would a generator rework be a good idea?
doing gens is easy, and kinda boring, the chase is the heart of the game right? so why dont we make it so gens cant be worked on right away, and need a type of resource before repairing, could be gears, gasoline, power cords, etc.
some gens would just need 1-2 requirements and survivors need to scavenge the map for those parts, some could spawn in basement, or corners of the map, near lockers, and take the resource back to the gen, but since it would take time to look for and find the parts doing the actual gen would take maybe 20-30 seconds. (numbers can be adjusted) the parts would have multiple spawn points so killers cant protect the parts.
more items could be introduced to help out, or reworked. maps can show potential locations, keys could unlock a part behind a cage, etc. the goal is to make survivor feel like actual survival, while the killer is doing their thing. is this too drastic of a change?
or it could even be a game mode. thoughts?
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I'd have it as a game modifier first to test what people think. It sounds a fun idea, and I like adding mini-tasks. It may also mean reducing the gen times a little to compensate.
I think testing would be good first, as it's something that may need practicr first but, if it works out, could be fun!
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I feel that Gen times need to be adjusted one more time (perks and toolboxes but let's just focus on base gameplay first)
Survivors repair Gens at 1.0 charges per second = 90 seconds… 2 Survivors repair Gens at 1.7 charges per second = 52.94 seconds
Killers can kick Gens for 5% instant regression and .25 charges… I'm not sure on the numbers but it may be 300 seconds (give or take)
So maybe shortening the time Gens take to complete to 80 charges would be best (what it was before) then adjusting progression and regression based on 80 charge Gens
But yea I would want to try out your idea OP
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Like you said, they were previously 80 secs and atm the gens are flying. If anything the modifier highlighted how shockingly fast the gens can be done when killers don't have the usual regression perks. In nearly every one of my survivor modifier matchs the killer was overwhelmed by the gen progress, in my killer modifier mates they were going insanely fast. On the survivor side it was refreshing to not have your progress "erased" but on the killer side it felt awful to feel powerless against the speedy gens. There needs to be a fundamental balance here.
I do think there needs to be a fundamental look at survivor gen progression and regression perks. The OPs idea sounds very interesting and personally i'd love to try it. Complete gen rework.6 -
Gen rework or not, I agree with this sentiment. I always tried to play fun builds without relying on too much slowdown and gen progression can be optimized far too efficiently. Chaos Shuffle has just highlighted what I've been trying to say for a long time about it.
Even in my survivor games I can do over half the overall gen progress by myself with Stake Out/Hyperfocus against most low tier killers, even worse if I add a commodius+charge addons and Streetwise/Built to Last. With 4 survivors and a lot of resources, that shouldn't be a thing that 1 survivor has the ability to do reliably.
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Honestly I've always advocated for something like this, and have the items spawn in chests too, to make chest perks more than just a meme for both sides.
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In general I would love if the main objective of survivors was more than just repairing gens. Incentivising to move around the map more and do more interesting things.
The only concern I have is the disparity between solo and swf in those cases. BHVR would somehow have to find a way to add some form of other objective that swf survivors can't deal with easier thanks to communication than solo survivors.
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Feels like with how quick you can do the gens these days a lot of games you don't even get a chase these days
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It was also a thing in the lights out (minus the perks part)
And while it shouldn't be one Survivor doing all of the Gens… having all 4 Survivors doing Gens is also a bad thing (in a way)
But with the way Gens are right now… adding in more steps for Survivors will only make things worse
Adding in Perks like Corrupt, Deadlock and Grim Embrace (and to a lesser extent Thrilling Tremors)
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Honestly a soft basekit Corrupt is the only thing I can think that could help ease it a bit, but even then how do you justify it when killers like Nurse and Blight exist? They get downs far too efficiently and are usually the best counter to gen optimization already.
But yes, out of all our options that may be the best because of the killer power differences.
