Invocation Is Now a Must Run!
60 Seconds for 7 brand new parts is insane! If you don’t use this perk you are actually throwing the game lol. I’m going to permanently run it with DH, OTR , and SB. What do you guys think? Is it good enough now?
Comments
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It still causes the user to be permanently Broken, so I don’t know if it is good or not. Will have to wait and see.
Also how are you running DH with SB?
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I dont think so. You are still broken, so you are still making it easier for the Killer to down you. The Buff was needed, but I dont really think it will be enough of a Buff that makes the Perk worth using.
(But on the other hand, I think it would need to be buffed to be absolutely broken to be worth using, so I dont really see this Perk in a good and strong Spot while still being healthy anyway)
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You only get 50 seconds of value from it (2 gens stay uncompleted) and you get perma broken from it so I have to hard disagree
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BHVR proved once again they don't understand what middle ground is. It's either too weak or stupidly strong. Perk wasn't even that bad in swf.
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Sprint burst for back up when you don’t have DH like before being hooked. Or after if you miss it and the killer loses you. Since you only get it twice. I will say I’m not great at survivor lol but it’s what I figure has the best survivability
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Survivor that uses it will still get permanent broken the entire match though.
But considering Genrush is Survivor meta, maybe we’ll be seeing it very often in high MMR and comps.
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It's still not for me, but at the very least hopefully people won't get trolled by team mates for using it now. They'll probably get joined if anything
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But you can’t use DH with Sprint Burst because Sprint Burst will always activate when running.
You’ll never get Dead Hard to activate because you need to be running to use it, but Sprint Burst activates as soon as you run and exhausts you.
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grim embrace
Blocked generator can’t be regressed or progressed
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Dang lol you got a point I guess. I guess I’ll swap DH for DS since that’s still super OP and a killer will probably try to tunnel me for using it lol.
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it was garbage
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Edit: never mind, I see you already realized what I said. My bad, sorry for repeating what you already figured out
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Yes survivors please bring this perk! /s
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What? The perk is still absolute trash tier.
60 seconds, not counting travel time or interruption, for 50 seconds worth of gen progress and permanent broken.
Woo-hoo, what a great perk! Still the best Killer perk in the game.
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You cant use DH if you use sprint burst, it requires you to be running and not exhausted to use, and with SB you will always be exhausted while running.
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I am really glad that this perk is getting some love from the devs (or at least attempts at love).
I am glad that this perk got buffed, but I would like to add something to it:
[Nerf] Invocation: WS no longer becomes faster each time a player joins in.
[Buff] For each additional player that joins the invocation, the amount of charges that are retracted from all gens increases by 3 to the max. of 19 charges.
[Buff] Invocation: WS now applies to blocked gens as well.
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Yeah, this perk can be nice with SWF, as coordinated people will take advantage of the fact the invocation speeds up for every person that joins it.
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Territorial Imperative will finally be meta lmao.
In all seriousness it's a fine perk now but not amazing, you don't need 7 BNP you only need 5 so I wouldn't include the extra two in the math it's 60 seconds for 45 seconds worth of progress which is good for sure but I wouldn't call it meta just yet considering the price you're paying of being extremely vulnerable afterwards.
It might be slightly concerning in a SWF where if just two people run it it's 30 seconds for 45 seconds which is just good maths like that might be a bit rough especially with gen regression being nerfed but we'll have to see.
I would call it a 3 star perk with it potentially being 4 stars if the current changes go through to live.
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Lets be honest, its still a noob trap. 60s + time to get into basement + being one hit for the rest of the game for 50s if played right. The perk is a complete misconception in itself and will never be viable unless its OP.
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That's not how the perk works if im not mistaken. It's like a BNP, it doesn't progress gens, it lowers the charges it takes to complete the gens. So gen blocking perks won't affect this perk and will still lower the max charges.
Now to add opinion on the buff. Personally, Im scared of this perk now esp since most of Killer's gen regression perks are getting nerfs. Like I really don't know if it's going to be OP or not and need to see what happens but Im still worried. Everyone knows survivors with BNP can finish gens fast esp against low-tier killers and the idea of a 60s-7 BNP perk is scary to me. On top of that, this can be combo with BNP toolboxs as well reducing the time to do gens even further. If it gets too meta it just going to force killers to run one perk to counter it. As I know ppl say "Well it leaves you broken" So what? Good survivors are fine being injured all match long. It be like playing against a plague or legion where you just force on doing gens fast and get out as fast as you can. One survivor being broken esp if they are good isnt going to be that big of a downside for the survivor team.Either way, we just wait and see but I do think this perk is really scary and could be super meta esp in SWF groups.
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120 to 60 is a massive buff, especially when taking into consideration that teammates can speed up the process with you, might need further tweaks but we’ll see
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The benefits presume you pull it off. If you spend 50 seconds on it and the killer interrupts you, it begins to degrade (not to mention you give a free hit in the basement). Even at 1 charge at second it will wipe out. Those 50 seconds into a gen would degrade a lot slower and require the killer to spend time to kick it.
As a gamble though, now it can pay off where before it was just awful. Broken the whole match is still really harsh.
As a killer, if I was offered the trade of one survivor permanently broken, that survivor loses a perk slot, they can't do anything for the first 75 to 90 seconds of the match, but in return BNP on all the gens, I'd probably take that. It's not even counting the possibility there that I get the interrupt in basement.
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This perk is not good on anyone, it’s better to sit on gens.
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We did it guys, no mither meta let's gooooooooo
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won't get used. the reward is too low. the only thing about this change is that killer cannot stop the perk from triggering now.
