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Ridiculously Killer Sided!!!
I've played this game for years now and have always been a survivor main. I've had ups and downs for perk changes and that has been fine. Now it's just so stacked against survivors and I have no idea how they would get any new players on survivor. To be fair, I'm mostly a solo queue player and I honestly dont really play meta perks. I'm making my own builds, trying to just enjoy a game the way I want. Killers have been buffed and have perks that there is no way in hell that my builds or ability can allow me an equal chance of winning. The game has been completely skewed towards killers for awhile now and my breaks have just increased in duration. I worry for the state of the game and it's ability to draw in players when the odds are so heavily stacked on one side. People can say that it's my fault because of my play style or whatever but my point is that it has become increasingly less enjoyable for me. Players on the killer side have gotten there way for far to long. The voices of the few should not outweigh the many.
Comments
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Good luck, the forums are full of coped out their mind killers. The truth is no one cares about solo survivor, and if you play by yourself. The best thing you can do is go play a different game like this.
BHVR does not care about you or even acknowledge that you exist.
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Playing only one side even if for years will hinder growth at a basic level. Learning each side improves you as a player for the side you prefer to play. As a person who it closer to 60/40 between Console and PC who has also played for years. I will say i drastically improved by playing both sides. Pathing, Hiding Spots, Odd little auto aim abuse spots, Techs to push both killer and surv play to a better spot than the day before. They have hundreds if not thousands of guides for ideal pathing/looping/techs. Even after all the buffs to killer and perks. I still do not think killer is better side in terms of power level. I will say right now the game is more balanced than it has ever been.
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Did you know killers recently got a bunch of their best perks nerfed? At some point it's not the strength of the killer that is the problem.
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They got nerfed for a reason, maybe kill rates too high?
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unfun games
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regards what killer nerfs happens there's always going to be people complaining killers are too strong.
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You see the problem, don't you? You don't run meta perks but you play against people that do. That already puts you at a significant disadvantage. This is sadly a huge issue on both sides. Trying to get value out of some obscure builds is only going to end with you losing no matter which side you play.
I agree, that survivor content in recent years hasn't been great overall. There were a few maps and perks that were absolutely broken (reworked Boil Over, MfT, CoH, Garden of Misery, Borgo) but aside from these things, which the devs mostly dealt with, it hasn't been great. Many perks that were dead on arival, map reworks like Haddonfield, that are absolutely terrible and a bunch of killer buffs (that were mostly needed) have definitely taken a toll on the survivor experience. I think playing survivor is still fun but I hope that the devs will soon release some nice perks (like Nic Cage's) again, that people will actually enjoy using.
The main issue this game struggles with is that it's incredibly difficult to find the middle ground between balanced and fun for both sides. When kill rates were closer to 50%, survivor queue times took forever because the overall experience as a killer was pretty bad. Now we're slowly going towards the opposite end. I honestly care much less about the results than the match itself. But even that is very inconsistent when you play solo queue. Sometimes you have pretty decent team mates and everything works well, other times you lose against a Pinhead on Garden of Misery because you constantly have to get the box while 2 of your team mates run around looking for totems and the last is in chase. Now which of these games is more memorable?
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It is a simple fact you can't balance an asymmetrical 1v4 game to the benefit of each individual of the 4. You will never have the same chances to win as the 1.
The biggest problem is that the 4 never win together as a team like in other team based games but each individual loses by themselves.
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The target kill rate is 60%, so killers win 1.5 times more often than survivors by design. Some killers even reach as high as 70+% kill rate, and it goes without counting games where some DC'd. And you can guess who has to put up with the majority of those planned losses among survivors: soloQ players, of course.
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I'm pretty sure they stated it was because of the pick rates.
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Agreed, they wanted to nerf the meta perks
Pain res is still and will still be the most used perk in the game
As for op, no, its not "heavily killer sided", sure its more balanced than when you could abuse good ol dead hard and it must be a shock to actually have to play the game with less unfair advantage
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This game was brutally survivor sided for the first 6 years and is just now starting to be balanced out. Killers have finally become the power role and people don’t like that, because survivors used to be the true power role.
Even so your perks have never been and should never be rivaling a killers perks. Killers get 4 perks and survivor SWFS get 16 perks. You use teamwork and perk synergies to make your perks equal in power.
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Overpicked.
Pain Res will stay, because its something that gives you a help by doing your main objective. Its kinda like when Survivors finish a gen, they get a 10% Speed-Buff for 60sec at the next gen. Thats how PR kinda works. Thats why its good.Lets be honest: You simple cannot rely on the weakest Hex:Ruin ever, the weak Call of Brine or the "over-cooldown" Oppression.
