Problems where survivors give up and commit suicide
I mainly play as a killer, and I think this is a serious problem even from a killer's perspective.
Especially if it is done early on, it will have a big impact on other survivors.
Even those who are trying to put on a good match will be unable to do so.
I think we should either strengthen the reporting system for people who intentionally lose, or if that is difficult, we should take measures to significantly reduce BP if they lose by suicide.
If you are forced to give up on a match and want to advance to the next match quickly, it may be a good idea to introduce a system that allows players to surrender, for example.
These measures are not perfect and can cause problems.
However, I think that we should take measures, no matter what method we use.
Unlike Killers, Survivors require four people to work together.
If the Killer gives up, it doesn't have that much of an effect, but if the Survivor gives up, it has an effect on the allies who are trying to win.
I've seen many cases where someone commits suicide in a match that could have been won by the Survivor, even from the Killer's perspective, and the Killer ended up winning.
There are many good survivors who fought to the end even though they were certain of losing.
They always go unrewarded.
You should consider whether something can be done about it.
Comments
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One of the reasons why survivors suicide on hooks is because solo queue can be quite rough at the moment. Not as bad as some people make it out to be, but rough never the less. But I do agree that suiciding on hook can be problematic, because survivors sometimes suicide for the most ridiculous reasons.
But suiciding on hook is a feature in this game at the moment, and I am not sure how much sense it would make to punsish someone for using said feature. I also doubt survivors that suicide early on care about the BP, this idea of reducing survivors BP if they suicide would rather hurt those survivors that suicide after the match is already 100% lost, like when there are only 2 survivors left in the match.
I think one thing that might help encourage survivors to stay in the match towards the very end despite things not looking good is to improve their BP gain. Right now, it's not as good as the killers on average.
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I'll openly admit, I die on hook often if I feel it's a toxic match, especially lately as soloQ with chaos shuffle which has made these issues much worse. If it's straight to hard tunnels, proxy camps, hook hits and slugging at 4-5 gens I peace out gracefully. I'm here to enjoy the game and chill, you wanna sweat, sweat with the bot.
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But that's the whole problem: when Survivors "go next" on 1st hook they DON'T leave a bot behind. It's just the same as before bots existed and the game is basically automatically lost for the other Survivors since a 3v1 early (4-5 gens) is basically guaranteed 4k.
Tunneling and sweaty playstyles (partly caused by every other options being either weakened or removed over time, which narrows Killer, perk and playstyle variety especially for weaker Killers) make Survivors go next to avoid the DC penalty very often which ruins the game for everyone.
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@Skillfulstone: 'which ruins the game for everyone'… just for you though, as their match is already lost apparently. But avoiding the DC in this way is allowed so… they use & abuse of it…
To complain about that is just to prove them right…2 -
What do you mean "at the moment"? It's been way more difficult in the past. The activity HUD is a huge boon if you apply game sense to it.
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The activity HUD is fantastic but that doesn't mean solo queue doesn't have it's rough edges. One is matchmaking, though that can't be fixed with balance. Another problem that I believe solo queue has is the bad survivor tutorial, it would be nice if more survivor players knew how to actually play survivor.
Last but not least there is still a noticeable gap between the information swf can work with and the information that solo survivors can work with. In my opinion the gap isn't as big as some people make it out to be, but it surely exists, and it would be nice if solo survivors got a few more information buffs, such as kindred basekit.
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Yeah, all that stuff is true. But why "at the moment" when solo objectively has tools they previously did not. At the moment implies that at another moment it was better, but it categorically was not. Unless you have forgotten that base BT used to not be a thing, bubba used to be able to just sit on top of your hook, you can see what your team is doing and make informed decisions based on that or that you used to just be able to be taken out of the game after one hook.
Solo is the best it's ever been, people just don't want to hear it because their solo teammates are never going to do the stuff they want them to do. People do things that make sense to them, not you. Whether or not that's the right thing to do is up in the air, but that's how humans are.
Base kindred is more handholding that I cannot get behind. You can determine what your team is doing and whether you need to save via the activity HUD.
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I would argue there were times where solo queue was easier, when the game used to be massively survivor sided.
Base kindred I do not see as handholding at all. It would simply give solo survivors information that swf survivors have. The survivor hud certainly helps in situations where a survivor is on a hook, but it's not as good as information that swf have via communication.
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This is why I am so hesitant when nerfs come out to break perks survivor uses based on swf use. Great you make the game even more fair against Swf teams but when you play Solo Q players your win percentage probably jumps 20% or more.
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So many winning games are consistently thrown by someone just going next
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They need to do something about tunneling especially off hook and maybe the suicide on hook rate might go down also the proxy camping is an issue. They need to tailor the anti face camping and anti 3 gen to the killers individually or they need to make it so hooked survivors are transfered to another place on the map. What they are doing with 2v8 should have been done woth the hooks in 1v4.
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At the very least the posibility to unhook yourself by chance needs to be removed.
- 4% is still 4% that can win or lose a game for the killer
- It will remove the posibility or someone just killing themselves faster
- Perks like deliverance can still work
At least its a start.