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I was thinking of giving an additional effect… allowing Gen blocking to last 5-10 seconds longer (like Lethal Pursuer) to Corrupt
But then again we do have to think of everything before they get the idea…. Yes Nurse and Blight cause problems and so do a :try-hard" SWF… and Killers like Trapper, Freddy, Ghostface and Pig have their issues also Solo Survivors have their issues that will cause an uproar
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Map rework and anti-loop killer.
Now we can't chase, so rush the generator.2 -
Also technically Totems are a secondary objective….
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I don't think this is the way to do it though.
BHVR always takes the simpler route, and it would be better to do that then do something that fundamentally reworks the entire game.
The simpler solution is to do what they do with killers, where they nerf the addons, and buff the basekit.
In this case, nerf the perks, buff the basekit.
I would suggest:
- Cut most gen regression/defense perks to around half of what they are now (minus the bad ones like ruin and merciless storm and such)
- Buff basekit gen kick regression to 10%
- Buff basekit regresssion to 200%
- Add a basekit corrupt that lasts 20-30 seconds
- Add a basekit corrupt on hex totems that lasts 20-30 seconds.
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Depending on the design, you have two possible problems.
Parts spawn randomly: The game becomes heavy RNG. Maybe the survivors find just the parts they need on the first try, in which case they likely win easily. Or maybe they get unlucky and don't find the part for quite some time, resulting in an easy killer win.
I don't have a problem with lots of random chance elements, but that might go too far.
Parts spawn in predictable ways: You get the TCM problem were it looks exciting at first, then people just perfect the possible paths. Then the games loses its luster for a lot of the player base.
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To my understanding, BHVR once did test the idea of secondary objectives and did not think it worked.
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the chase is the heart of the game right
In current state of the game with small maps, weak tiles and gens next to each other?
Absolutely not
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I don't disagree that they're getting away from this, but the game was more fun when chase was the focus.
The current game is consistently sacrificing anything even remotely interesting for competitive gameplay.
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Could work, but would need severe Rebalancing, probably better as a seperate game mode.
Overall I would prefer gens to just have a different mini game instead of skill checks, just something you can do while doing gens that is a bit more entertaining...
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Why not make the gen repairs a mini puzzle games?
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Yeah I like this idea, could make gen items the same slot as killer items maybe/make a new slot for objective items
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My idea from awhile back is that every 25% of a gen would require a part to be installed which would have to be found. After the part is installed, that progress is "locked in" and cannot regress under that threshhold.
For example, if you repair to 24%, then you'd need to install a part. Once done, the gen can no longer regress under 25% and repairs 26-49 can begin. Once you get to 49%, another part must be installed. Once installed, then the gen can no longer regress under 50% and repairs towards 74% can begin. Same for 75%-99%. Once you get to 99%, one final part is needed.
This acts as both a slowdown for the killer, but also protects gens from getting regress dumped for the survivors. Helps both sides.
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I'd like to see a major change. Otherwise increase the gen time to 120 If they are going to keep adding gen perks and nerfing gen control.
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There really aren't that many small maps, and most maps don't have that many weak tiles either, but a fair amount of strong tiles. Maps have simply become fairer finally, that's it.
So yeah, chase is definitely the heart of the game.
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120 seconds? What? That would be so overkill, gens are fine at 90 seconds.
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I'd be fine with longer gens if they were more interesting to do... More minigames and such...
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I wouldn't mind them adding optional GTA hacking style mini games, basically you can activate a mini game on a gen and it gaves you a simple puzzle like connecting wires or something, if you complete it the gen gains 5% progress or something if you fail or get interrupted the gen pops and regresses. I'd be high risk high reward especially since the mini games would block the survivors screen making it risky to be grabbed. of course this would all be optional to the survivor to do.
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I like gens. When I get too stressed out as killer I switch to survivor and hold m1 for a while. It's nice.
I also like the macro gameplay of defending objectives and finding survivors. Chase is fun, but it's only part of what I enjoy about the game. Exercising macro knowledge is a big part of what I enjoy.
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