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It certainly feels like the game is moving towards favouring the Killer side at the moment. Killers have had a ton of very significant buffs in recent patches, as well as 4 pretty strong Killers released in a row (Singu is also a very strong Killer if they know what they're doing). Meanwhile Survivors get a fun meme lute perk and MFT nerfed into oblivion. And when they do buff Survivor aspects of the game, they tend to be buffs that help already skilled players (or require Survivors to be able to make co-ordinated plays in a SWF), whereas Killer buffs will usually benefit players of all skill levels. There's been nothing added to the game for the average Survivor player for quite some time.
As a casual Solo Q Survivor, this side of the game has become significantly less fun to play.
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This is how killers felt for 8 years btw.
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The game historically favored survivors over the average killer. Old maps, items, etc. were mostly in the survivor favor if played well. You just didn't notice cause you weren't that good back then.
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The forums really aren't full of coped out of their mind killers. People who believe the game is balanced aren't immediately killer mains. And the devs do care about solo survivor, they just don't do enough for the role, that is true.
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I think the kill rate was around 50-55% for most killers before 6.1. Average might been exactly 53% which sounds fine on paper but suicides for example inflated that so match where survivors tried they had better chance to win. Probably perk like noed carried many killers too. Playing agains't dead hard was terrible back then so I think that made players not like playing killer.
Now kill rate seems to be in 60-65% range and that seems little too high. Because soloQ is the side who suffers most. Many maps have been nerfed and made smaller to give m1 killers chance. If gens don't get done quickly the match is lost as resources end quickly. Maybe it would be good to test balance around 55-60% kill rate that might make it more fair and add some of the weaker maps more pallets or something.
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Did you play any survivor during the painfully boring eruption meta or ruin undying copy and paste that killers always did?
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You realize that new players are always going to do badly? And it's not as if the killers who are just starting out are playing their best either (important when making balance judgements). The only thing stopping new survivors from stomping those killers is a lack of teamwork, skill, and experience. And that's amplified at the top level, where a lot of the time if you're not playing Nurse or Blight, you're not getting more than 2 survivors, guaranteed.
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I didn't see anything wrong with those metas. It was a refusal to adapt, and impatience on the devs' part, that led to those metas getting swiftly and unfairly nerfed.
Eruption could not hit you unless the killer took the time to not only kick all the gens you're working on, but also down someone before they were completed. If you got hit by it, so what? The time you spent progressing the gen was way more value for you than the regression and Incapacitated the killer got. The average player would lose to this of course, because they've never had an incentive to strategize or get better, so the devs nerfed it even though capable teams could just crush killers using this "OP" perk. It's exactly why I hardly ran the perk when it was at this peak, because I could see it was a perk whose only use was noob crushing, or providing a bonus to you when you'd clearly win the match anyway.
Ruin/Undying was super healthy for the game, because it provided slowdown either in the form of breaking totems, which also countered NOED and other hex perks, or rewarding the killer for pushing people off gens instead of camping and tunneling. Either way, good teams could deal with it. Counterforce was also right around the corner; they should have just waited to see if that perk was a good counter. But no, they had to nerf a great and rarely seen hex meta because people kept crying about supposedly getting the worst possible roll on the totems every time. If so, why didn't they just do the gens instead of worrying about the hexes? If I recall correctly, Ruin was about as slow as regressing the gens as it is now, so why aren't people complaining about it now? "Because Undying made it stay up all game." It could stay up all game now and would be a minor inconvenience to the survivors! Instead of doing gens to 15% and then leaving them over and over again, which is what survivors do with this perk even though that's what gives it its max value, they should focus on 2 gens at a time so that no efficiency is lost, because the killer can't be in 2 places at once.
I know this wasn't mentioned, but I laugh whenever I see people reference the "gen kick meta." CoH and Overcharge, you know. The outrage over that "meta" signifies that the average team cannot or will not handle a minor inconvenience brought on by a killer's perks. They cannot handle a killer kicking gens, a base function of the game. Even though that meta required the killer to kick gens (waste tons of time) and hope that survivors won't tap it or finish it (wishful thinking), that was too much for the average survivor. They just leave gens to regress for minutes at a time, can't commit to a gen which was nearly finished, and yet blame the game for being too killer sided. This is what we're balancing for. Can you see the issue?
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Honestly, I would be okay with making it so you can only try to unhook yourself, if you have a perk associated with that mechanic. Think about the amount of times you actually tried to unhook for a good reason and you managed to do it. You can probably count all of those times on one hand. I also don't see a problem if the struggle mechanic were to only show up if you are 1 of 2 people left, or everyone else is slugged. That would kill 80-90% of people going next, you would still have people dcing but at least you get a bot now.
I think at that point you would start to actually get a good sense of why people are leaving games though. I know that the forums would tell people to just stop being "toxic" and giving up. But there are at least 3 killers I can think of, where I would rather drink bleach than play against. Dcing is just as much on unfun game mechanics, as it is on "toxic" survivors.