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They will get downwd and bleed out and be useless anyway. Removing it will just make it so they will run into the killer and not allow anypne to heal them. Seen this happen also they gerif and throw as many pallets as they can. They need to address the killers tunneling off hook and proxy camping the hook with their powe and the anti 3 gen ( I know has nothing to do with this but I feel the same with this )
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I know, thats why i said "its a start", i know its not going to solve everything.. i just think that the 4% chance of unhooking yourself should not exist anyways, as those things can sometimes carry you, and even if the percentaje is so low, it can still happen.
But about the tunneling/camping, i know its always a hot topic, but i never see people mentioning one thing: there are times where you absolutely need to tunnel someone out asap. I see everyone wanting the tunneling or camping removed (and i understand why) but sometimes is just necessary to do it.
And no, of course im not talking about the "tunneling at 5 gen", but if gens starts getting done fast and everyone is still alive, if you dont kill someone fast you are just usually shooting yourself at the leg as a killer.
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I'm not sure if the translation is correct, but if you're talking about killer tunneling, it would be better if they removed the weakening of the delay perk.
From the killer's perspective, tunneling is often the only way to win (or rather, the only way to avoid being provoked).
Killers also want to enjoy the game regardless of winning, but the current situation is that they have no choice but to do so due to the repeated weakening of perks and killers, as well as the large number of boards and windows on the stage.
(Tunneling doesn't necessarily mean you'll win, but conversely, it's a level where you can't win even if you tunnel)It's especially tough for intermediate and below level killers.
So if killer tunneling is the cause of hook suicides, I think reverting the perk nerf will be a bit better.
It won't eliminate it completely, but it will be better.2 -
Rather than punish players for wanting to leave a match, which ultimately almost always punishes those that stay behind, how about removing the disconnect penalty and allowing players to leave a match gracefully (sending control of the survivor to a bot) rather than them feeling the need to leave by dying on hook prematurely.
Playing with bot survivors is much more preferrable than playing without said survivor that intentionally died on hook. Bots are getting better and better with each bot logic update.
The other problem you run into, is when a player is in the middle of intentionally exiting the game while on hook, other survivors will quickly run over and get them off hook (intentionally trying to force the player to stay in a match that they no longer want to be in, especially if the other survivors are being toxic), which almost never results in a player participating in a meaningful way in the rest of the match anyway, and quite often results in the player intentionally "throwing", by either making the match difficult for the other players by attracting the killer with intentional noise, or body blocking the player that got them off hook, or just standing there and not doing anything the rest of the match.
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Honestly reasons doesn't matter, it's literally throwing, a toxic behavior, killing the game and harming the community, don't see the reason to not disable the feature
SoloQ is so miserable thanks to all those who don't even participate in the game, despite the fact they literally pressed "ready"
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this game need a casual mod, where you dont rank up.
I dont want to play every game like this is a tournament, maybe player will not leave if we have a chill mod without slug / camp / tunel autorised ( and ofc we need to balance the mod for killer , because the urge to kill someone in 5 minute is legitimate to win)1 -
As killer i rarely see give ups but i see a lot when i am survivor an i notcie some of them actually plan to give up before the match even starts they spawn in an driectly run up to the killer no matter who it is to be downed an hooked an if you unhook them they dc.
other survivors i notice give up when we are winning. Killer has 1 or 2 hooks there is 1 gen left an someone goes down goes on first hook an they instantly give up.I want to play the game but so many people load in to instantly want to leave no matter the map or killer even when winning people want to leave. The bots are terrible some of them don't even move they won't do anything inside the terror raidus they rarely save people on hook they rarely heal you most of them lately are just in corner of the map not moving.
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Regardless of whether you are motivated or not, according to the rules of this game, rescuing (unless it is an impossible rescue) is the right thing to do, and it is not good to point that out.
Even if it is an impossible rescue, such as when the killer is nearby, it is just a lack of judgment, and the rescue itself should not be considered an issue.
The problem is when the rescued person does something annoying.Of course, there are people who intentionally get found by the killer and do an annoying rescue (although I have not seen much of that).
How can we protect good players from bad players?
If the current reporting system could be made to work better, it might be a little better...
Or, if players could avoid matches at their own discretion, or if they could block bad players for a certain period of time, it might be a little better. (Overwatch 2 might be a good example of this.)It is good to have high-performance bots, but on the other hand, there is a risk that they will use the bots as an escape route to accelerate their behavior.
If bots are okay, there is no need for human-to-human combat.
(It seems that we may eventually move in the direction of reducing waiting times by making the killer a bot.)The good thing about disconnection penalties is that some players will be saved because they will not be matched with that player for a while.
The bad thing is that it has a big impact on people who are unintentionally disconnected due to communication problems, etc.As a killer, I think it would be nice if there were better rewards for good survivors.
Or maybe there should be a system that allows you to withdraw from the match in the first place. (Identity V is a good example.)
If you can withdraw from a match when it is determined that neither the killer nor the survivors can win, the match can move on a little sooner.
This would also be a good feature for the remaining survivors who end up fighting a killer who is trying to wipe them out.0 -
Intentionally causing a player to stay in a match that they are trying to leave is, at least in my opinion, griefing that player. Regardless of whether their actions reduce the playability/enjoyment of the game for the remaining survivors. Again, that is my opinion. I am quite sure that others feel that way based on reactions/actions of the "saved" player both in-game and during post-game chat. I know if I am trying to exit the game while on hook, I also get irritated at the survivor that unhooked me while I am in the "missed checks" phase 2 after "taking my chances". I see this as both player and killer. And I see it in a fair number of matches.
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