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Why do survivors constantly bring brand new parts but won’t use a perk that is literally 7 of them? Yeah you’re broken but as long as you play super safe and W Key immediately it’s insane value.
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Because a BNP comes with a toolbox and no time investment.
Invocation still isn't even breaking even in time investment
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Bro, I think you miscalculated. I could still bring a toolbox with a BNP in addition WS that is worth 7 BNPs. And also your previous time calculation was wrong. It takes 60 seconds solo to finish the invocation, when that is effectivelly working on 7 gens at once which normally take by itself 70 seconds, not factoring in travel time between each gen and time spent avoiding the killer.
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It is still a bad perk, mostly for the permanent broken status afterward, and also if the perk beome popular the killers will just start to use Territorial Imperative which is a hard counter for the invocation.
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60 Seconds for 7 brand new parts is beyond a worthy time investment. Almost a whole Gen worth of progress that can’t be undone at all is crazy lol. You’ll see when the update goes live. I’m telling you it’s a great perk.
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Do you need to complete 7 gens or 5 gens? 10 x 7 is 70, but what is 5 x 10?
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I have yet to see a single SwF use this incredible perk though, how come?
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Except all 7 gens are technically valuable until the completion of the 5th one. As technically the "5th gen" you need to open the exit gates might technically be the 7th gen or the 6th gen in a given situation. As applying that effective 10% progress that can't be regressed by the killer also applies pressure onto the killer and makes it harder for them to attempt a 3-gen scenario. As the killer now has to deal with effectively 30% progression spread across 3 gens that can't be regressed.
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It's a MAXIMUM of 70 seconds, but likely 50 seconds.
This doesn't count travel time nor interruptions nor being Broken for the rest of the trial.
It is a CLASSIC noob-trap.
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I disagree heavy. We”ll see come the PTB. I think As long as the person who runs it is good at looping it will be good.
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2 of those brand new parts have zero effect on the game, so those doesnt matter. add the time you need to run to basement. while you can basically do a whole gen and are not one hit the entire match. its still a noob trap.
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More than likely :)
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That’s not true at all because of the killer is defending a certain set of gens then it won’t be as big of a loss to switch gens. It’s actually huge for breaking 3 gens as well. Not to mention you can stack actual BNPs on top of it.
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So what exactly is not true? Do your math, its not that hard.
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Not sure about must run, but when you're down to the last few gens a death hook survivor can just chill in basement and proc the effect.
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And as long as they don't get one of the many many many anti-loop Killers.
So yes, against someone like Sadako, this might be okay. Not good, not bad.
Against anyone with a modicum of anti-loop or a good Killer; the perk still harms your team.
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5 gens need to be done. Just because all 7 gens get 10 seconds of progress doesn't mean that the 5th gen that is chosen for completion somehow takes in all the remaining progress from the others, it will still take 80s. Meaning, in total you are getting 50s of effective gen repair done.
You mention 3 gen scenarios, well in those survivors often heal before committing to breaking a 3 gen since you don't want to go down and then get hooked in that same 3 gen which would create a nightmare proxy camp scenario. Guess what the invocation does to the one who completes it?
Let's not even mention the fact that any sort of gen blocking when the invocation completes makes it not even do anything to that gen which is frankly hilarious. You can have DMS+Pain Res block every generator and the invocation does literally nothing except permanently injure the survivor doing it.2 -
Not defending the perk but it's worth noting that it also makes all regression perks weaker by being activated, much like a BNP does. That's one thing I always see left out of these debates - every single regression event a killer has is worse, now, because it's all %based regression (with the exception ironically of Ruin, which will continue to regress at 0.25c/s) - PGTW, Pain Res, Surge, even the basekit 5% on kick, plus it takes less time to undo the regression because that's %based too.
The perk is still bad, but it's a damn sight better than it was, and while the maths isn't mathing prima facie it's still worth noting that you're also weakening the Quad Regression Randy's
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This small advantage simply pales in comparison to the fact that the survivor who activated this perk made their chases with the killer much shorter. Especially because the advantage of a speed boost and bloodlust resetting upon taking a hit cannot be overstated, the survivor gets a small opportunity to pick where the chase goes and go to a strong loop. As a permanently injured survivor you have no such advantage, you always have to stick to areas where there are decent loops in order to avoid taking a free hit in the back and a down. People are just looking at raw numbers and jumping to conclusions in this thread.
Can you try to alleviate this downside by playing for stealth? You can. It brings its own risks like encouraging tunneling or losing gen effectiveness due to excessive stealth.1 -
That's why I started with "not defending the perk", because it's still bad and the only thing that will ever make it not bad would instead making it gamebreakingly OP, which we've seen with who knows however many other perks. It's just a funky little thing that I never see get mentioned and wanted to say because I think it's a cool little tidbit of information.
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Yeah, fair enough, it's just that selective reading and cherry-picking are just rampant in this community so I can imagine someone making an argument from this that would go something like: "See, they nerfed gen regression even more with this busted perk that you now must run".
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I thought PGTW was the only one based off of current progress?
Like yes, keeping 10 seconds of a gen is kinda neat, but it's not super significant when you could be getting hit by multiple chunk regression (or blocking) perks.
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PGTW is based off of current progress, yes.
But Pain Res regressing 20% of a gen's total progress, which also scales differently if BNP/Weaving Shadows has been used on it, because the total progress becomes 80 charges as opposed to 90.
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Still a killer perk
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It's not just 50s, it's 50s of unregressable progress. There are survivors that run around injured all match anyways.
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