specific statement like above?
If so, there's a paragraph button on mobile in the bottom left of the text box next to 'image' you can use, select the quotation mark ", and pick quote. It'll highlight whatever you type or copy/paste.
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If so, there's a paragraph button on mobile in the bottom left of the text box next to 'image' you can use, select the quotation mark ", and pick quote. It'll highlight whatever you type or copy/paste
Thank you kindly!
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Bring corrupt + pain res + pop like everyone else is right now and trust me this game is in one of the slowest metas gen speed wise it has ever been, ignoring exploits.
My public matches on both sides commonly end at 4 or 3 generators.
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Pop is the only perk that you said that is good. Half the time my scourge hook placements are so stupidly placed that I don't get to use it at all. At least with pop I get value, I would rather floods of rage instead of pain res.
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In time you'll learn the most efficient slowdowns to use (at the time). Pain Res essentially adds a 6th gen that needs doing (when utilized right). That's nothing to sneeze at.
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In addition to what's been mentioned, is like to point out They're in the process of making maps the size of match boxes. Looking at you New-New Haddonfield. Honestly if this is the direction they're going gen speeds are going to become very oppressive.
There is nothing in the game right now that gives survivors equal value to complete gens as there is for killers to slow the process down in my humble opinion.
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