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Best advice I have is play survivor with at least 1 friend or just play another game. SoloQueue is the worst its been, and is only getting worse.
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First of all, serious question - do you play killer at all? If not, maybe actually give it a try for a while and then form your conclusions. There are so many people on the forum that say the game is skewed one way or the other, and most of them have probably never played the other side. I really don't have any respect for those opinions.
2nd, you say that you are "making my own builds, trying to just enjoy a game the way I want" - well, that's another problem. Just trying to play chill and not consistently using the better perks means you're probably going to win at below average rates, so it sounds like some of this is self-inflicted.
3rd, you're not supposed to escape all the time. Killer is supposed to be the power role and it's supposed to be hard to escape. Escape rates for solo survivors are around 40%, which is exactly what the devs consider balanced. If you're consistently getting way below that, then that means you probably need to improve yours skills. That's not meant to be insulting - the same holds true for all players, including myself. I play a lot of solo queue and as long as you don't have complete potato teammates, it feels like I have a chance to escape in a good percentage of my matches. I used to be a lot worse and would go down pretty quickly in chases, but with more play time I've gotten better at knowing how to play loops, how to string tiles together, etc. Also, playing killer helps you better understand how to counter killer strategies and learn what parts of maps are strong for survivors.
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Hey, someone who plays both sides here. I've noticed that it's really easy to play Killer right now and Survivor is miserable. I see 4ks almost every game no matter what side I play. It's gotten to the point where I feel bad just for playing killer and I usually let the last one go. It feels like you can run any build on the killer's end and win as long as you're not against a sweaty swf. And before I get told I'm a bad survivor, I can pretty consistently get 3 gen chases but I can't do much against getting proxy camped and tunneled as soon as I get unhooked. I very rarely get teammates who can run decent chases and I feel like I can't have fun on the survivor end.
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I would suggest playing an equal amount of each. Playing killer massively improved my survivor skill level as you will learn from the people you face you'll learn counters an killer limitations an strategies you can implement into your survivor games.
good luck2 -
I feel like anyone who says soloQ is the worst it's ever been never played before the action portraits were a thing, actually not knowing what anyone was doing was pure pain.
Survivor is in a weaker state RN but the real issue is people being so quick to quit, if people actually tried more the game is relatively balanced.
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According to the Devs, the desired kill rate is 60% and thats roughly where we are now. So no, the kill rates are, in fact, not too high
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What? Survivors get a 10% speed buff at the next gen after completing one? This is a thing?
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Also someone playing both sides here. I want to caution that your experience isn't everyone's.
I've not really noticed any change. I have not seen my Survivor escape rate change at all. It was actually much more common for me to escape during MFT Meta, but my escape rate is about… I'd say… 4/10 games. So, about 40%. I haven't noticed more 4ks that usual, my SWF always either is stomp or be stomped to the point I sometimes feel bad and even give my Kill, but I have seen an increase in 1-3ks lately indicating balance. A four man out is exceedingly rare. But all of this hardly matters because I win Survivor by pipping, and I have pipped just fine easily every round since the depip removal. I'm happy with this.
Meanwhile I watched my Killer winrate (I consider 2k or better a win like the Devs do, but don't really care if I only 1k) turn from about 50% of the time to 60% on all Killers I play, and since I prefer M1s and play maybe one killer above a B tier (Pinhead and I am new to him), this is a vast improvement. My games have more breathing room and I feel more free to mess up and still do OK. I haven't had many 0ks since any of these changes which is a huge improvement. Since depips are gone, I know as long as I max my power and try my best, I can still do fine and pip easily without tryharding for the 4k every time as say, Ghostface or something. I'm happy with this.
Perhaps we all just need to shift our mindset on what a "win" is?
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Are we? Source?
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Complaining about the game being killer sided while not using meta perks when killers usually do is a non sense.
That would be like me complaining because I lose a lot of matches with scratched mirror Myers or my Trapper meme build and saying that the game is survivor sided… 🤣
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No, that would be the counterpart to Pain Res. Thats what I mentioned.
Killers Goal: Hook Surivors - with Pain Res, you get 20% regression on the most completed gen
Survivor Goal: Do Gens - with "Survivor-Pain-Res", you get X% boost for the next gen.
Thats what I meant. Pain Res works that way. Do your main objective and get rewarded.
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I went to Helldivers 2 and will never look back at DBD. Playing solo queue is like being in an abusive relationship.
What everyone fails to mention about how killer-sided this game is, is the fact that kill-rates are massively depressed because nice killers don’t tunnel. Tunneling is an I-Win button. If the game was balanced around the best strategy, tunneling, kill rates would probably be around 95%. It’s insane that the killer can decide to win the game by tunnel or most likely win but not tunneling.
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This doesn’t make sense to me. You say the “kill rates are massively depressed because nice killers don’t tunnel”. If that were true, wouldn’t most matches have nice killers and provide an enjoyable experience for SoloQ survivors?
I mean, I would think that if you describe the game as an abusive relationship, I’d assume most of your matches are miserable where you face things you’d don’t like such as tunneling killers. But if the kill rates are “depressed” as you say, due to nice killers, your experience should be better than what you’re claiming, should it not?
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…..The devs release this data every 3-4 months, bro
Post edited by Sandt1985 on0 -
Ah I see
The last one was a long time ago
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8 years is an exaggeration
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25 seconds of being able to do nothing and having to cleanse 5 ruin totems. “Unfairly nerfed and people refused to adapt” this is such a terrible take but coming from you I’m not surprised. Maybe actually stop being biased and look at it from an objective standpoint.
You do remember killers just staying at the 3 gen and protecting it with eruption call of brine and overcharge? Or killers being able to hold games for a long time? Probably not because you clearly never played survivor during that time if you thought that was fair. The only reason you’re saying it’s fair it’s because it heavily favored killer.Also since you left this part out and used the “refusal to get better” card. Back then when the eruption meta started survivors didn’t have the hud so you didn’t know who was being chased. And again you didn’t know when someone was going down in solo que.
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Did you ever play against 2 or more people with 5k hours or more in one match? You'll see that the survivors will probably destroy you.
You might be right that people with less hours struggle a lot against some killers, but people with a lot of hours will put up a pretty good maybe even unwinnable fight especially if you're a m1-killer. Of course every scenario in dbd depents on addons, items, maps, killer and so on and so on, but against good players it's okay balanced, even as solo-queue.
4-man swfs probably don't even need that many hours if they are playing well as a team.
Your problem is most likely solo-queue but that's a problem for a while now and doesn't have anything to do with the killers being to strong. Solo-queue teams just don't play together very well most of the time (or at all, depending if they even do anything besides hiding lol) so they loose against any killer or tactic that needs teamplay. They'd have to give solo-queue players at least a little bit more informations like perks of the others, pings and so on aswell as make the matchmaking better. That way it would be a lot easier against killers and tactics like that and therefore more balanced.
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Aqueous...is that you?
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Imo, this game was survivor-sided until the last nerf on Dead Hard, so 7 years would be more accurate.
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eruption was stronger than 6.1 DH.
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I would say 6 at the most. 8 would imply that killer was always weak the entire dbd lifespan which isn’t true
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The thing is, a lot of people who play one side or the other - ARE NOT OBJECTIVE. So many people are biased as hell and can't approach topics neutrally. They see the thread title and immediately go in guns blazing in defense.
They do not care or agree about how bad you have it. You can ask notable killer mains. The good ones are honest and tell you they stomp 9/10 matches. The bad ones excuse themselves, make up reasons for why they lost, whether its a perk, item or SWF they believe to be Seal Team 6.
Tru3Talent was going on a random perk winstreak (his chat donated builds for him to use, often meme builds or ones that dont synergize) where he totalled I think 33 wins in a row regardless of killer, before he finally lost.
Hexy, another notable killer main was vocal every time he was live about how easy he had it when playing Killer. He never touched Blight, Spirit or Huntress. He won 99% of his matches if not all his matches as Wraith, who most people regard as B tier. This was over 5-6 months ago.
Anyways, its nothing new. This been going on for years. The back n forth.
Just wish there were more people who didn't immediately go on the defense for the role they main.
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It was on that killers that could abuse it, mainly high mobility killers, which could run around kicking every gen. However, it was mediocre on killers lacking mobility, which was almost every killer back then. Gen kicking was very weak and largely a waste of time (without perks) in the past. Also, Dead Hard made it difficult to secure downs to proc Eruption.
Killers overall were weaker for 7 years, but if you are talking about just the top tier killers, it varied depending on the patch.
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strongly disagree. Eurption was good on every single killler because they could simply just camp the 3 gen at the beginning of the match. Maps like haddonfield and RPD had ridiculous 3 gens. I remember seeing killers like Myers use it and doing fine. I said 6 at the most because once 6.1 eruption was out that’s when the tide turned. The gen kick meta was easily the worst and most boring meta in dbds history. From then to current day killer has been strong on par with survivors.
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As usual, but apparently
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That's just a skill issue if you got held hostage by a Myers, who has one of the worst chase abilities in the game and also no mobility. Skull Merchant was the only killer that could ever consistently hold a 3 gen from the start of the match.
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it seems like the developer thinks that every killer is a new trapper and every survivor is a 10k hour 4 man SWF.
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